Okay, there is some people who has extremely powerful characters because they used the enchanting/smithing/alchemy route to pimp their gear (even enchanting/smithing is just enough), and now every enemy seems too easy for them.

So I figured that after the Creation Kit comes out it would be fun if a hardcoe mod maker could create The Ultimate Dungeon. A place which is tuned to these uber-characters. Like if someone enters who isnt near the armor cap, they get one shotted by the first trash mob (khm, enemy).

The dungeon would have extremely hard bosses and would be the ultimate challenge for every champion feeling so far godlike.

If any super hardcoe mod maker is interested in this project, leave your feedback and also your general opinion about it.

Cheers!

make a 3x3 square room with five deathlords with 9999 health.

that'll show em

I had a friend whose berserker 2h Orc did something like 1500 damage a hit. I don't think that would be much of a challenge for him.

I feel sorry for the deathlords.

Seriously, I am far from pushing the limits of the game and I fought 3 Death Overlords and 2 Scourgelords at the same time in a small room and was basically untouched.

And not in the "oh no they hit me and I took like no damage" untouched, but in the "ha ha, you missed me" kind of untouched and "i kicked you ass so hard you didn't get a chance to fight" sort of untouched.

I have a Daedric mace that does over 11k base damage...so 9999 health is still weak.

I leave every thing ( clothes, money, weapons etc ) at my place then go adventuring. I sometimes take warm clothes and a sweetroll. Exploiting the game to become god is kind of redundant when I could just type tgm in the console.

A couple of dudes with uber resistances and craploads of regenerating health? Plus a weapon that does 1k dmg? Or a spell? And some nice paralyze.

The trick isn't making it challenging the trick is making it challenging and fun. Add in plausible within the setting and you are looking at a monumental task.

The most plausible way to do it would probably be armies of level 30-50 Dremora in Full Legendary Daedric Equipment and enchanted to maximize resistances. The maxed out Armor such enemies would possess would create challenging fights for guys with weapons that do 11000 damage. To damage the player you probably want to find ways to have enemies that throw around a variety of non-magical elemental effects. A player may be immune to magic or even one or two elements, but can't be immune to all of them, and elemental damage bypasses armor negating the advantage of maxed out armor.

Some Epic fights like Multiple Ancient Dragons each Breathing a different Element, supported by Seven Dragon Priests while an army of worthless Draugr charge the player lead by a number of high end Draugr, should be suitably epic. The waves of worthless Draugr allow the player to feel epic and badass while still struggling to defeat greater actually dangerous enemies.

Edit: and to ensure that this dungeon is not taken on by the faint of heart, the first room is crawling with thousands of spiders.

Edit Edit: To challenge the player in other ways you could have the player solving timed thought puzzles while fighting literally endless armies of enemies, moving parts and actually deadly traps would also serve to require the player maintain situational awareness.

This is super awesome! And the dungeon could have different wings each with its own mini-boss that get singificantly harder and harder. And the end-boss... Well the end-boss is a sweet topic. Actually, the player could fight a council of super awesome enemies while the boss pokes at him/her with powerful spells, and when every council member is dead he would descent to fight the player. Sooo many possibilities...

The nice part is that it all plays by the rules so long as we can find a way to deal elemental damage that doesn't also count as magic. It is easy to just make up a bunch of broken powerful monsters to fight, but it is so much more fun and satisfying with you play by the same rules the players play by.

I think this would be more epic outside at sunset on some large plateau or plain/valley, rather than a dungeon.

Obviously this is going to be a hidden valley with an ancient lost city in it built to be numerous epic dungeons. The epic final battle takes place on the plateaued peak of the epic mountain fortress castle of the final boss which rise above even the clouds themselves.

Not only will the epic final boss be epic beyond imagining, but they peak will be circled by a whole flight of dragons that do strafing runs on you with their breath weapon and various shout and occasionally land to take you on personally.

The battle is so epic that the clouds are electrically charged and lightning cascades up and down the mountain and shoot up over the mountain and across the battle field, the earth quakes under the force of your blows, the hurricane winds whip you around the battlefield and freeze you, and the sheer power of it all rips the heavens asunder and fire and brimstone rain from the sky as heaven bleeds.

It's impossible to balance. Are you going to scale it to the player who played the game legitimately and has all the best gear? Or the person who abused alchemy and crafted 9999999999999999999999999 damage weapons? Because both are possible, but only one I have any respect for.

Also good luck to you, sounds like a hell of a task.

This.

Possibly the option of taking on the Daedric Princes themselves. Or the ghost of Talos Septim. Dragonborn versus Dragonborn!

Or maybe an army of clones. Like the shadow warrior in shivering isles. 25 clones. That way its hard nomatter how strong u are. ? U hit 600 they hit back 600.

Personally, I don't like when I have to fight a boss as well as others at the same time. I prefer to have to fight through a dungeon getting progressively harder, and then the boss and I duke it out alone in the final room.

There are limits to the abuses in this game. Not only do the loops to improve equipment max out due to diminishing returns, but armor beyond a certain point is meaningless. The premise of this mod is to challenge those that intentionally abuse the system, but due to system limitations those that don't intentionally abuse the system also stand a chance if they try hard enough. If I have any say in this mod the enemies will follow the same rules the player does. As such most NPC's probably won't more than 1000 hit points, though their armor is likely to be maxed out with at least one resistance high enough to make them immune to at least one element. I have a feeling fighting most enemies that are intended to be a challenge would be like a game of Rock Paper Scissors, where the players, no matter how badass, will find that enemies are basically immune to anytime but what they don't have proper resistances for, and the "weakness" will probably kill the enemy fairly quickly.

That said I think challenges that don't involve combat stats will be a big thing, puzzles, stuff that requires intelligence, situational awareness, and reflexes will hopefully be what makes it great.

Edit:

Part of the premise of this is that you are so powerful that most enemies are just scenery, Decorations, and a distraction for those that can't focus and see the true goal. You may be dueling the boss while an army swarms you, and dragons rain fire down upon you, but that army and those dragons are just there to look cool and tell a story, the only person you are really fighting is the boss the army and dragons can't do enough damage for you to even notice and will die by the score should you even glance at them.

I started over from scratch and made a mage using no alchemy, smithing, or enchanting for a real challenge. Sadly, once I took the destruction impact perk, the challenge went out the window again. Sure it takes me a ton of lightning bolts to bring down a dragon on master, but who cares when that dragon NEVER gets a single breath attach out due to being stun locked.

How does this tactic fair against 10 enemies?

Considering the concept of the mods I would recommend that anyone playing a mage get some kind of mod to make magic scale with skill like weapon and armor skills.