Lets take a look at Fallout 3, the game that had SO much hinting towards romantic sub-plots but never fulfilled them.

When growing up in Vault 101 you have your best friend Amata. While growing up you have the various options to help Amata, now, what angered me is that the goodbye scene at the Vault door could of been so much more, it was hinted that a male wanderer had feelings for Amata but this was never fulfilled. Even worse during the return to Vault 101 there is NO emotional impact at all! the wanderer simply "doesn't care" which is what annoys me the most.

Then, at the end of Broken Steel, its pretty obvious that Sarah Lyons has feelings for the wanderer, yet this is not branched out on at all, frustrating. Also there are many, MANY, more characters in Fallout 3 that scream romance sub-plot potential such as Sydney or Butch.

And, unlike New Vegas, Fallout 3 had no mods that added to this at all.. the lone wanderer was always well, alone.

Now, lets move onto New Vegas... the one time Bethesda got companion character development right! sort of.. although I'd go as far to say that was Obsidians influence.

I mean, they had romance sub-plot potential there to rival Mass Effect! They had Cass and Arcade for Males and Veronica and Boone for Females, hell, you could even say Raul would of had potential, I mean, his story is one of the best things in New Vegas!

Again, it flirted with the idea and nothing came of it.

Now, Willow came out for PC, the best companion mod in New Vegas and when Willow came out.. it was kind of a proof of concept that Romance sub-plots DO work well in open world games and can be entirely optional at the same time.

Now, lets go to Skyrim.

So much potential especially with the Marriage system, however, we all know Skyrim's marriage is a sham. It makes no sense at all! there is no romance there no character development.. its pathetic..

Now, lets fast forward to Dawnguard and look as Serana.. I mean come on, SO MUCH wasted potential there.. it was pretty obvious that a romance sub-plot could of easily been put there. Serana is not just popular because of her rack but because of her character, one of the best written Bethesda characters ever and they do not expand on it at all.

Again, it was up to a modder to prove that Romance subplots can work in an open world game and be entirely optional.. Vilja is possibly the most greatest mod for Skyrim simply because it offers this.

So, my main point is, in Fallout 4 or the Next Elder Scrolls.. we need to have a proper romantic sub plot, honestly, it is a good idea.

I think it's not late for Skyrim either... they could make it a substantial part of an add-on. And yes I agree that Skyrim lacks the romantic involvement, marriage is a rushed feature.

Well, there is a bit of romance in the "Book of Love" quests. It's not much, but it's something.

Romance is something I can never see Bethesda pulling off successfully. Romance subplots are the kind of things that need to be done really well, and I mean BioWare well, things like "oh you brought me a mammoth tusk let's get married!" won't quite do.

But reality is, when you combine "Bethesda" with "good writing" you are essentially dividing by zero.

Saying its rushed is being kind.. personally I think it was added in as a token to keep people like me from bringing up this point that I have made.


The problem is though is that in New Vegas they could of pulled it off, I don't know if that was because they had Obsidians help or not though. But a good percentage of the couriers companions had romance material.. I have to wonder if Male Courier and Cass was a cut romance as there was ALOT hinting towards it.

While I'm a svcker for good romance... games that feature it have never really had "good" romances. Mainly because game writers aren't very good at the writing part.

If someone could figure out how to make them less cheesy, then I'd be happy. But, fat chance in hell of that happening. Also, go over to BSN's ME3 boards and look at the character romance sub-forum. It's locked due to breeding psychotic mouth breathers. Would rather that didn't happen here.

Adding a romance sub-plot for every marriage candidate in skyrim would be a LOT of work, and also may even cause alot of issues.. now if there were only few marriagable people in Skyrim, i could actually see that happening, but with the current variety, i actually think its better like it is now ...but thats just me

NO BIOWARE ROMANCES IN TES OR FALLOUT, THANK YOU

The marriage mechanic is just fine as it is. Better to leave it out completely than introduce the priiiiize.

The Marriage mechanic is a joke, and why do you not want Romance? if you don't then don't screw the rest of us out of it because all Romance plots in Western RPGs are optional. Skyrim cannot have a romance without mods now simply because of the stupidity of the marriage mechanic. Its a joke.

Give me one solid reason why romance would be bad. I cannot see why it is bad and it has been proven twice now via mods that romance can be put into open world games just fine.

Like it or not Bioware has set a standard and any western RPG without a proper romance sub-plot is always going to be considered inferior to those who do.

The way I see it, Beth just threw it in for RP purposes. There's no reason to have a Mass Effect romance in TES.

Agreed. The writing is cheesy enough in most areas. We don't need more cheesy writing and horribly programmed gameplay to go along with it.

Romance in Bioware games is so stupid, not saying that Skyrim's isnt stupid, but Bioware romances are, just, plain, dumb.

Its like
Person 1: Hey
Person 2: yo
P1: sup
P2: nm
P2: ohh yeah can you help me with this dumb problem?
P1: sure
P2: thanks
*sometime after stupid problem is done*
P2: thank for helping me out.... lets have six!!!
P1: OK

HUR DUR DUR DUR DUR

I would rather have the bare bones thing we have in Skyrim, then have them spending time on making something just a dumb, but that takes time away from other parts of the game.

Not for me thankyou, I'm far too into adventuring to be distracted by romantic sub plots.

Still a better love story than Twilight?

At least in DA:O it wasn't. Giving gifts was a bit of an exploit but if you did everything manually through speech it was quite a climb to get along with, say, Leliana. Granted, DA2 and ME3 have turned into a total bisixual orgy, so BW quality has certainly been in decline I give you that.

...Thanks for the review. It's always good to know which games to avoid. I mean it. Seriously.

...That said, I don't think the concept of romance in a game is a bad thing. If it's not forced upon you, if there are many to choose from, if gender is irrelevant and if it's well done. And also, romance =/= in-game six scenes.

DAO was ruined by the "having six in the middle of camp while everyone else from your party was in the camp also" thing.

Isn't that a understood?

I mean, it is mathmatically impossible to be worse then twilight.

and yes, i do mean what I said, math proves it.

i dont mind either way personally, but i would prefer if beth either scraqed marrige or made it decent, just leaving it as is is annoying and it seems rather...i dont want to say unprofessional, but a developer needs to finish up their game before shipping it out (even extending the release date would be better). i just think features should be fleshed out or left out

Because video game romances live somewhere between lame and the creepiest hinterlands of the uncanny valley.

Because you don't need cheesy romance subplots to define your character in Bethesda games where you have a lot of freeform roleplay possibilities. Bioware should dump them, too, and concentrate on letting people define their PCs and gain replayability by having actual branching choices in mission quests.

There's two for you.