Depends on the players that show up when/if it goes f2p completely. One of the reasons I really hoped that Zenimax would go with a sub was the "players" I ran into on other f2p games. Not exactly the most story oriented, invested in the game type of player. Mostly the kind of player that made me quit, actually. Which was easy, because there was nothing there to attempt to keep my interest/loyalty. It was free, what did I care? Needing to buy keys, better weapons, armor, mount, whatever, with real money didn't help.

If the content is there, and I'm invested in the game, *and* I have a sub, I'm far more likely to stay. The fact that I can buy a name change, or someone else can buy rainbow stripes for their horse if they want isn't the same to me and doesn't bother me. It isn't the same as wanting/needing to buy keys to open loot or upper tier weapons and armor that otherwise you'd spend days grinding to get, if you were extremely lucky.

Wrong, people milked out by Blizzard despise the monthly amount they will spit in ESO's face for their insolence in imitating Blizzard.

And I have also very very many mixed feelings about the amount, and the general response from the internet except these halls on bethsaida is scoffing saying: Oh well another mmo fail inc.

Again, payment model does not dictate the success of a MMO. The content of it does.

Btw, if WoW goes F2P, ESOs business plan was just perfect, WoW obviously gets all free to play players.

the community plays a big role in its success

the sub or no sub and pay to win cash shop plays a role in its success

the content of the mmo plays a role in its success

there's many factors that play a role

from what I have seen its like creating a real living world. it's as if an mmo takes on a life of it's own. it seems to almost come alive .. even if there aren't many people in it .. it still seems to feel exciting and alive. I just cant see any "one" specific factor playing a role in an mmo's life or death.

The payment model of an MMO can certainly dictate the success of it, despite its content.

You have a point. I suppose I should have specified that payment model alone does not dictate whether an MMO will fail or not.

Thanks for that.

It can partially dictate the success of it, yes. But not entirely. Just because ESO is going to go P2P does not necessarily mean it'll go F2P in a year or two. It depends on the content of the game, the community, etc. If the game is worth paying for, and people enjoy it, people will pay for it for a long period of time.

You're right.

P2P games at least have a chance to be good MMO's.

B2P and F2P MMO's have never been one.

You assert a lot based on nothing.

you get what you pay for, if I buy a good lawnmower from a pawn shop for 16 dollars cause the guy didn't like the color and it runs for 5 years with no problems then I got a rare gem, and I got lucky and it was great

i found morrowind second hand in a store for 6 dollars (used copy) in fall of 2001, xbox version. i played it to death and still play it even to present day. (not the same copy and i eventually got the GOTY version for PC, but you get the idea)

now you can go right now and get a loan for 45,000 and get a Great Dodge power ram Truck and find out its junked engine or some crap. i have seen Traucks come off the delivery truck that had no reverse and couldn't be pulled off the truck cause it wasn't made right. and that was a bran new truck!

i have played mmo's that were terrible and were pay to play subscription. and ive played fairly good F2P mmo's.

i guess it just something that happens to mmo's that makes them great but i just cant seem to put my finger on what it is that makes it so great.

if eso fails .. ill be shocked and somewhat disbelief for quite a while. how could anyone not like elderscrolls?