What Does Meaningful Pve mean to you? When i say Pve i mean the dungeons, and maybe specifically the last one the community can go through in the story line before more content comes out. I know this is a very broad statement; but to me it means pride, accomplishment, that awesome feeling you get right at the moment of victory, maybe its doing something in game that not every guild can do.

Meaning this: when you ask someone in game about the final dungeon, or read about it on the forums, only to find out a small amount of guilds have completed it. So when you are on your way to meet up with your guild you see some players walk by you in armor, and weapons you have never seen before. So you ask the nearest person what was that armor. They answer by saying ooh that is the armor, and weapons from the final dungeon. (these armors and weapons are not the uber i kill you weapons) So when your guild finally takes the final dungeon down your guild is placed on a different level from the rest. Morale goes up and everyone that was involved feels like did we just do that? When you go to turn in your quest you get the armor that those people were wearing or from the final dungeon through drops. Now everyone sees your guildmates wearing the armor and they know where you got it from. Everyone knows this guild has some sort of talent in the guild to be able to complete that final dungeon. On top of that when your guild tries to put that final dungeon on farm status its still difficult to complete. Just because your guild beat it once and you are now wearing the armor or weapons from that dungeon does not mean you should be able to face roll the keyboard in that dungeon for the rest of your career in ESO. I think it should still be difficult to do, meaning you have to actually teach your fellow guild members how to complete it. I also fully believe that not all guilds should be able to complete it. At least not without help from people who have. Why is it so bad to seek help from the community? Like omg, maybe hiring mercs, guides, or raid leaders? That is what Pve final dugeon material is all about right? Community, Opportunity, Fun, and a sense of accomplishment? I might be too old school about this or just reaching when i say this but; If you do not have the skill or know how, figure it out right?

I do not do a lot of Pve, but in the past i have. Just probably not to the extent some of you all have. What makes the dungeons or the final dungeons special to you all? Reading through these forums about pvp and getting to know what you guys like about that made me think about this thread. PvP to me has to be meaningful and to me it goes hand in hand with Pve. If everyone completes the dungeons, and final dungeons with a face roll of the keyboard kills it. Especially the final dungeon and boss. What are your thoughts ladies and gentlemen? What do you think of mine?

We know Cyrodil is meaningful PVP, but we dont know if PVE is tied to Cyrodil, so whole game is kinda meaningful. it might be PVE helps your faction at winning in Cyrodil. Crafters are needed to supply gears to guys in Cyrodil, thats one at least.

wasnt asking or saying pve was tied to cyrodil i was mainly explaining what makes pve meaningful to me.

Well, craft items to guys in Cyrodil makes it meaningful for me.. Ive no doubt I pick one craft class and do some crafting once a while and of course I sell them to some good PVPers.

I'm with the OP on this one. Meaningful pve to me means challenging content that creates a sense of pride and accomplishment once you complete it. I cannot stress that enough because there are very, very few MMOs that present that these days. I dislike the everyone must be able to see everything ideology that developers seem to have embraced, I believe that MMOs should offer a variety of challenges that will keep players engaged and that doesn't necessarily mean it should take 25-40 players to pull it off, challenging content designed for only 4 players that are at the top of their game in skill, talent progression and gear also should be present. If players do not get to see inside a challenging dungeon because they haven't put in the work then that's how it should be. I'm not being elitist because I doubt very much that I'd be one of them, I played WoW for 8 years and never saw the inside of the Black Temple back in BC days because my guild wasn't good enough, that's fine, that's how it should be.

I was never huge on raiding but not once did I think that I should be able to experience the content that raiders do, I don't want ESO to go down the same overly casual path that WoW has taken. If someone is rocking some armour, mount or a weapon that I know comes from a very challenging dungeon or difficult encounter then I tip my hat to the guy or girl and say well done. I don't clamber on to the forums and whine that I don't have one so nerf it. We need that level of pride and satisfaction back in MMOs. I know that the EQ Next developers are heading in that direction because they've basically said as much, I hope that Zenimax Online also recognise the current state of the MMO genre too.

To win at Cyrodil is huge challenge, probably greatest one that people have seen in a while. Everybody who've played Planetside 2 knows how great it feels to win against 2 faction. If PVErs helps at that, it should be for them too. Of course you guys can continue your Crusade against PVP, but not all of us.

I don't really do a lot of PvE apart from dungeons ( didn't even do Zul'Gurub or Molten Core in the vanilla cause I was PvPing- mostly cause I was too young to stay up late where most raids took place ). But I agree with you on how it should be if I played it. And I actually might do it this time.

Meaningful PvE for me is challenging but satisfying content, both at end game and whilst levelling up, use of tactics and strategy as well as adapting to unpredictable situations efficiently and being victorious in large battles, with the combined effort of friends and guildees.

I havn't found an MMO that has delivered this for many years, since The Burning Crusade in wow I think, all MMOs since that have had truly boring, simple and dull end game Pve. All in all I want PvE that brings a guild and community together and makes it stronger through workmanship.

Dull comes from all wikis and game guides - you just need to follow advices. The meaningfull is when you got your own satisfaction from dealing with unknown.

Sure you can not turn off wikis, so only possible is to make game less predictable. But this is not clear if people will really like unpredictable challenges, really might prefer mechanical playing in long period of time.

Also all types of rankings provide way to measure palcing in game community.