Fixed!

But seriously, wasn't it possible to cast spells in oblivion while having arms/stuff in both hands? Granted, you still used you're hands to cast, but we all know how crazy magic was in that game... (practically every class was using magic >.>)

Edit: still, would be cool to see your magic change for hand-based to something else (focussing it through your actual weapon for example..) as you advanced in magical skills..

If im not mistaken oblivion had hot keys you could equip spells to, you hit the key, spell shoots/happens, and you go back on your merry way, choppin or shootin [censored] or whatev, no need to equip anything.

I liked that. As far as the hands BS goes, no just no.

OP, I agree. Personally, I'd like my character to do it with his toes.

WIN! BETHESDA TAKE NOTES HERE

imagine imbuing your arrows with the magic you know how sweet would that be? or charging up your two-hander with fire for that finishing move on the Elder dragon

Might consider agreeing with that except we have enchanted weapons that do the same thing. As for the bringing out your hands, that brings balance to the game in my opinion. For example in Oblivion I became overpowered (600 everything) and could kill just about anything with one spell...that I should have named Avada Kadabra...anyways by not having to ready my hands like I would in Morrowind, or not having to hold a spell in one hand and charge it there was no consequence to being a primarly spell based character.
Really the current system with the magic is the best thing they could do.

Traditionally, in RPG games, hands were not needed for ALL spells. Spells would have either a vocal component, a physical component (eye of newt, wing of bat, etc), or a 'motion' component (waving your hands, certain postures, etc), or any combination of the three.

Skyrim just simplifies that. After all, we have no silence spells/effects, we don't have to have certain ingredients in our inventory to cast certain spells, we just use our hands. I personally would like a more diverse system, but alas, it is not to be.

Yeah this is completely unrealistic... oh wait!

HEY GUYZ

I'MA TRY ARGUE OVA SOMN DAT AIN'T REAL WITH LOGIC.

CUZ DATS WHAT IT IS. LOLZ


Goodbye, thread.

bad, stupid, not good, no, not really, better not, dislike, disagree.

When people talk about 'realism' and 'logic' in RPGs, what they're actually talking about is 'internal consistency'. In that respect, yeah, there's actually something about which to argue, if you cared enough to do so.

I don't.

I don't like to praise Oblvifail, but casting was much better in that game. It wasn't nearly as awkward and fiddly as Skyrim's gimmick dual wielding/casting system, and you there were never any issues on you being able to block with the weapon in your other hand, should your magic fail to stop your opponent.

edit - Also, even Daggerfall's casting system was less irritating than Skyrim's

I prefer my spells to come out off my nose.

That way I can kill things without using my hands, and it would keep my sinuses clear.

Of course, there would be a problem with burned nose hair.

Guess I could submit an Environmental Impact anolysis (EIA) for the Jarls approval - wonder who has a copy of the 813 form I need. Sigh, I hate paperwork.

Completely disagree with OP. For spells of the "cast spell" type, hand gestures is what is gone for, has always been used before in other fantasy, and works really well from a balancing standpoint. Plus it looks natural.

In other dice RPGs I've worked with other types of spells as well. Runes (hand still needed to "prep" them), meditational/prayer based (not suitable for the "common gamers" here), verbal (we have shouts), ritualistic dancing (druid like, takes far to much time for the "common gamer"), scroll based (verbal/instant, but still need to hold the scroll), and staff based (need to "fire" it, just as we do here).

So we have hand gestures, shouts, scrolls, runes, and staff. From a CRPG POV, I'd say most bases are actually covered as far as "non tedious" casting methods are covered. I think we lack a bit on how magicka is "sourced", but with regenerative magicka (hail "common gamer"! ), that's not something to spend time on either. You should really see a complex magic system in action. It's not, this...

That's pretty much the same as an archer have to endure. With the exception that archery feels overpowered so you don't really need anything else. Learn to use the hotkeys, as an archer relying somewhat on Alternation, I have no issues using spells while using the bow. We both are chicken standoff fighters for as long as possible. You chose to live the life as a double casting mage, now deal with the consequences of not being a spellsword - isn't consequences something we want?

Well, what i meant with "focussing it through your weapon" was more along the lines of being able to point a darn dagger at someone and zap them instead of having to switch between dagger and bare hands with spells.
Could also be a combination of skill level in daggers/one handed/ two handed and magic school level. (Lvl 90 destruction + lvl 90 one handed = sword that acts as magical staff and sword..)
Just add a modifier button.. (left mouse = bock/left strike, right mouse = right strike, Alt+left mouse = magical blast left (for high level alteration + shield?), Alt+right mouse = Magical strike right (lightning strike from sword?))
Or make those a separate button, since alot of PC mice have thumb-buttons these days.. edit: Lol, can't believe i suggested going back to the Oblivion "spell button"

heh Almost convinced myself to post this in a Mod request-forum

I'm a battlemage, and i shouldn't have to pause the game in the middle of a fight in order to de equip the spell in my left hand, in order for me to be able to block with my sword.

And yes, i am more than familiar with hot keys, which automatically equip to your right hand.

Greater powers don't use any sort of action to cast, and this is exactly why I'm glad you need to use your hands or some sort of action to cast a spell. You can only use greater powers once a day, so it's kind of hard to notice, but I think they're kind of boring with the lack of a casting option. There are only certain spells that I think look cool without an action. For example, Night Eye lesser power.

Friends, I have come up with a brilliant solution.

Instead of hands, I'd like some spells to be shot out from the eyes. Just like cyclops in x-men. Right now, I feel like Havoc (cyclop's brother) with everything coming out of my hands.

Spells already dont need preparation, or reagants, and they're cast from an endlessly regenerating source of magicka. You really think it would be okay to make it so you can dual wield/sword and board at the same time?

In Oblivion multiclassing was completely horribly overpowered, I'm glad there is some balance back in Skyrim. It encourages people from making characters other than a battlemage, which was the most used class if Youtube videos are anything to go by.

I agree with the OP, if the point is that you should be able to cast spells through mage weapons like staffs, daggers, wands, and scepters (maces). You can in any other RPG I've played. In all the D&D based games (Baldur's Gate, Neverwinter Nights), and in action hack-and-slash RPG's like Dungeon Siege, Titan Quest, Diablo, and Sacred, the mage or cleric simply waves the weapon around as part of the somatic component of the spell. The weapon can be imagined to be pointed at the target point of the spell upon completion. When a cleric in a D&D game carrying a shield and mace casts, the games sometimes animate spells by making them disappear momentarily, as though the caster had dropped them to the ground, but the game does you the courtesy of having them picked back up again as soon as the spell completes. In the hack-and-slash games, the spells fire over and over through the weapon shafts.

If we have to get absolutely realistic, none of these games are, including Skyrim. There is no possible way you could carry a one or two handed weapon, a quiver, a shield, AND a longbow (4 to six feet long). Archers kept daggers or shortswords in sheaths for emergencies, and held their bows. If an enemy closed to melee range, they either had to run or throw the bow down on the ground and try to defend themselves with their dagger/sword. There was no such thing as a back sheath for long weapons or shields. If you wanted to travel or move with a long weapon, you carried it in your hands. If you wanted to do anything else but walk (eat, use the bathroom, read a book or scroll), you had to put it down on the ground somewhere. You couldn't sheath a one-handed axe or mace, either, unless you stuck the handle through a loop and had the head of the weapon up. That meant you had to have two hands to get out and into position. (Think about it - you can't grab an axe by its head without risking injury to your hand - you would have to grab the shaft with one hand and push up, then grab the shaft with the other hand and use both hands to get the weapon positioned correctly in your right hand.) That meant you couldn't draw it with a shield strapped to one of your arms. Basically you had to carry both the shield and the axe/mace everywhere.

You couldn't get in and out of armor easily either. Just using the bathroom was a huge problem. Getting a fighter in and out of plate required at least two people!

All RPG's require a hefty amount of suspension of disbelief in order to work. The player should be able to have fun with a minimum amount of unnecessary clicking. Skyrim's empty-hands-required-to-cast-spells system needlessly burdens the player with unnecessary clicking.

Yeah, i mean why not feet

Imagine eating without the use of your hands and just staring at the food... Doesn't make sense, right? Much like magic being casted by just standing or not doing anything...

You know, I'd like a game where you used your feet to cast magic spells. At least it would be different. Dance-offs would be epic, and provide their own light show.

There`s a reason for everything.

Everything has a limitation. just as a warrior needs hands to hold a sword or ax, so a wizard has a limitation of needing hands for spells. Why?

1. To direct a spell.
2. As part of the spell cast formula (not needed in Skyrim, but some Sorcrery lore stories require it).
3. To create a psychological effect even without casting anything. You can technically scare off 10 warriors waving your hands before a single spell is cast.
4. That`s just how the gods want it or its a natural limitation of existence.

I`ll bet if spell casting and magic were real, NATURE would have some kind of limitation like you must use your hands. hands cut off- bad luck, as with everything.

Also, EVERYTHING has a LIMIT or REQUIREMENT, even magic. If there were no limits then wizards would simply rule the world and enslave everyone else- the gods would no doubt put limits down just to prevent that!


I suppose next, someone will ask `Why even use your mouth?`

I want to shoot flames out of my nord's boobies.