Hello,

I hope this doesn't upset too many people ... please move this thread to the appropriate forum if I made mistake.

After trying to enjoy Skyrim since it's release, I have finally given up and so have tried Oblivion for the first time. Although I had put probably 200 hours into Skyrim, the majority of the time I was rerolling characters and testing mods, attempting to make the game enjoyable. I will list a few here so I can make comparisons between Skyrim and Oblivion;

Skyrim Pros;

• Magic spells effects and melee animations are improved.
  
• Gorgeous graphics and art-design (on my GTX 580 with texture mods)
  
• Beautiful landscapes and more varied 'appearing' dungeons.
  
• I think the Menu UI is better than Oblivion - the default UI is perfect with an Xbox Controller, then you have Sky UI if PC user wants to Keyboard/Mouse.
  
• More cinematic
  
• Quests are ok, Thieves Guild was brilliant but the rest was forgettable and the MQ an abomination. Dragons are too easy to take seriously.
  
• Perk-System is a very good addition, I love it.

Skyrim Con

• Destruction magic weak.
  
• Dungeons extremely simple - There is one path and you follow it. No exploration.
  
• Dragons are obsolete - too easy, I can kill one at level 8. Why need Dovakhiin if anyone with rudimentary sword kills can take one down? They should have required you have enough skills (level 25ish) to even attempt the MQ.
  
• Apparently there is a Civil War... but wouldn't have known if someone didn't tell me. Barely anyone speaks about it, no-one has been effected (no grieving people, orphans outside that one place with the Thieves Guild) and there is no civil war fighting occurring in the land. No burnt down villages. Civil War was an afterthought.
  
• Unique Loot is weak.
  
• Smithing makes stronger weapons than loot found making loot finding redundant.
  
• All enemies too easy, no challenge.
  
• Game lacks believability. Although it is a fantasy-world, I shouldn't be a master of all the guilds and moreso I have no goals after becoming the master ... What would I like to achieve? I'm just the boss for bragging rights. Also sword/shield and heavy armor Arch-Mage? LOL
  
• No consequences to my actions - Actions at X don't effect Y.
  
• QUESTS ARE BORING.
  
• Gold is pointless because you have too much of it and nothing to spend on because the vendors loot is scaled.
  
• Environment lacks variation. I know its supposed to be cold and snowy gloomy but comparing to Oblivion it would be nice to not feel doom and gloom ALL THE TIME. The game does such a good job at making Skyrim seem miserable, I feel emotionally flat all the time.

Conclusion.

Skyrim is a perfectly shaped orange. It looks beautiful (landscapes, combat, UI) but is actually just a shell which when squeezed, collapses with no juice.

Level-scaled, underpowered dungeon and vendor loot juxtaposed to smithed/enchanted loot make dungeon exploration meaningless other than for story progression. However, the stories are not that interesting in my opinion making exploration a chore especially when coupled with simplified one-route dungeons and easy enemies. Also there is no story to most dungeons so why explore them if you've already seen it? You know you won't find any good loot because it's scaled to your level.

If you don't mind the easiness, lack of reward (never no good loot because it's scaled) and lackluster quests and just enjoy killing stuff then you will enjoy Skyrim. It is a fun hack and slash game. I don't mean to be condescending, the quests are OK but this game is all about running around killing stuff with your overpowered perks, shouts and smithed equipment. Mods on the PC can get around the majority of this but the uninteresting quests cannot be changed nor can the gloomy atmosphere.

Don't get me wrong I like Skyrim, however the Cons really let it down.

First Impressions of Oblivion

I have only played 6 hours so I can be well off the mark.

Pros

• Lively music.. makes you feel like an explorer/adventurer and it's upbeat and beautiful. Not depressing all the time like Skyrim.
  
• There is a certain charm about the game because it doesn't take itself too seriously..
  
• A lot of landscape variations.
  
• EXCITING quests!! - I have done a few Thieves Guild quests and I like the fact I have to WORK to earn my rank and have to USE THIEF skills in order to do it. I have also done a few miscellaneous quests and the writing is phenomenal. You never know what to expect and you actually want to find out what happens next. Anyone who has done Kvatch will know what I mean and the Dreamworld Amulet.
  
• Money is hard to come by (at least at the moment). You can't have 10k gold just clearing one dungeon like in Skyrim.
  
• Enemies are tougher.
  
• Dungeons are more complex, deeper and contain unique loot.
  
• Cities seemed lived in.
  
• More unique loot.
  
• Gold is valuable because there is unleveled loot at vendors and expensive spells/items to buy.
  
• Level progression is slower and levelling don't give you uber powerful perks that the enemies don't have. No level 20 character in 6 hours like Skyrim.

Cons

• Not graphically as impressive as Skyrim.. with texture mods and special shaders you can get it 80% to Skyrim's level but it is not all the way there. But it looks better than most Xbox games and I have an Xbox. I am not a PC elitist, I play BF3 and other games on Xbox all the time.#
  
• Level-scaling this is really annoying to be honest. Enemies scale more to you than Skyrim so you don't feel like you're getting much stronger. (I will find a mod to sort this).
  
• Some people complain about the voice acting but I like it although strange at time but it adds to its character imo.

FINAL CONCLUSION

In my opinion, so far I would say that if you can overlook Oblivions graphics (easily done if you have a good PC with mods) and can sort out the level scaling then Oblivion is the better game. Skyrim looks better, Oblivion plays better.

I have put a lot of time into this so please don't see it as a troll thread. You think I would write this much if I was.

I do not think that Bethesda listens to fans or modders , they mostly listen the praises and prizes they get from magazinenreviewers and bloggers .... Those publicize their game , we dont compared to them.... So when they see all the prizes and stuff probably they think they are going the right direction with the oversimplification and dumbing down of the game.... But this road leads only to the dragonage 2 emulation .... That costed a massive drop of the title that mutated from a very good gdr to a pretty bad tekken like game....

And most of this is due to consollization of the market....

I know. The whole point of leveling up is so you can get stronger. "Hey there is a group of enemies at this location that keeps killing me. I know. I'm going to level up some so I can be more evenly matched so I can fight them better. If that doesn’t work then I'm going to level up so I'm stronger than them" That is my incentive too level up. So I can get stronger.

But the leveling system Oblivion and Skyrim uses defeats and ruins the whole point of leveling up. What's the point of doing it when you have enemies that are scaled around you? There is no incentive at all because there are no enemies you have to be higher up to fight and you don't get stronger.

What I really hate is that I have too be at certain level for weapons and armor too appear. What really pisses me off is that quest items are leveled around your current level. So if i get something at level 10 and now I'm level 15-up. It's completely useless.

I wish Bethesda would go back too the system Morrowind uses.

Its interesting to see how every time a new TES game comes out, the forums (in general) consider it worse than the last.

For all the rest, I can see your point. However, the Civil War (IMO) couldn't be talked about MORE.
Pretty much everywhere you go, people are talking about the war. Assuming you go from Helgen to Whiterun... the first 45 minutes of the game or so are about Dragons and the Civil War. It drops off a little after that sure, but if it didn't I know I for one would be pissed.

Destruction isn't weak at all... until after maybe skill 60. If you compare say enchanting + destruction vs. smithing + one handed at SIMILAR skill levels you see that destruction pretty much outdamages melee at all points up to around skill 60. Especially when you consider AoE effects.

Once you get to 60+ THAT'S when the problems start. Your melee skills increse even faster than they did early, while the relative costs of offensive magic SKY ROCKET. Compare novice flame v flesh spells in cost. Flesh is nearly twice as expensive. Once you hit expert they are nearly the same cost. This mean that it's just not realistic to throw expert level spells around like you should.

Given the difficulty of even casting master destruction spells it only gets worse as you level up more. This doesn't happen at all with melee. You only get more powerful.

So yeah... I'll give you that at skill 60+ destruction starts to fall off... but it's just not true earlier than that.

Same for me, whats the point of working hard to level only to realise you only need to go though a single level up to defeat those enemies inside, what also ticks me is the smithing is so messed up that most people only use them to level up, i mean only five heavy and light armors, in a world were you can fight dragons and slay giants, i only require a whole of 10 armor types that aren't even suited to my terrain i mean look at studded and scalded armor do you really expect me to go to the coldest provenience wearing that?

Nords are very tolerant of cold. Since they are the ones making the armor, it makes a lot of sense that they wouldn't bundle up like other races would need to. In short, it's not their problem if other races are cold. I see your point though, that it's silly that no one ELSE makes armor that's warm... but Nords don't need it, and wouldn't make it.

Just sayin.

If bethesda could heard their fans....

Actually not ....

Everytime , especially this last time the forum got filled with newbies and beth entusiasts that probably play hundreds of games ... Once their entusiasm finished , the really devoted fan and adoring fans have migrated to adore other games and be fans ofnother developers.... The ones who stand instead are the true lovers of the seires , the modders and the hardcoe players .... Especially the ones that remember morrowind.....


That should be a title of a signature for every tes lover.....


Bethesda : remember morrowind