What can I say? I'm a svcker for obsessive compulsive game exploits?

I guess it was three toons ago (I play Dead-is-dead, so I'm not ALL about the 'powergaming' exploits) I realized I could 'train' using my new found tutorial 'friend' . . . my last toon had leveled up to about Level 2 when she left Helgen Keep undercroft . . .

But this time I "did it right!"

Latest character (this one is gonna be a keeper I just know i!): male Altmer "Sienwe" focused on Destruction magic. Just left Helgen Keep for the first time:

Level 7 (maybe 6 don't recall for certain)
210 Magicka (with the robe/hood)
120 Health

Destruction 40

I realize I could have just used the console to accomplish essentially the same thing, but then I wouldn't have put in the time and it would feel 'cheap.' This way it feels legit

So, there must be some mod out there that makes it impossible to exploit this right?

ADDIT: and a second question about Dawnguard -> is it better to install this _after_ you have attained a certain level?

I noticed on a previous playthrough that when I hit level 10, one morning when I came out of Faendal's hut there was a Master Vampire and some damn infernal 'hound' attacking Riverwood . . . just slightly annoying given vampires are supposed to be stealthy buggers that sneak into people's houses and drink their blood: Decimate all the NPCs = no more human blood for vampires!

I'm hoping that recurrent vampire attacks that steadily deplete the NPC population of Skyrim are not a side-effect of Dawnguard? If so, any mods or something that tweak that down to a dull roar?

No, I don't think I've seen a mod for this so far. But... wouldn't it just be easier to have some self control and simply not exploit it????

did you follow hadvar or ralof? i dont think many people know you can stop ralof early...once he cuts you loose and you fight your first imperials, quickly kill the captain and loot her before ralof does. she holds the key to the gate that ralof normally takes but if you have the key then he has to wait for you to open the gate, leaving him open to attack with your sword or flame spell and grind levels without him moving.

I don't see how you abused anything?

Ah the beauty of moral ambiguity!


and then two posts later:


@DTH: indeed "self-control" would be a _possible_ but not nearly so fun solution as a mod

I like games that contrain me into 'realistic' or at least internally-consistent dynamics. Obviously TES are far from 'realistic' in the real life sense, but . . . being able to spray an NPC tutorial hand-holder with flames for an hour in total (as a way to 'train up' Destruction) and him NEVER having fought back, nor died, is not particularly internally consistent with how he behaves/reacts IMMEDIATELY after leaving Helgen Keep.

I'm guessing that certain NPCs in the game cannot ever be killed? Else, Rolof and Hodvar are set to be 'essential' and unkillable until after comletion of the first quest, and also set not to aggress player hostility. They WILL aggress, if you hit them with a Fury spell (or at least he did before I looted his dead buddy, so maybe that was just because the "Unbound" tutorial quest had not started yet?). So it must be something that could be readily turned "off."

Pretty obvious that Bethesda has it set up that way so that new players don't accidentally get friendly-fire aggro within 5 minutes of starting the game and get discouraged. Which is a totally valid reason for the dynamic to be coded in that way. But for experienced and wiley players like me it becomes a 'forbidden fruit' that is just too hard to resist . . .

In my opinion, a mod that simply made them fight back would be adequate. Even if they cannot be killed just fighting back when you harm them would be good.

But for now, I shall enjoy my prodigy altmer who has risen to the lofty heights of Level 7 / Destruction 40 before his first steps into SKYRIM!!


I have abused both Haggar and Rolof now

You can do it pretty much at any time during the tutorial, or at least after the tutorial mission starts and until you exit into Skyrim -> you can cause damage to either one of them, they will not fight back, and they wil not die = you can "train" various offensive skills on them as much as you want.

Haven't checked to see what the Fury does if you hit them with that after the tutorial mission gets past the first stages.

I hit Rolof with Fury pretty much right after he untied me but before I looted his buddy to initiate the next stage of the sequence, so this was in the very first room in Helgen, and before the Captain and Hodvar come from the other entry series. At that stage, if he is hit will Fury he WILL fight back and kill you.

Regarding vamp attacks: they should be few and far between if you don't fast travel. If your walking everywhere and getting frequent attacks, I suggest deleting and redownloading the DLC. I feel sorry for people with that bug, it sounds really nasty

Takes awhile before you can self-restrict yourself.
In Oblivion, I was the same way... the Duping glitch was addicting o.o
also some other glitches, maybe not really beneficial but fun, I managed to make a Clone of myself and a spell that inverted my characters Colors and Brightness ._.

This was all on Console by the way.

They are, and it is the biggest criticism of the DLC. It was the first thing modders tweaked about Dawnguard and it is the main reason why I haven't purchased the DLC. I'm hoping Bethesda fixes it themselves, so I don't have to use a mod to fix it.

Anyway, in the meantime, here are a couple of mods that fix it:

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/17077

http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/21615

I've gotten myself up to level 18 once with this (Raising Sneak up to 95, One handed up to 40 and Destruction up to 25) and I probably won't repeat it.


Did not know that, I only thought Hadvor was the one who you could abuse it with. I guess Ralof works too and that gives you access to two handed weapons.

I have used them both. I do it at the point where you sneak up on the Bear. Either one, if you sneak back to where the spiders were, they will follow. Then you can have your way with them.

Thank you Pseron! You are as helpful as ever kind sir.

Wow. Bela Sanguinaire looks amazing! Thats like a whole game!!

Think I'll just use the simple one for now, until I see more of how vampires work in Skyrim. Seems like BS is more oriented toward player character vampires anyways.