So just a note for those who haven't tinkered with Smithing exploits yet. This is fairly common knowledge, but you may want to know how exactly things work behind the scenes.

Under vanilla Skyrim rules, Alchemy is the game-changer when it comes to Smithing. Fortify Smithing enchantments modify a value called "SmithingMod", which corresponds to the actual Smithing skill level (or so it seems). Improvements gained from smithing fortified by enchantments only are mild because they obey the quality increase formula which you can find on UESP.

However, Fortify Smithing potions increase a value called "SmithingPowerMod". Improvements gained from fortifying this value are percentages directly applied to the weapon's damage (or armor's value), bypassing the skill-based formula, and resulting in outrageous and potentially gamebreaking weapons and armor. Whereas the armor-derived damage resistance is naturally capped at 85%, weapon damage is not capped at all.

So, to sum it up: to break your game (for fun and profit or, au contraire, for anguish and loss - your mileage may vary), brew Fortify Smithing potions.
To not break your game, don't brew them and only use Fortify Smithing enchantments.

I sort of suspect that the two different effects are a result of oversight on gamesas's part. Or maybe not. But there you have it.

it looks like you slept in on this subject. But you are right enough.

Yes alchemy is very powerfull.
And I really hate these threads that say something broke something else.
The definition of break is to render something unable to do it's job.

So my question is how does this break anything?

Also if you don't like game exploits then don't do them.

I wonder how the OP would feel about the fortify restoration loop exploit.

If it was in the game to begin with, why call it "cheating"? Maybe some things like the Ohgma Infinium were purposely put there to see what we would do with them? Maybe.. Bethesda wanted to give us a game where we could truly feel like a demigod of sorts.

They took away your Acrobatics/Athletics, Levitation and etc. Ever think some of the things in the game were intentional as something for the fans? Especially us console players who CAN'T MOD? That's when I start to ask: "Is it really cheating?" if it's in the game and has yet to be fixed.. or SAID there would be a fix?

Honestly now..

Broken, in the sense, that a game mechanic is not working as designed or intended.

Smithing is still broken without Alchemy. Alchemy is icing on the cake but without the icing the cake is still there. With 100 Smithing, Daedric Equipment up to Legendary, the five 20% increases in armor, the 50 % increase in armor rating from the two other perks and finally the lexicon with the 25% armor rating increase. You should easily hit the max with that setup. Thankfully Smithing is optional and isn't 100% broken if you don't go that route but that's only if you don't choose the two other armor perks besides the 20% increase one. If you do choose those perks, your character's going to be pretty busted and the game will be incredibly easy on normal difficulty.


This

It breaks the game mechanics' job of ensuring a balanced game play.

I wasn't aware that a game mechanic that you have to consciously exploit in order to unbalance gameplay could be considered "broken".

If you try to stomp out all possible exploits, the game becomes more and more restrictive. TES has always prided itself on allowing the player to decide his own path. If they take it out, what will you be here a week later complaining about?

You can play the game without "fortify X" from alchemy... simply don't drink the potions. Asking for their removal, or "balancing" isn't going to make the playerbase happy. It will make a minority of players feel superior... after all, THEY didn't need the feature.

I would say that is the definition of "broken." What's the difference between a bug and an exploit? Both are unintended by the desginer, but it's the outcome for the player that seems to be the difference.

No, the difference is that a player has to consciously make use of the exploit, while the bug just occurs naturally. Players aren't accidentally doing the Circle-of-Fortifying™.

I'm pretty sure that the developers of the game knew how blacksmith potions would interact with smithing enchantments and high smithing skills/perks. I'm fairly certain they also know that there are people that like to make obscenely powerful characters that would enjoy the alchemy+smithing combo. Doesn't seem broken. If you don't want to build a worldbeater, then don't. Most of my characters are powerful enough to get by with a decent challenge. I don't complain about the available option to make them uber-powerful. I know it's there and I choose to/not to utilize it. My current mage is in the process of a "heel turn" and will become power hungry. I like having the ability to make him over powered if I want, as it would fit his development as a character.

Alchemy is not the "icing on the cake".

Fortify Smithing enchantments are the icing on the cake. Fortify Smithing potions through the cake out of the window and replace it with a cake-sized pile of heroin

And how do we know the game developers designed it this way.

When I originally posted, I thought the OP meant the fortify restoration loop, which allows you to create weapons with damage values so high that using them can cause the game to crash.

Hm, I'm only using Potions and no Enchantments to enhance my smithing skill and I have yet to make me oneshot things and hit the armor cap. Maybe because I limit myself to an Imperial Bow and Leather Armor?

So Alchemy doesn't "break the game", the player does, if he uses it on high tier items!

Or...don't use either one.

What the hell lol

I have made 4 characters that used all the exploits that I could and only the first time round did it "break" the game cause I really didn't pay attention to how high I was going.But with experimentation I have found a comfortable Lv. at which to upgrade my gear and the game feels just fine to me.I think of it as leveling the grounds for both me and NPC on master, in other words the NPC's can no longer one-hit me but I didn't go as far as being able to one-hit the NPC's either, this way I still have a challenge but not an overly frustrating challenge. Ex; my skyforge steal sword is now doing the same damage as a top tier daedric sword, and my hunting bow is doing the same as a daedric bow.

P.s. I don't see it as "breaking the game" or "cheating", it's the console version of modding By upgrading my stuff the way I do is no different then a PC player downloading a weapon mod or an armor mod.

Alchemy is a really nice way to build a hybrid character. If you zero in on a pure build like a sword and board warrior and your ONLY non fighter skill is alchemy you WILL be overpowered like crazy. Alchemy IMO is much better for either a pure thief who actually svcks at hand to hand combat because of no weapon skills or a hybrid character thats going in alot of different directions at once and needs potions to fill in gaps. I think its a fun rewarding way to branch out with less powerful character builds without fear of svcking completely but paired with an already powerful build your going to make the game a ridiculous cake walk.

I don't see the point of fortify smithing when the armour cap is 567.

How is the armor cap 567 when you can reach an armor rating of 1800-2000 in the vanilla game without exploiting the potion loop or Oahgam(not sure of spelling?) exploit??

Armor cap means that any armor rating OVER 567 does nothing for you.

The game caps physical damage reduction via armor at 80%, which corresponds to a 567 rating. Anything more than that is wasted.

Maximum damage reduction that an armor can do is 80%. That's reached when your armor rating is 567. Yes you can have armor rating much higher than that, but it does not give you any benefit.