we are getting perks- would having perks govern armour be better than skills? shureley if there are only 18 skills then sacrificing armour skills is good since then we will have room for two more skills (notably pole-arms, the other skill i am not sure of- maybe an outdoors man skill)


if i do not get my beloved spears- i will be sad. how can you fight a dragon with any other weapon? only spears have the reach and penetrating power!

I agree in the idea of perks, but I also feel that the armor types themselves should have more variety to them. For example I don't want an unarmoured fellow to somehow sustain a large portion of damage from magically just being good at taking hits from a weapon, but rather the advantage lie in the lack of armor not weighing down his movements granting a bonus to striking speed and so on.

I would be happy if they simply remove armor skills. I would aprove also if what armor skill or perks do is reduce the movement penalties that armor gives, without altering protection in any way.

It seems to me that having only one armor skill entirely defeats the purpose of having armor skills to begin with. As the main benefit of having armor skills in the game is to allows players to define what sort of armor their character should wear, and actually encourage them to wear that, instead of just wearing whatever has the best stats, regardless of whether it's leather armor or a heavy metal plate suit. If you're going to hace armor skills at all, you need to have at least light and heavy armor. Given that Bethesda has reduced the amount of skills from Oblivion and added at least one skill that wasn't in it, though, I could see armor skills getting removed. If this is the case, though I'd say replacing them with perks is a good idea, though I'd be fine with them reducing any penalties caused by wearing armor rather than actually enhancing the defense of armor. It does seem to make more sense for armor skills, or perks, to behave that way.

I think we should have to choose between armored and unarmored, if there are skills for it at all. Maybe there are no skills or even perks, just natural consequences that blends in nicely with everything else. Like, heavy metal armor lowers resistance to cold and shock and makes it impossible to swim, and light armor makes you lighter on your feet, protects better against the elements etc. I can't say I fully fell in love with the armor perks in Oblivion, and I have a hard time coming up with anything realistic.

I'm with Selbeth The Winged One on this one.

None of it ,or all the way.

Hopefully perks expand on this. Which I'm guessing they will.

I hope that there are no special armor skills for different categories of armor (light, medium, heavy).

I would prefer to see each piece of armor (leather, glass, steel, etc.) have its own weight, DT/DR, sneak penalty, agility/speed penalty etc.

No need for the armor categories and probably no need for any armor skill if there will be armor related perks.

Any skill that requires you to go to the front line and take damage in order to raise, is a bad choice IMHO.

No all the player want to play tank characters, and my agile rogue wants to wear a decent light armor without the need to raise a skill by being beaten repeatedly and punished for it.

I say remove the skills altogether and you should be able to wear any armor any time with full effect, but heavier armors could have some penalties, for agile rogues and mage concentration.

"no skills, only perks" is not an option. The perks are specifically tied to a skill.

Can you elaborate on that?

I understand you get to choose one perk each time your character levels up.

Yes but they could be tied to different skills eg. Athletics/ acrobatics could have armour encumbrance reduction perks, defensive bonuses could be perks for hand to hand/one handed attacks, so it's anoption, we won't know until more details of the skills are released.

What does the 0-100 skill level translate into? What does it modify?

Personally I would be disappointed if they remove the armor skills. Even if they just keep the heavy/light choice it would in my opinion be better than only perks. I base this on the fact that for example a master warrior should have the oppertunity to be better than anyone without the heavy armor skill.

Unarmored means you don't wear any armor at all, just clothes. I think it would make sense to keep all the armor skills...unarmored through heavy armor. Light armor is...light, and flexible, like leather, while heavy armor is....heavy, and not very flexible at all. Using one is not like using another at all IMO.

Another way to look at it is anyone can move in light armour, and gets full protection, but heavy armour, which requires practice to move at all in, is a raisable skill, with much higher DR at higher skill levels, and appropriate movement penalties. As to raising the skill through being hit, how else could you do it? At least it's a representation of how long you've worn it in combat.

This would make heavy armor a damned skill. Other form of training armor skill could be like atletics (yes both skills trained at the same time, like when you are casting and running).

How effectively you can wear the armor and how much of the overall weight is reduced while wearing the armor.

Weight of armor ties to buoyancy, speed, agility, may increase strength over time (hidden stat doesn't mean it's not there, maybe...) or you are given strength by assigning points to health, endurance, fatigue etc. Pretty much exactly the way normal (gradual) encumbrance would. When not strong enough to wear full daedric, you get natural penalties to those mentioned. So you may loose speed or block/parry abilities that might have allowed you to avoid the hit, but a blow that hits hits with the same amount - there is no "skill" involved.

A thief may not spend points on health as much as a warrior, hence his strength doesn't increase. So he goes for lighter armor to be more speedy and agile, and those features are better at preventing him from being hit.

A heavy user may excerpt features such as enchantability and duration, whereas a light user may get much better swimming abilities and greater protection from the elements.

Just one interpretion on how it *would* (not will) be.

Perks don't HAVE to be tied to a skill just because skills have perks tied to them.

I can see a single armor skill with perks for heavy light armors and for shields...

Things like crit mitigation perk for heavy armor or weight reduction or simple armor boost

Things like runspeed boosts or sprint stamina loss reductions for light armor

And several perks with shield use.

Or we could see combat get heavy armor and that also include shield perks and stealth get light armor and that also include acrobatics perks

Or it could be one big ass skill with a spidery web of perk lines.

Or not.

I realy wish they would tell us the skill list already so we can yell at them properly.

I want unarmoured,light,medium and heavy

I hope that armor skills are a skill that was removed. Make it like Daggerfall.

Armour skills were pointless and they did not make sense.

Unarmored, light and heavy (with perks).

Agreed. Variety is key - but I suppose that could be introduced through perks - and hopefully, there is some sort of perk hierarchy (i.e. take the Light Armor Specialization perk, and it opens up the next level of light armor perks)