(New question at bottom, sadly no edit topic option...)

Hi, I've got a lot of experience modding Skyrim, but I'm less familiar with Oblivion all round - I posted a thread a year or two ago when I was figuring some stuff out and got some really helpful responses, so I hope it's okay to do the same now, currently I'm wondering the following (but I may think of more things and add them here rather than making a fresh thread, if that's okay?) -

1/ I've currently got Cobl's TNR esps merged into my bashed patch (the ones that apply TNR changes but with Cobl Races hair and eyes). I... don't love them. Some of the faces look, well, even in the context of regular vanilla faces, kinda janky. Elves, in particular look kind of like their faces have been squooshed up in the middle. (I'm also using Natural Faces and Facial Textures by Enalya, but being just a texture replacer, I don't think they'd be responsible for this?) So, basically, can I un-install safely without having to restart the game entirely (my understanding is that removing mods is safer in Oblivion than Skyrim, but I don't know if this means it's actually, well, *safe*)? And if so, how, would I just remove those two .esp files and re-build the bashed patch? I'll try to take some screenshots later to show what I mean, in case it's actually not supposed to look like that, too...

2/ Are the current versions of Alternative Beginnings and Kvatch Rebuilt (with the patch for the Kvatch Intact start worldstate) compatible? I really liked the combination of the two - best "way in" to the main quest of any alt start mods I've tried on any Beth game - but when I got to Kvatch for the MQ (i.e post 'destruction') it was... well, not as destroyed as it should have been. The sky was all red and Oblivion-gate-y, the camp and the Oblivion gate were there, but deserted. I did the gate anyway, in case it would 'fix' things, and, surprise, it didn't (although I was able to proceed normally, the guard you meet at the start was there, etc), and when I went into Kvatch everything was intact, Savlian Mattius was sleeping in the inn that he apparently will retire to or whatever in KR, I believe I was able to tell him I'd closed the gate, but couldn't speak to him about (or independently find) Martin)... I couldn't really face troubleshooting, so I just removed the two and went back to my old standby (AS Arrive By Ship) and started again, but I'd love to know if it's possible to get those two working together still, even if it was something really small and silly that I could have done differently to avoid the issue or whatnot. (I did have OCOv2 which it mentions may cause issues, but I use a bashed patch which apparently should avoid that?) (Also, can I use KR on an ASABS playthrough, once the MQ is all initiated and Kvatch has been dealt with and so on?) Oh, I did happen to go into the console shortly after speaking to Jauffre and it did give the "kvatch has been destroyed!" message thing (however it's phrased...) so apparently things were sort of updating...

Thanks, and I hope the above isn't too waffly, let me know if anything's unclear...

For the second: NO the Alternative Beginnings with Kvatch Alive Doens't work with the last KR, and it is bugged also in the original form.

Kvatch Rebuilt already HAS a Pre invesion city even if it's in early beta

1.) Yes. Just remove the TNR Esp's and rebuild the bashed patch. AFAIK, TNR just changes facial geometry, no scripts and such. You won't even need to clean save.

Ah, thanks both!

I'm not so much bothered about Kvatch being intact before the invasion, but I did like the "approached by a mysterious person who teleports you into the IP" aspect of the combination. Oh well, at least it wasn't me messing up something, I suppose!

Any idea if it's safe to use Kvatch Rebuilt (installed post-Siege) on a save with Alternate Start Arrive By Ship?

Maybe I was unclear. With the version 3 of Kvatch Rebuilt You DON'T need a specific Alternate Start to have kvatch intact.

Any Alternate start (most at least, if they doesn't use strange, weird non standard method), should work with the Kvatch Rebuilt Builtin "Pre Invasion" city. The only thing is that it is unfinished.

Of course if you have issue in this sense report to KR page as it may be a bug.

Otherwise is perfectly safe installing KR after having started the MQ

Like I say, I'm not really bothered about Kvatch pre-Siege, I just wanted to make sure the two (ASABS/KR) are safe together, I don't *think* KR would edit e.g. the main quest but there's always a possibility, given it's presumably (if installed prior to the Siege) triggered by that point in the MQ being reached (MQ03 or MS48 being marked as completed, I guess - which, well, MS presumably isn't technically main quest stuff, though I'm not sure what MS counts as/stands for? Presumably "main/side" or similar, given it seems to refer to optional bits of MQ-related stuff?) that it might.

Anyway, cool, I'll probably give KR a go at some point, thanks

So, new question!

I'm using Oblivion XP and about thirty hours into my playthrough. I thought I'd installed DarNified UI (as in, I did the thing with TESMM, although I think it didn't give the usual OMOD options menu, looking back, but I was kinda not well and didn't really notice) and that it just wasn't as, you know, good as I remembered (played with both OXP and DU on a previous game with no issues). Anyway, finally realised (yep, I'm quick...) that in fact DarN wasn't *in* my game. Tried re-installing it a couple of times with TESMM but the same thing happened (no options thing) so I re-downloaded and re-extracted it and this time it actually ran properly. Re-installed Oblivion XP through Wrye Bash (realised that it had the vanilla rather than DarN .esp installed, too - I dunno, I installed a few months back, I have NO idea what I was thinking tbh.)

Tried to load a save, but couldn't get any of them to load, just "Oblivion has stopped working..." etc. Panicked a bit. Re-did it, rebuilt my bashed patch this time (forgot before). Same problem. Uninstalled DarN, re-installed (vanilla) Oblivion XP, rebuilt the patch again, saves load, phew. Tried installing DarN with Bash, which didn't give the options menu. It's kind of "worked", in that I can, well, get in game and from what I could tell, it's all DarNified and stuff. Seems to work okay, now that I've replaced the [fonts] section of the Oblivion.ini file (through Bash) - before that the text was all MASSIVE, but is there any way of getting Bash to run the OMOD installer with the options and such? I'd like little things like the coloured minimap which doesn't seem to be active, though they're not essential, I suppose, but I'm not sure if anything else might be wrongly installed. Alternatively, is there some big, obvious thing that I should have done differently to have the TESMM install not make it impossible to load my saves? (Should I still be using OBMM, I've previously been told TESMM is more up to date/functional, but possibly OBMM is still better?)

(Thanks in advance for any help and sorry if this makes no sense, and I'm aware I am a doofus.)

Recently, I posted a similar topic about OBMM vs TesMM and after I got these http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1604572-obmmobmm-extended-vs-tesmodmanager/#entry25187648 I decided to continue using OBMM-Extended, so I suggest that you get rid of TesMM and use OBMM-Extended.

Ah, thanks for that! For some reason, when I re-installed OBMM, it can't seem to see the DarN omod properly (says something to the effect of "can't see it because it already exists" - bad paraphrasing, sorry, really low on brain power today. Probably not a good day for mod changes!)