How is dual-wielding actually superior to single-wielding? I don't see the mechanics of it working out right in the game.

Notice:
This is not a complaint, this is a question.

Anyway, I'm carrying two swords right now, some katana I found and the Dawnbreaker. I'm on PC. When I alternate swinging between right and left hands, I get a rhythm that is something like 1... 1... 1... In other words, no rhythm at all. But when I only swing my right hand the character does a combo of sorts, something more like 1, 2, 3, ha! So it seems like swinging one handed is actually faster than swinging both hands. At least it is for me.

Thoughts on this? It occurs to me that I might need a perk but I can't figure which one. Does it matter that my swords are both regular swords (not daggers)? Am I supposed to click a certain way to get a combo going? Or.. what's the deal?

I feel like a sword + shield would be better because I can swing faster (more dps) and I can block. Right?

You deliver more damage, but you're completely unable to block.

So better is in what you would prefer: damage or defense.

No, I understand this often-quoted benefit, but I'm trying to figure out how you actually deliver more damage. How does that work? Swinging the two swords actually goes slower than swinging just one. So.. that's not more damage, that's less.

That, and you can't use spells either. Basically, you restrict your hands to a full offense similar to a 2-handed. (Damage output I believe tends to work better with dual wielding)

You didn't even factor in power attacks, which is where the real damage comes from.

A standing still dual-wielding power attack is far more powerful than a single weapon would ever be, but you are much more vulnerable.

-Think of it like this- Power attacks do double damage. Say you're using a sword and shield and have 50 weapon damage. You power attack for 100 damage.

Now if you had 2 of those swords you would have 100 weapon damage. If you do a standing dual-wield power attack you will deal a total of 400 damage.

Not factoring in perks or enemy armor rating.

Guys, I understand that you supposedly do more damage when dual-wielding. What I'm trying to say is that it does not appear to actually be the case. When I swing 1 sword 6 times, I can actually do it faster than swinging 2 swords 3 times each.

That means that 1 sword is doing more damage than 2. That's what I'm saying.

This. Especially with the 35% speed bonus perk and the perk for 50% bonus with dual wield power attacks AND the 25% bonus for standing attacks. Not to mention 3 power hits each with a chance to stagger.

I was thinking about this earlier today, when I accidentally equipped two axes. I tried to swing a combo (assuming that it would, you know, combo), and I just went "right initial strike animation, left initial strike animation" repeatedly. The first strike is slower than animation 2 and 3 (not scientific, I'm just eyeballing this), so aside from the lack of cooldown between animation 3 and animation 1, you're swinging more slowly while dual-wielding.

I should qualify this by saying that I didn't test this out on an enemy and I don't have the dual wielding perk, so maybe there is a combo.

Swing speed when dual wielding is the same as a single weapon (actually, even faster if you take one of the Dual Wield perks), and if you press both attack buttons at once (either in a regular blow or a power attack) it combines the damage of both weapons.

I think what you're seeing is a placebo effect; if I fight a Dragur Wight with only one weapon in my hand, a regular attack does not do a damn thing. If I put both weapons in my hand, with a regular attack from my right hand, he loses a good portion of his health. And mind you, both my weapons are Ebony War Axes (Epic).

This is what I'm seeing. I like the way you describe it. It's basically one initial animation after the next, and no combo effect. Whereas the single sword has a combo effect that makes for three slightly faster strikes in a row. This is exactly it.

So you guys are saying that the real benefit is in using both weapons at once, and not from alternating between them? I wish we could get a little combo going.

Plus, if you have the double dose poison perk, faster dual-wielding perks, and are dual-wielding daggers with strong enchantments, you can do an absolutely ridiculous amount of burst damage even with non-fancy regular attacks.

Auto-attacking is very inefficient and should only be used to finish off an opponent. The combo is in the standing power attack. It's animation consists of a right swing, a left swing, and a dual swing.

That's 8x your weapon damage. This is the strength of dual-wielding.

In the short time-frame of the combo is equal to swinging back and forth 8 times. If you are able to grasp this concept you would see how powerful dual-wielding is.

Add in perks and you can get a total of 14x damage.

The weakness is that you are vulnerable during the animation.

Ooooooohhh... wow yea I just tried that. KaBOOM says my stamina bar though. No wonder. I still think it would be nice if there was a little more finesse in the regular attacks. They feel very clunky. Even if there was no actual timing or damage difference, it would be much more easy to get into if the attack animations blended together a bit more smoothly and my character transitioned from swinging one to the next with a little more ease.

Meh, I just want it to look cool. Can we get a "make dual wielding look cool" perk? I'd spend a point in that.

lol

http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1279191-dual-wielding-actually-better/page__view__findpost__p__19333503.

This perk helps too.

Dual Flurry (2) One-Handed 30, Armsman Dual wielding attacks are 20% faster (35% for second rank)

Press both attack buttons at the same time to swing both at once. It does really nice damage.

Actually, the two-handed weapons are balanced between offense and defense, compared to dual wield and shield.

You do not actually do more damage unless you take the Dual Welding perks! Take the first two ranks, equip 2 weapons and JUST swing the right hand. Notice how fast it swings. Then equip a shield and swing the right hand. You will notice a big difference in swing speed. I don't think you actually have to swing both weapons - you will get a speed increase with those perks.

Next, get the perk Dual Savagery. It gives +50% dmg to a power attack as long as you have two weapons equipped. So just power attack with a single weapon + 50% damage. That single perk makes the a Dual Weld player hit just as hard as a two hand warrior. For 50% less stamina. Now power attack with BOTH weapons at the same time. You will will hit for double damage on each weapon + 50%. So two Daedric Swords with max skill hit for 72 pts of dmg each. A 2 hand hits for 106. After dual savagery they hit for 72 * 2 (two weapons) * 2 (power attack) * 1.5( Dual Savage) = 432. No fancy bull crap enchants either. A two hand warrior will hit for 106 * 2 (Power Attack) = 212. A single Sword & Board will hit for 72 * 2 = 144. A dual weld character that only attacks with one hand will do 72 * 2 (Power Attack) * 1.5( Dual Savagery) = 216.

Now the formula to calculate the stamina you burn up is (40 + 2 pts per unit of weapon weight) * .75 (If you have the perk that drops stamina cost - which you had better get if you are playing a melee warrior!) Since most 2 Hand weapons weight double the single hand weapon - Dual Power Attack uses the same amount of stamina as a 2hnd power attack - but at a whole lot more damage!

The only advantage of 2 Hand is Sweep and tha ability to block/parry.

I'd say overall DPS for dual wielding compared to two-handed when all perks considered is probably in favor of dual wielding by close to 25% more in damage output per second could be a little less.

However this is somewhat mitigated in that two-handed can block and hence reduced damage taken.
Also two-handed can make use of the block tree perks. Such as the ability to block 100% more effective (probably mitigating almost all damage) and also do "power-bash" that can stagger and do 5x damage (whatever default bash is), not only that but a chance of totally disarming his opponent as well.
I forgot you can also slow down time during the blocking, which can set up ability to count-attack ( that one might only work for shields, not sure, the counter attack that is, the slowing of time should still work).

So in the end I think it evens out, sure you have to spend perks in block tree for those abilities with the two-handed, but it's something a dual wielder can't use, unless of course they go back to using a shield or using one sword and NOTHING in the other hand.

You might do a little more damage as a dual wielder of swords/axes etc but you can't defend yourself so every hit on YOU is a full on damage. It can be quite a significant trade-off, I mean it's not like a two-handed warrior can't dish out the pain as well, but they can defend too.

I was actually pretty much focused on going one handed and dual wield a lot, but this made me re-think this decision, I never thought of how much more defense I can get. Always just thought of it as blocking and only thought shields was needed for the whole block tree.
But that is not the case, the bashing etc and damage mitigation works for two-handed as well.
Decisions decisions, arghhh...

I am a warrior who uses 2 handers, dual wields and shield and sword. I switch based on mood and to mix up my fighting style to keep things fun. There's nothing more satisfying than dual wielding a pair of silver swords in a room full of skeletons or draugr, everything dies in seconds, and there's not much more satisfying than a one shot decapitation with my 2 hander.

Damn man. Did you perk all of those? If so, that seems like it'd be a pretty awful way to play, (IMO) not having any other types of perks.

But as for the topic. I'm pretty sure it's been explained and understood, at this point. But I also wish there was some actual benefit to dual-wielding with you normal left click/right click timing. I really hope someone comes out with a mod that let's you swing both weapons once, with just the left (or right, I guess) mouse button. If someone could do that, the other button would be free to make some kind of block mod or something for. I really couldn't care less if I can block with them, I just don't like having to hit both buttons all the time.

Also. Another thing that kind of annoys me is that (as far as I know. I haven't progressed too far with a dual-wielder) all of the dual-wield attacks must be static. As in, you can't move while doing them. Which is something that it lacks compared to every single other type of weapon setup. Say what you want about needing to be more "vulnerable" to damage with dual-wield. I believe you should at least get the option to upgrade a perk for a running dual-wield attack or something.

What I noticed is,is it really faster than one hand without perks?

well my friend. if u hold down both triggers u get a devastating 4 hit attack. also there is a perk where dual wielding weapons does 50 percent extra damage.

It is. Swinging with one hand is faster than swinging with the dual handed weapons. However, the power attack is where the real value is, so if you don't use that you are hurting your character. Also, you have to buff dual wield a little with some perks before it's better than single.