PC Gaming during the 90's

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 12:10 am

I seriously don't understand how development costs can be so high for some of these triple AAA titles, sorry I mean "AAA" titles. Overpaid voice actors.... um whats next? Engine.... hmm whats next? 100 million cost! Um what? Must be missing something somewhere... how can it cost that much to make a game?!
Some of them yes, like the big names. Real actors.

ACTUAL voice actors are often stamped on and pushed down by a cheap industry that tries to nickle and dime every little thing they can out of them. I've read a few interviews about actual people who make a living just doing voices, and some of the struggles they have to face. One is where a developer needs only one line done, so the bring the voice actor in for a test run. Get him to work a day recording lines, tell him they'll call him if they need him or will hire him. He doesn't get paid for doing voice work because it was just a test. Company goes on to make AAA block buster. :glare: Also it may have been a she, let me see if I can find the article.

Talk about sleazy eh?
User avatar
Syaza Ramali
 
Posts: 3466
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2007 10:46 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:20 am

The '90s was a real dark age of gaming for me. I enjoyed computer games in the 1980s and 2000s, but the 1990s were just a real turn-off. Possibly personal circumstances, but I'd bet the same is true of people who view it as some sort of golden age: perhaps for them personally, it's maybe a time they remember with nostalgia, but it was nothing special.
Yeah, I don't look at a games decade to determine its merit or worth, and personally only a few handful of console/pc games from the 90's are 'big hits' to me, the rest are forgettable. Dare I say, Diablo being one of those series I've found chiefly in that 'overhyped trash' group. But I suppose subjective opinions will be subjective.
User avatar
Jessie Butterfield
 
Posts: 3453
Joined: Wed Jun 21, 2006 5:59 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 1:24 pm

Talk about sleazy eh?
Surely that is illegal or something? :|
User avatar
Soku Nyorah
 
Posts: 3413
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 1:25 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 12:16 pm

Another case of 'things were better in the old days'. No. Plenty of "creative and stunning games" have been released since the 1990s. As someone who grew up playing games on the Atari 2600 and Commodore 64 I would take today's games over those of yesterday any day of the week.
User avatar
Ebou Suso
 
Posts: 3604
Joined: Thu May 03, 2007 5:28 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:07 am

Surely that is illegal or something? :|
To my knowledge it's quite common. They bring in someone for a 'test' and they say they'll call if they need them, then if they say 'Hey wait, we still have that one guy/girls dialogue tests, lets use that', and it's perfectly legal. It's humanly a dike move, but legally fine.
User avatar
Susan
 
Posts: 3536
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2006 2:46 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 1:51 am

Surely that is illegal or something? :|
Oh it might be no one has ever tried to change it. Voice actors are terribly under represented in games. The big names can call the shots (to an extent), but the actual ordinary actors that have to come in with 30+ voices to even consider being hired do not. It's not like they get payed enough to try and take them to court over this either, legal fees against a company that big are astounding. Way above a voice actors pay grade.
User avatar
Jynx Anthropic
 
Posts: 3352
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2006 9:36 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:17 am

I thought the early 2000s were pretty good, but I was on a console then. The tech had reached the point where we could see some pretty lifelike graphics, and developers were still willing to take risks with unusual ideas.

You still see that on PC nowadays, it just tends to be limited to the smaller companies and indie devs.
User avatar
Jessie Rae Brouillette
 
Posts: 3469
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 9:50 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 7:35 am

Well someone pointed out how they don't think any one decade is the best, I agree with this. Though sometimes there is a marked decrease or increase in quantity/quality that can be measured and actually means something. Personally I don't see any one being the best. The exception to this is the 2000's PC gaming porting epidemic. Where it was just a series of awful games that were horribly unoptimized. If we were lucky to get a port at all. But that is an exception rather than a rule or pattern.

Edit.
On a semi related topic.I have never played X-Com, but playing Xenonauts just "felt" right. Like this was something that should have somehow been ingrained in my brain with machinery during birth or something. I'm just loving this kind of game, but having not played PC games until 2000 I had no idea this genre existed. It's some really great stuff. It got me interested in seeing if I can go back and see the X-Com games myself (play them). Also the new one coming out, and of course Xenonauts which introduced me to the genre.
User avatar
phillip crookes
 
Posts: 3420
Joined: Wed Jun 27, 2007 1:39 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 4:04 am

I really hate it when someone says that the only reason that the golden age of gaming of the 90s is called that way is due to nostalgia.

I've played these so called golden age games in the past 5 years, since I had my first gaming computer in 2001 and I never played those games at the time, and yeah, I can see why they're called that way.

Fallout 1
Fallout 2
Arcanum
Baldur's Gate 1
Baldur's Gate 2
Diablo
Diablo 2 (2000)
Daggerfall
Half Life 1
System Shock 2
X-Com

All brilliant games, and I like them better than most newer games. Not all most newer games, but most. Personal opinion of course, but especially the ones related to computer role playing, they were much much better. Early 2000s was good too (Morrowind, Vampire Masquerade, Half Life 2 etc).
User avatar
jesse villaneda
 
Posts: 3359
Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2007 1:37 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:52 am

Here's a good candidate for showing that it's not merely higher fidelty graphics that dictates budget: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udEAEARD-Fo is essentially an indie game being made by a small group of experienced devs who left the big corporate side of the industry. It has visuals that easily competes with the top tier, but most of the game content just goes towards pure gameplay rather than trying to be a blockbuster "experience" (a buzzword the big PR people love to use in interviews and press releases these days).
User avatar
Bedford White
 
Posts: 3307
Joined: Tue Jun 12, 2007 2:09 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:34 am

Here's a good candidate for showing that it's not merely higher fidelty graphics that dictates budget: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=udEAEARD-Fo is essentially an indie game being made by a small group of experienced devs who left the big corporate side of the industry. It has visuals that easily competes with the top tier, but most of the game content just goes towards pure gameplay rather than trying to be a blockbuster "experience" (a buzzword the big PR people love to use in interviews and press releases these days).

Oh my god, I just peed a little. Not because I love the game, I have incontinence.

Seriously though, that looks amazing.
User avatar
Stace
 
Posts: 3455
Joined: Sun Jun 18, 2006 2:52 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 11:25 am

I seriously don't understand how development costs can be so high for some of these triple AAA titles, sorry I mean "AAA" titles. Overpaid voice actors.... um whats next? Engine.... hmm whats next? 100 million cost! Um what? Must be missing something somewhere... how can it cost that much to make a game?!
The voice actors and engine costs are peanuts compared to the salary they pay to 100+ people who work on the game for 2-3 years. AAA games require fancy graphics, and lots and lots of artists work on those games to create the 3D models, textures, animations and build the detailed game world.

Not long ago it was announced that over 700 people are working on Epic Mickey 2, which is a huge number! Just imagine all those paychecks! While games in the 90s often had a team of only 15 people or so, and in the 80s it was usually just 1-3 people.
User avatar
Kate Norris
 
Posts: 3373
Joined: Mon Nov 27, 2006 6:12 pm

Post » Fri Jun 22, 2012 11:49 pm

Diablo 2. Duke Nukem.


Ahhhhhh....



"Stay a while and listen"
User avatar
Ezekiel Macallister
 
Posts: 3493
Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2007 12:08 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 10:01 am

So everytime i see PC games, I always see the 90 as its Golden Age. There were a ton of games and many of them are so creative and stunning. Now heres my question. What Happened? Why arent games like this anymore. I look foward to your responses.
The 90s were great for PC gaming. I'm especially fond of 1994, lots of great games that year, like UFO: Enemy Unknown, Little Big Adventure, System Shock and others.

The System Shock series is still my favorite gaming series of all time, and both those games are from the 90s. And then there's the first Thief, which still is the best sneaking game ever made (together with Thief II which was released early 2000).

Excellent PC games from the 90s :tongue:
Spoiler

Alone in the Dark
Blade Runner
Civilization
Day of the Tentacle
Discworld II: Missing presumed...!?
Discworld Noir
Doom
Dreamweb
Duke Nukem 3D
Dune
Dune 2
EF2000
Elite II: Frontier
Fallout
FreeSpace 2
Gabriel Knight: Sins of the Fathers
Grim Fandango
Gunship 2000
Indiana Jones and the Fate of Atlantis
Lemmings
Little Big Adventure
Little Big Adventure 2
Lost Eden
Might and Magic VI: The Mandate of Heaven
Monkey Island
Monkey Island 2
Monkey Island 3
Omikron: The Nomad Soul
Outcast
Outlaws
Planescape: Torment
Quake
Sam & Max Hit the Road
Sim City 2000
Shogo
Star Wars: Dark Forces
Star Wars: Jedi Knight - Dark Forces II
Star Wars: Tie Fighter
Syndicate
Syndicate Wars
System Shock
System Shock 2
The Dig
The Longest Journey
The Elder Scrolls II: Daggerfall
Thief Gold
Total Annihilation
UFO: Enemy Unknown
Warcraft II
Wing Commander
Wing Commander II
Wing Commander III
Wolfenstein 3D

I can't help but to feel that the year 2000 was the last great year for exclusive PC gaming. After that PC gaming somewhat changed after most games becoming multiplatform games with the arrival of the Xbox and gaming in general going mainstream. Good games are still made, of course, but most seem to lack that extra oomf gameplay and immersion, and instead focus on the cinematic experience.
User avatar
Natalie Harvey
 
Posts: 3433
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 12:15 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 11:12 am

The voice actors and engine costs are peanuts compared to the salary they pay to 100+ people who work on the game for 2-3 years. AAA games require fancy graphics, and lots and lots of artists work on those games to create the 3D models, textures, animations and build the detailed game world.

Not long ago it was announced that over 700 people are working on Epic Mickey 2, which is a huge number! Just imagine all those paychecks! While games in the 90s often had a team of only 15 people or so, and in the 80s it was usually just 1-3 people.

Don't forget the astronomical marketing and advertising budget.
User avatar
Steve Fallon
 
Posts: 3503
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 12:29 am

Post » Fri Jun 22, 2012 10:31 pm

I was born in 1995. I am referring to 90's game in general. Usually the ones that were point and click adventures, sci-fi, FPS, etc.

Just ask around your friends. How many actually enjoy point-n-click and that kind of graphics with so much readings and immersion on player's part? I mean immersion as in dipping in without the need of simulation aids, immersion as in getting in to the mood without the need of technology.

People are already used to getting handed with fun for what they paid instead of looking for fun in what they paid. They jump titles, never stick on to one for more than a month. With that kind of gaming climate, you cannot survive without something that could actually keep them in awe for more than 6 months, and that takes millions dollars of cost.

Just think about it. How much do you think you can pay the bill if you're working for a company? When you may have better alternatives selling real estates and rolling about in stock market. People simply move to better alternatives when it's more appealing, and working on a video game with solid content doesn't pay off, cause nobody cares.
User avatar
Jennifer Munroe
 
Posts: 3411
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2007 12:57 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 5:04 am

There are still plenty of great PC exclusives coming out each year. :shrug:
User avatar
Rinceoir
 
Posts: 3407
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 1:54 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 12:15 am

Can I ask what games for PC from the 90s your talking about? Chances are i've played them but considering I was born in the middle of the 90s I'm suddenly worried I've missed out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_64DAOrSMM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f98OJpkcxYs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UV5cwtGE-Zw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ucLyqEboGM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njgHMxzwDLU


That's not to say there aren't innovations or great games still going on.

Look at Prey, Portal, STALKER for the shooter genre.

The X series is still going strong in the space sim area.

Iji and Hero Core have that wonderful old school arcade action to them whilst making an actual good story out of it.(These two are indie games though)
User avatar
LittleMiss
 
Posts: 3412
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2006 6:22 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 1:22 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K_64DAOrSMM
Thats the only game in your list i've played! Now that brings back childhood memories. I remember some kind of disease that made their heads swell up... or something similar to that. Or a treatment?
User avatar
sally R
 
Posts: 3503
Joined: Mon Sep 25, 2006 10:34 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 8:03 am

Greed and Dying inspiration mostly.
User avatar
Emma Parkinson
 
Posts: 3401
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2006 5:53 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 8:35 am

Falcon 4.0 came out. There's been no reason to make flight sims since.

Seriously though the 90's had major leaps in engine tech and experimentation, there was variety in genres, drm was limited to a cd key if there was drm. It was less about "franchises" "ip's" and "fans" and more about just making good games for your customers.

Then xbox happened... :dry:

And so the decade of dudebro began.
User avatar
Maria Leon
 
Posts: 3413
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 12:39 am

Post » Fri Jun 22, 2012 10:05 pm

re: high production costs

Most of the money isn't in voice & mocap actors. Like SFX in movies, high-end graphics & sound can start to really pack on the $$$$.


Everyone who [censored]es and moans that doesn't support every DX11 bell and whistle, at 2560x16whatever, in 3D; and complains that anything even a step below looks "horrible" or "dated".... yeah, that's why budgets are sky high. (and why they spend so much effort on "oooh, looks pretty!" instead of on, say, gameplay and story)
User avatar
Margarita Diaz
 
Posts: 3511
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 2:01 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:44 am

The 90's weren't that great, there aren't many games I go back too from 1996-8.
User avatar
Portions
 
Posts: 3499
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 1:47 am

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 1:01 pm

90's PC games... hell--console games as well--are so much more dynamic.

I'll see your graphics and raise you depth.
User avatar
hannah sillery
 
Posts: 3354
Joined: Sun Nov 26, 2006 3:13 pm

Post » Sat Jun 23, 2012 9:51 am

The 90's weren't that great, there aren't many games I go back too from 1996-8.
Yeah, late 90s early 00s is more accurate.

Just look at BF1942 compared to BF3 - how many more things could you do in that game 10 years ago? We've lost features as gaming has moved on.

The paradigm shift happened around the launch of the 360, when many developers people considered as the vanguard of PC gaming suddenly enjoyed huge success in that market and pushed out the formerly dominant Japanese developers to near irrelevance. It was probably the more PC-friendly architecture of the hardware which acted as a catalyst for this trend, as development on consoles prior to that had typically been very different from PC development.
Earlier than that, the PS2 and Xbox started it.
User avatar
Dalton Greynolds
 
Posts: 3476
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2007 5:12 pm

PreviousNext

Return to Othor Games