I started this thread because of a question I inadvertently asked in another thread.

I was just wonderin;

I love smithing (for role-playing purposes) and I think its a cool skill.
The thing is, though, that even WITHOUT using the 900x iron dagger method (never used it), I always feel like I'm abusing Smithing - even if I level it up at a steady pace along my other skills.

AND, oddly enough I can't stand the feeling of having Complete Legendary armor and weapons going over the caps. I also hate stockpiling anything (such as smithing supplies - I realize that this may be counter-productive)

Is there a way to realistically use Smithing and not OP yourself?

Anyways, I know its kind of a weirdly worded question - and there may be no real answer - but any advice/tips would be much appreciated (this includes role-playing techniques).

The Dagger spam exploit was patched ^^

What do you mean by "use it realistically"?

When I use Smithing "realistically" I only smith a set of armor (whatever the best is that I can smith) and then I improve it. Same with weapons.

Sometimes, to eek out a few more septims, I will improve whatever armor and weapons I am carrying that I plan to sell. Then I sell it. That's using Smithing 'realistically' in my mind.

If I happened to pick up materials during my adventures, I might go ahead and smith what I can, improve it, then sell it. Also using Smithing 'realistically' afaic.

That's true. I never even tried using it in the first place.

The main thing is that I know I HAVE to get to the Dragon Armor point, but no matter how I go about getting there, it always feels like I've been power-leveling.

The problem is that it is impossible to really level up smithing without FOCUSING on it. Ideally, I would just casually upgrade things when I felt like it, but then the skill gets nowhere.

I only smithed what I found and never smithed materials until they started showing up in the game as loot. I did not get Smithing up to 100 until my character was in his 40's. I would also only make one set of armor for each material type. Sometimes I would make some for my followers, but usually I let them keep what they had.

As for the Armor Caps, really by the time you are at them, only your tactics can get you into trouble in a fight. I don't think we need to have more DR or attack power in this game at higher levels.

I stand corrected..

I don't really understand the dilemma. I have a couple smiths, and never feel like I'm power-leveling. I upgrade the stuff I loot for sale, and every once in a while when I feel like a longer smithing session, I make a new set of stuff for myself and my follower. I don't even bother taking the dragon perk most of the time, because I'm only interested in the stuff I'll actually use and that's only ebony or dwarven for followers and steel for my PC. In this way I reach 100 smithing around level 50 which is about when everything starts getting easy anyway.

Is this for Aesthetics? I took the Dragon Armor Perk once, made some armor, then promptly reloaded an earlier save when I realized that; A I did not care for the look, B The Armor I already had was just as good and I liked the look better. With the new Weapons, I may put that Perk back to make a sword.

I totally agree. I like the relative lack of scaling (compared to Oblivion). You SHOULD be able to become crazy powerful over some enemies, as long as there is always something to provide a challenge (like Morrowind)

If I were to 'fix' smithing, I would impose a requirement similar to the one we have in enchanting. In order to make a piece, you would have to first come up with a piece to study, so until you actually found some ebony armor you couldn't make ebony armor. Not sure if that would work with dragonbone though ... I have never found anything dragonbone other than a helmet.

I level up Smithing because there's good money in it. Buy stuff, make awesome armor, sell it. But I now limit myself to one Fortify Smithing enchantment. For items I'm selling, it has to be apparel, but for stuff I'm making for myself I can use a potion instead.

Smithing's still my first skill to hit 100, though. But it helps me put all those dragon bones to good use.

I admit when I first learned that there were like 20+ levels above Legendary I was a little put out. I thought Legendary was Legendary and I didn't have to try to make things even better. Now my Smith skill is 100 and I still put on a couple pieces of Smithing gear and chug a few potions before I upgrade anything. To be honest I wish items were just capped at legendary (1) and you didn't have to think about it anymore.

My first character I had to have Dragon armor asap and I spammed Smithing to get to 100, only to find out it all but ruined any challenge in the game. Now I just let it level as I use and I generally get to 100 at around levels 40 - 45, which is when I'd be needing Legendary items anyway.

You CAN'T power level smithing. Leveling smithing is VERY expensive now, and just as time consuming.

Power-leveling smithing to me is paying for five ranks of training every level. I'd go insane trying to learn smithing the regular way.

Smithing becomes overpowered only if you use +% enchants and potions...otherwise, legendary equipment is fine at master difficulty, imho

Jewelry is underrated. There are several explicit jewelry merchants, and smithing necklaces and rings feels like a pretty genuine way to improve your smithing skill. It's a good way to use gems you find, and further, you can enchant it and sell it (also known as my favourite power-levelling cycle). Finding gold and silver ingots is of course a bit tedious, but, unless your speech skill is dreadfully low, purchasing the materials isn't a big deal in relation to the money you make selling the product.

didn't a patch fix this? im pretty sure it takes many more daggers to level smithing now, I used to raise a smithing level by helping alvor early in the game and just helped him with a new character last night yet it wasn't enough to raise a smithing level

If you use Smithing "realistically" (i.e. crafting just what you need, roleplaying a smith and crafting a few items for sale), it's going to take dozens and dozens of hours to level up the skill to the point of being able to craft Dragon Bone armor (assuming that's your goal, to max it out). Power-levelling Smithing is really the only way to get any real use out of the skill.

If you don't want to "abuse" smithing, just usen what you find and/or buy from shops and improve them to the best of your ability.

Thanks for all the responses, guys.

I know it was kind of a weird/pointless question to ask, I was more just looking for a way to use Smithing in a role-playing way (I realize it is kind of a contradiction that I would like to eventually get Dragon Armor but at the same time not feel over-powered/like I've power-leveled smithing)

Oh well, I'll figure it out. (upping the difficulty is a viable option)

I do power-level Smithing, but not to an extraordinary point. My level 28 character currently has 63 or 64 Smithing, and that's from making Dwarven bows from level 30. I feel like Smithing levels up too slow using "realistically". I made a full set of Orcish for me and my follower and I don't even think I got 61 Smithing from it. I do use it somewhat realistically when I'm not power-levelling (i.e. improving loot). I do plan on going through two Dwemer ruins to get scrap metal for bows so I can 80 Smithing, which is as high as I plan to go.

I tried once to only smith using the mines in the game and all pieces found normally in play. It is not possible to get remotely close to 100 with only the material in the mines. I believe smithing to be a fundamentally flawed perk.

Just smith what you need. That's what my characters do (who use smithing, that is) and I've never had a problem.

I was concerned with over doing it on smithing, too, so I made an effort to focus on combat skills. If I felt like I was falling behind in smithing, I would just take a bit of a break from adventuring to craft a few things. I hit 100 just before level 40 because I did push a bit for the last 20 levels so I could craft Dragon gear. I felt I leveled it naturally, though.

Hunt Pelts (bears and saber cats are best, wish you could "skin" mammoths). Smith Leather Armors.

Hit Up Gold/Silver Mines and smith jewelry. You can add iron ore if you're into transmuting.

Smith Dwarven Bows. Markarth can give you enough material for nearly 100 bows.

These three techniques are what i always use. The rest of the matierals are too difficult to come by.