Miraak - underdeveloped? : V - Skyrim

» Mon Feb 04, 2013 2:07 pm

Please, Handsome Jack isn't a good villain. If he's the best of antagonist of 2012, that doesn't speak much to the quality anywhere else. He spends so much time being an annoying [censored] that it completely overbears any legitimate villain-y stuff going on. By the time Borderlands 2 finishes, you don't hate him because he's the bad guy trying to wipe him out, you hate him because he is annoying and won't shut up. Or at least I did.

Proclaiming Handsome Jack as the complete villain would be like doing the same with Dr Evil. They serve a role but by god... :devil:

Haha. I see what you're saying. For the particular game he inhabits, I think Jack is a perfect fit.

» Mon Feb 04, 2013 1:35 pm

Please, Handsome Jack isn't a good villain. If he's the best of antagonist of 2012, that doesn't speak much to the quality anywhere else. He spends so much time being an annoying [censored] that it completely overbears any legitimate villain-y stuff going on. By the time Borderlands 2 finishes, you don't hate him because he's the bad guy trying to wipe him out, you hate him because he is annoying and won't shut up. Or at least I did.

Proclaiming Handsome Jack as the complete villain would be like doing the same with Dr Evil. They serve a role but by god... :devil:

Completely disagree. Handsome Jack is one of the few villains in a game that ever made me care enough to desperately want to put a bullet through his head.

» Mon Feb 04, 2013 2:49 pm

I was definitely hoping for more information about what it means to be Dragonborn. To my mind we get almost no new information about being Dragonborn.

Like someone said before, for an expansion called Dragonborn there's actually very little relevance to the fact that our adversary is Dragonborn because the focus was so much on Hermaeus Mora.

I was also disappointed that we never got to chat with Miraak.

» Mon Feb 04, 2013 1:27 am

Aside from the trailer? Alright, how about the description?

Spoiler

Our fate does not hang in the balance because Hermaeous Mora wins it either way.
The fate of Solstheim doesn't hang in the balance because nothing really happens outside of Apocrypha and Miraak was never going to win and achieve his goal anyway.
And our "deadliest adversary"? That's a joke. We only have one fight with the guy and Hermaeous Mora ends up killing him. Hermaeous Mora was the antagonist of the DLC, not Miraak (who was really just his puppet the whole time).

I spoke with MerchantMudCrab on this matter in another thread, and he too essentially said HM was the real evil entity here. He personally enjoyed this twist, I on the other hand didn't., primarily because we were mis-informed about what this DLC would entail. I can't agree with you that this is 'over-hyping.' Hyping something is shamelessly promoting things through constant developer feeds, advertisemants, etc. Star Wars: The Old Republic or Hitman: Absolution are both shining examples of over-hyping. There's a pretty big difference between misinformed and hyping. Nonetheless, you're still right, the trailer and the description were misinforming to say the least.

As far as Miraak goes, he's a lost opportunity for what could have been some incredible writing, lore wise. We have here the first Dragonborn, and...that's it. We know very little about how he was dethroned, besides the fact that one dragon priest.... or several, or maybe 1 dragon priest and several dragons, or perhaps one dragon and three dragon priests...see what I mean? And then we're all wondering how he's the first Dragonborn, and even that itself is touched upon by a side-narrative. We rarely see or hear anything relating to the big man himself, aside from when he A) Says your feats are petty and sends you back to Solstheim

Steals your Dragon Souls and C) The Final Battle at Apocrypha.

Meanwhile, HM is just soaking in the rays with his overly sinister voice, driving the Dragonborn harder than a Dunmer with 15 slaves. He sends us on some wild [censored] goose chase, makes us stand by and watch him kill Storn in a manner that would cause Vlad the Impaler to punch his fist out from his grave and give a thumbs up. And then he steals the spotlight and kills the antagonist right before our eyes. I'd be more understanding if this DLC was called 'Apocrypha,' or 'Tentacle mutant fetish part deux,' but it's [censored] called 'Dragonborn.'

» Mon Feb 04, 2013 7:31 am

I don't get this. Hermaous Mora was...actually pretty straightforward and didn't really do anything evil. Yeah, he killed someone but that was because the guy was refusing to give up his secrets after an agreement was made.

It's also difficult to say he seduced anyone since he was upfront with all of his bargains. On a scale of 1-1000 for manipulation, Hermaous was actually about a 3.

Which isn't bad, actually. It's a refreshing change from Clavicus Vile and Mephala that Hermaous gives you what he promises.

It's not like he's our antagonist either since he's nothing but helpful. You could say he's the villain of the DLC as much as Sheogorath of the Shivering Isles.

Since when did Storn make a bargain with Herma-Mora? He just wouldn't give him their secrets as they considered them sacred.
Mora is bad because he's the main reason Miraak is a villain in the first place.. he seduced Miraak with power and knowledge and would love to do the same to you. Thankfully we're probably stronger than Miraak.

» Mon Feb 04, 2013 2:00 pm

Well Storn said he'd give them up on your behalf.

» Mon Feb 04, 2013 2:15 pm

Well Storn said he'd give them up on your behalf.

Which he did.. and Mora decided to be a [censored] about it and kill him in the process.

» Mon Feb 04, 2013 2:56 am

What I gathered about Miraak: (warning: long and contains spoilers)

Spoiler

As we know, Alduin's original purpose was to devour the world and end the kalpa when the time is right. As we know, he decided to use up his time until then by reigning over humankind with his army of dragons and his cult following. He abused his power and generally created a lot of mahem in Tamriel, Skyrim in particular. Akatosh (Alduin's father/alternate personality) decides that he needs a champion to clean up the mess Adluin was making. This champion would his first attempt at sending the world a Dragonborn, Miraak.

Miraak (much like us)was created specifically to destroy Alduin. This is why he is stronger than Alduin (at least according to him). He was to train and master his thu'um so that he would be capable of defeating Alduin, and he infiltrated the cult to gain more knowledge of the power of dragon shouts. Unfortunately, his desire for power got the best of him and he turned on them prematurely, having not yet gathered enough knowledge to defeat Alduin and end the dragon threat. He killed many dragons but was eventually defeated on Solstheim by the Guardian and the scores of dragons that were probably with him.

Hermaeous Mora saved him and made him his champion. This probably suited Miraak at first as he finally was able to obtain all that knowledge and power that he sought. He eventually grew rebellious and desired freedom and a return to Mundus where he could actually utilize all the power he was accumulating. This is when the events that lead to the dlc take place. He learns how to communicate between realms (as seen when he steals dragon souls) and manages to build up a cult via this form of communication. He uses the cult to rebuild his temple and corrupt the nature stones, this allows him to enthrall the locals and get more free labor. All of this is to prepare for his eventual return.

While Miraak was getting his barings in Apocrypha, Alduin was getting his butt handed to him by the three Nord heroes as we witnessed in the MQ. He was sent forward in time a few thousand years. This is when old Akatosh decides to try again at sending a Dragonborn to kill him. DB 2.0 is much more successful than his predecessor, Miraak. Miraak doesn't believe that you are close to being as strong as he is (by now he could take Alduin) so he spares you. This leads to his final downfall.