This is a continuation of a previous thread we had about this subject, which mysteriously vanished.

It was about whether you would or would not like attributes to make a comeback and the following conclusion was eventually made.

1. Keep perks but add attributes. The attributes and skills would then take care of 'boring' stuff like weapon damage, armor rating, etc. while the perks would offer unique abilities and so on.

2. Classes could be reintroduced with class-specific perks.


There was more in that previous thread, but since that one vanished (not locked, just gone) I had to make this new one.

Please discuss the ideas posted here as well as the general debate of attributes/perks but keep it civil. Also, if some posters would repost their thoughts from the previous thread that would be more than welcome.

Gonna' repost this.

1. Bring attributes back and make them relevant. When people say attributes were useless, that's hardly their fault. It's the developers fault for making them useless.
Add them back in and do them in the way S.P.E.C.I.A.L. was done, eg. you can only choose them at the start of the game from a limited number of points.
Have them affect everything: How much you carry, how good you are with weapons, how much health you have. All the basic stuff that will be with you for the rest of the game.
Of course ones like speed can be left out.

2. Return of the class system. I don't know why this was removed. It focused your character in to what you wanted to be and gave you a clear direction. It was also something to RP with.
Now I don't know about anyone else, but I like getting to the max level for my characters to feel complete. I just think it's bad that I must level every skill to 100 to do that.
Having the class system would allow people to reach the highest level without breaking their playstyle or RP.

3. Races. Now we all love to hear about NV, but their's something unique in NV that should really be in TES: Traits.
From small bonuses to massive changes, these can severely change the way you play and TES already has a system in place for brining in some unique ones.
Make all races fell different and and truly unique. Different starting stats, disposition and other bonuses can help do that.

4. Give skills their use back. This is a fault of Skyrim. They took away skills use and instead made "20% cooler!" perks instead. This is both a waste of perks and skills.
They should also add more skills back in, separate the weapon categories into individual weapon skills, remove the "Mage, warrior, thief" thing they had in Skyrim.
And lastly, skill based perks. Oblivions unique thing: as you gained level in a skill, you gained perks relevant to that skill automatically. This could really allow something unique.
If they made it so that you only gain these for class based skills, it would really open up class diversity.

5. Perks. This one is simple, you gain a perk every few levels and are allowed to pick from a list of ones that you meet the requirements for.
The way NV does it. These perks are unique and game changing, not some crappy 10% bonus to sneak.

I agree that perks and attributes together will make a much more balanced leveling system, and help to define characters even more, making them much more unique, and attributes as you said will take the job of some of the mundane damage boost type things while the perks refines the character with more specific abilities. Some of these perks per skill should also be unique to the class of the character, as Ledgend said in the last thread. (Edit: ^ There he is) A rogue would not use a blade the same way a warrior would, so things like this should be reflected. Same goes for magic between a mage and a battle mage, and so on.

I don't mind not having attributes, but the current perk system needs work.

What I would prefer, would be a Fallout-style perk system. No trees, just a list of perks that improve your character in various ways. That way, we could have perks that affect run speed without an athletics tree, unarmed perks that run off the 1 or 2-handed skills, perks that affect carry weight without a strength attribute, as well as perks that aren't necessarily tied to any particular skill, or perks that need multiple skills to unlock.

If you mean http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1434999-how-much-do-you-miss-the-tes-attributes-in-skyrim/, it's on the second page

And if a thread does disappear it might be worth contacting a moderator first, just in case there was a reason

Perks have never been a replacement for attributes. They're skill related, while attributes relate to your character's physical and mental being. It baffles me that people see it as an either / or thing.

Bring back attributes, add more skills to the game, and keep perks - BUT - scrap the idea of having trees with prerequisite perks... and also get rid of all of the pointless % increase perks that should be covered by regular skill progression.

Wow, this is strange. I checked the last 5 pages.

Dumb, dumb, dumb. Might as well continue here then. I was already coming up with complot theories...

@ Sheogorath: Yeah, scratching prerequisites sounds good.


I am also hoping for some kind of perks you can only get by doing certain things. If you join the mages guild and get to a certain rank (let us say 4 out of 10) you could choose to pick up a special perk. This is just an example. Find a hidden treasure and get the perk 'Treasure Hunter' which does x etc.

It's locked. 200 post limit

I welcome a return of Attributes, had nothing against them in the first place, really, but I actually like the freeform "classless" system they've created in Skyrim. So bring back one, and keep the other.

Why not have a race or class specific perk tree instead of attribute differences from the start (obviously I still want attributes to be there) as many do not like that Nords are stronger from the get-go etc.

Attributes are still there as are your racial bonuses.

I can see what the guys who miss the old school D & D character Sheet format miss though.

It's not really been enough to stop me from enjoying "Skyrim" though.

Az

I completely forgot about Attributes anyway. It's a fun RPG. I don't need a number assigned to every little thing to roleplay, y'know?