Okay so here's how I would balance all of this if it were up to me.

I would distinguish the difference between Bows and Crossbows like this:

Bows have a higher critical hit chance and Crossbows have higher armor penetration.
I would make that inherent to Bows/Crossbows and irrespective of enchantments.
I would then balance the damage between the Bows and Crossbows to be the same as their new counterparts would be;

Bows and Crossbows:

• Longbow = Crossbow
  
• Hunting Bow = Iron Crossbow
  
• Imperial Bow = Steel Crossbow
  
• Ancient Nord Bow = N/A As Ancient Nords didn't have Crossbows
  
• Orcish Bow = Orcish Crossbow
  
• Dwarven Bow = Dwarven Crossbow
  
• Elven Bow = Elven Crossbow
  
• Ebony Bow = Ebony Crossbow
  
• Glass Bow = Glass Crossbow
  
• Daedric Bow = Daedric Crossbow
  
• Dragonbone Bow = Dragonbone Crossbow

To me it makes sense that once this technology is out there that other groups will copy it in their own style; hence Orcish, Elven, Ebony, etc Crossbows.
So the Dragonbone/Daedric Crossbows wouldn't be ridiculously overpowered as they would have the same damage as their Bow counterparts, it's just they would pierce armour more instead of having a higher critical hit chance.
I would also make the Crossbows weigh more than the Bows, but the bolts weigh less than the arrows (as they are smaller).
Crossbows would also make more noise than Bows when fired, so stealthy characters may prefer to use Bows when sneaking around.
In this way hopefully creating a 'similar but different' feel to the Bows and Crossbows, so that there are distinct benefits to one over the other; but also so players can have their own unique style of one type, or the other, or both.

In terms of types of Bolts I would add, and make the damage the same as their arrow counterparts;

Types of Bolts:

• Iron Bolts
  
• Steel Bolts
  
• Silver Bolts
  
• Orcish Bolts
  
• Dwarven Bolts
  
• Elven Bolts
  
• Ebony Bolts
  
• Glass Bolts
  
• Daedric Bolts
  
• Dragonbone Bolts

I would make all arrow types and bolt types craftable with a new addition called a 'Fletching Table'.
This will be added in to blacksmiths, but in particular to the fletcher in Solitude - who will have a special, above average fletching table, similar in grandeur to the Skyforge of Whiterun. (Speaking of which if it were up to me smithing at the Skyforge would add a slight bonus to whatever you make, I don't know what)

I would also make arrows/bolts enchantable, and the level of your soul gem depict how many arrows/bolts you can enchant with one gem per batch.
I suggest;

Soul Gem to Arrow/Bolt Amounts:

• Grand Soul Gem = 50 Arrows/Bolts
  
• Greater Soul Gem = 40 Arrows/Bolts
  
• Common Soul Gem = 30 Arrows/Bolts
  
• Lesser Soul Gem = 20 Arrows/Bolts
  
• Petty Soul Gem = 10 Arrows/Bolts

Furthermore here is a list of enchantments I would make available to arrows/bolts (some of this is modelled off of the Skyrim Game Jam).
The strength of the enchantment would be directly related to your enchanting level.
For example; level 100 Enchanting makes the strongest arrow/bolt enchantments and it decreases from there.

I would make some of these enchantments perk-gated (so that a level 25 enchanter cannot make arrows/bolts that paralyze a target).
If I make no specifications otherwise, assume that the enchantment is a single target only. I.e. Number 4 (Fear) is only single target (This means that when you shoot someone with a fear arrow only they will be feared).

I have also ordered them in the way that I think they should be unlocked, to maintain a feeling of progression as enchanting level increases.
Of course you could also buy these from various vendors and I'm assuming there would be a suitable levelled list addition for various merchants to stock these.
But this is how I feel it should be in terms of making your own.

Types of Enchantments for Arrows/Bolts:

• Fire (Burst Damage/Area of Effect/Damage Over Time)
  
• Frost (Burst Damage/Area of Effect/Damage Over Time)
  
• Shock (Burst Damage/Area of Effect/Damage Over Time)
  
• Frenzy
  
• Calm
  
• Water (To put out lights as seen in Skyrim Game Jam)
  
• Fear
  
• Arc Magelight (This is an idea of mine that creates a string of magelight that follows the arrow/bolt's trajectory and remains for XX seconds. I.e. You shoot an arrow/bolt with this enchantment down a hallway and it leaves a stream of magelight in the air where it flew.)
  
• Soul Trap (Fiery too?)
  
• Turn Undead
  
• Damage (Health/Stamina/Magicka)
  
• Banish
  
• Drain (Health/Stamina/Magicka)
  
• Slow
  
• Paralyze

All enchantments should be visible on the arrow/bolt with some sort of effect; I.e. Soul Trap adds a purple aura to the arrow, Fire damage puts a cloth on fire on the arrow, etc.

ALSO, as a final note, I think it would be cool to make a Unique Dwemer Crossbow that is gas-automated and (similar to a revolver) can shoot maybe 6 bolts before needing to reload. It can be modelled slightly of the Crossbow from the film Van Helsing (but of course in true Dwemer style).
This is all I can think of at the moment, will edit it into the main post as I've sorted it better than the original post.

Show your support or let me know what you think; suggestions are welcome.
If someone wants to make a mod of this please go ahead (I'm not a very good modder), but I do hope Bethesda do it officially.

Personally, just glad for any crossbow! But why not dream.

I really like the idea of having crossbows made from other materials like Ebony and Daedric. Also your idea of having a crossbow that has six bolts pre-loaded so you don't have to reload the crossbow after every shot is pretty interesting. As for enchanting single and individual bolts and arrows, I'm fine with just enchanting the crossbows themselves

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Dwarven crossbows already equal/surpass Dragonbone bows. A Daedric crossbow? Well, that would be insane.

People on PC of course have already gotten this as a mod xD

http://www.google.com/imgres?um=1&hl=en&sa=N&rlz=1C1AVSH_enUS459US459&biw=1280&bih=629&tbm=isch&tbnid=amZMtt7DMlDLQM:&imgrefurl=http://skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/22113&imgurl=http://static.skyrim.nexusmods.com/mods/images/22113-5-1344605108.jpg&w=1680&h=1050&ei=MEpIUO-cLofPqgH_6YH4Dg&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=596&sig=102256819200540021074&page=1&tbnh=126&tbnw=174&start=0&ndsp=18&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:79&tx=68&ty=92

http://www.google.com/imgres?um=1&hl=en&sa=N&rlz=1C1AVSH_enUS459US459&biw=1280&bih=629&tbm=isch&tbnid=4Csq2_HwFNsu2M:&imgrefurl=http://forums.nexusmods.com/index.php%3F/topic/600490-sleeping-dangers-sands-of-time/page__st__1580&imgurl=http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/6881/daedriccrossbowbydjjojo.jpg&w=640&h=400&ei=MEpIUO-cLofPqgH_6YH4Dg&zoom=1&iact=rc&dur=323&sig=102256819200540021074&page=1&tbnh=103&tbnw=164&start=0&ndsp=18&ved=1t:429,r:15,s:0,i:126&tx=107&ty=78

It looks pretty good.

But of course, I understand you all are on systems. This I guess is... a teaser for if it's ever added

I dont like modded weapons, OP and not balanced with the whole game....
Results:
A release by Beth will be so much better.

I'm assuming the people posting here were more looking for a system release anyways. And there are people who balance the weapons to the game.

If you happen to find a weapon mod you like but find it too strong or too weak, learn to use creation kit. It wouldn't take long to modify a mod to adjust damage, not like you're making the weapons appearance.


And seeing how automatic crossbows and higher than dwarven lvl crossbows are wanted, I'd assume OP is what people want xD

If dwarven rivals dragon bone, than ebony and deadric will be OP regardless.

Everything that was here in my reply I edited into the original post as I had organised my ideas better; please refer to the original post in your responses.

Also need the ability to aim down the ironsights of the crossbow to make use of the archery slow-time perk.

?

You can already zoom in with the crossbow, and slow time

all archery perks go to crossbows

Yeh but it doesn't go ironsights and your character doesn't bring it up to his shoulder like a real person would when shooting a crossbow; in dawnguard, as far as i am aware, it just zooms in and fires from the hip.

dunno maybe it's supposed to be assumed that it does? Not sure.
I always assumed it did. I think it's more the idea of the mechanic rather than a full motion of raising the weapon towards your head.

I'm honestly not even sure if it has an iron sight, but I'd assume you would aim down the bolt rather than using a sight.

And if you did aim using an iron sight you'd have to center the entire crossbow which to me would look a bit awkward. I think the mechanic is the same just, the aesthetic appearance isn't quite the same.

Yeh well maybe not an 'iron sight' per say, but definitely looking down the bolt like you look down the arrow when you use a bow. In any case in 3rd person zooming should raise it so you hold it like a crossbow is really held. I believe when you first arrive at the Dawnguard there is a guy training with the crossbow that holds it at his shoulder like it should really be held.

try it out in third person. It probably is held there it just doesnt quite look like it in first person

what some of you dont understand, is yes Dwarven compares to Dragonbone in the game. But, the OP is saying that Dwarvan Crossbows should be brought down and be on par with Dwarvan Bows. and then add all the materials to make them on par with eachother.

Yeh pretty much.

I just assume the crossbow isn't meant to be a replacement to the bow so the bow still carries use.

Crossbow close - medium
Bow medium - far

only thing I can figure

As far as I know the modern crossbow can shoot just as far as the modern bow, and maybe a little faster (depending on the weight of the bolt). So I still seem them being able to shoot as far as the Bows do in Skyrim, maybe not as accurately. The one main disadvantage with crossbows compared to bows is reload time. For example if you play Medieval II: Total War (a strange example I know) the Crossbows take much longer to reload and fire again than the normal bows do, but they shoot just as far.

Hence Bows should be given a higher critical hit chance and crossbows the armor penetration. In that way they would be 'similar but different' and the player could choose to use one over the other, or both.

the more the better, can't complain about getting more content. although i think what we have got so far is as much as we are going to get where crossbows are concerned.

i am really hoping that future dlc add new types of weapons like dawnguard did, but from what i understand they only added crossbows because they were finally acknowledging the fact that with only bows there was no variety in ranged weapons.

Well whatever Bethesda won't do, modders will. Just would be nice to see it professionally done, especially since that (imo) the vanilla release of dawnguard should have had all these crossbow and crossbow bolt types in it already.

I hope their plan wasn't to add crossbows with hopes of bows becoming obsolete. As great as crossbows are, nothing could make me set aside my bow. I never leave the house without it.


I know that wasn't their plan but I still have to spread the love for the bow. Crossbows and house building is the talk of the town these days.


Edited for a typo

I don't think it was, but in any case that's why there should be distinct differences between bows and crossbows added. As it stands, at the moment, the enhanced dwemer crossbow is more useful than a dragonbone bow simply because of the armor penetration. But if we give the bows a higher critical hit chance, then there would be a reason to choose between a bow or crossbow, or to use both for different situations.

To be specific, the base damage of the Dragonbone Bow is 20 - and the base damage of the Enhanced Dwarven Crossbow is 22. When you add on to that the +50% armour penetration.... it's pretty clear that Crossbows (as they are at the moment) effectively replace Bows. With my suggestions I hope that they won't replace Bows, but merely offer an alternative.

Yeah I know that wasn't really their intention.


Anyway, the crossbows are definitely pretty powerful. My steel crossbow smithed to legendary status currently does the same amount of damage as my legendary Daedric bow. So obviously the Dwarven crossbow will be stronger than my legendary bow. It will probably be more powerful even without upgrading it through smithing.

Even with crossbows having significant power, I still choose my bow for most situations. Now that's not to say I always bypass the crossbow though. It is pretty fun putting a bolt between a vampires eyes!

Yeh for sure, that's why I still think they need to add more Crossbow types and rebalance them to be the same base damage as their bow counterparts (as outlined in the Original Post) - and then make the only damage difference between a Bow and a Crossbow the Critical Hit Chance/Armour Penetration (respectively). Of course Crossbows would weigh more than bows, and bolts would weigh less than arrows, though. Crossbows would also make more noise than bows when being fired, as they operate on a crank-type system. So stealthy characters may prefer the bow for stealthy situations.

currently yeah, the bow is more for long distance executions

And arrows and bolts have no weight