Would high level mages agree with this in general
Alteration: Fine, nice perks (armor spells arn't that great when compared to fancy enchanted high end armors but good enough)
Conjuration: Perfectly fine (unless you really care bound weapons don't scale)
Destruction: Fine until you get to 30-35 then dear god please have scaling damage?
Illusion: Level of creatures you can work magic on needs to scale? (Not sure as I Have yet to have a high skill in illusion on any of my characters)
Restoration: Fine.

It's not really true that magic is unscaled. Rather, it's only spells that are unscaled. The difference is significant.

Magic is indirectly scaled: you are able to use increasingly damaging spells as you acquire more magica. It is true that no single spell becomes more powerful as you level up, but it is also true that you are capable of casting more powerful spells as you level up. The only difference is that mele damage is directly increased by leveling up, while magic damage is increased by something else (magica) that increases by leveling up. Hence, even with magic, it is true that a player deals increasingly greater damage as he/she levels up, because the player is wise enough to upgrade his spells when he becomes more capable.

And once again...there are a limited amount of spells....

if ppl are playing as pure mage and not stacking magicka cost reduction, then that is their fault and we shouldnt consider their complaint valid since they arent playing their character the right way to be optimized for high level damage dealing. i dont care why they dont use "free spell casting" but since they have the option, but still complain they are either trolling or just dont know about this option.

another question to ask is who are we fighting? since we are comparing classes we could and might as well have been thinking in terms of PVP, which we all know other rules applies (i know we dont have pvp in skyrim, but i think u get my point)
so assuming the mage is smart enough to use the mana reduction items, and he actually only casts a 5 sec spell thats just being stupid, a mage needs to be mobile and smart. they can start off by casting it and then switch to fireballs or something else such as frost to slow down his opponent.

the mage is frail compared to a tanky warrior, but regardless of that the mage can still back off(or never be hit due to slow and paralyze) and keep avoiding damage, while the warrior will eventually run out of potions.

ill admit that melee does seem alot stronger in terms of direct burst, but the mage seems better for overall use.

I can get behind this. My only complaint is and has ever been that destruction doesn't scale. I think if you fixed that, everything else would be a non-issue.

There's a cap on melee damage too - even if you allow for enchantments and so on. So the fact that there are only finitely many spells is irrelevant. Unless the cap on melee damage is significantly higher than the cap on magic damage, you have nothing to complain about.

I'm a 2h warrior and almost never use health pots. When I get damaged I just switch to duel healing and run and then come back to win the fight easy. Mages use their mana for just about everything from damage to summons to healing so the "sheer size of manapool" when used for other spells actually gives the mage less mana for restoration than a warrior and a warrior takes 10-100x less damage with heavy armor so healing is much more efficient than a mage who has to heal after each hit he recieves.

This. This is the point I made is another thread of the same debate. Frankly, no one cares about this. Of course, you all do, but no one cares who is actually playing this game and doesn't feel the need to justify what they enjoy. You are arguing that Bethesda got it wrong, at the core of this argument. If you do that, gather and say let's prove them wrong. Don't do this. This debate among players about how bad the developers screwed up will get you nowhere. This game came out less than a week ago. Do not turn on each other so soon.

IMO the problem really isn't magic, it's that one handed+shield is insanely OP. The armor rating scales too high meaning you can forgo heavy armor, get 50% stamina regen which is insane in combat. Shield bash cancels any channeled effects, downed dragons will never breath on you again or casters will never unleash a nasty spell at you. Shield bash is really the biggest culprit because of these.

I quit my playthrough on master because of how easy it is, feel like I've already won that.

Good to know mages are tough in late levels, I want the challenge. It is fun finding the OP [censored] though.

I don't know if you're just trolling or not. So much evidence has been said already that warriors are far superior.

Pretty much all warriors use and abuse the duel healing spell and run when low on health since they don't use mana for anything else and most don't use potions. Mages can kite and a while but eventually they will run out of mana and get hit unless you just run far far away.

Mages are not better for overall use in any way, shape or form, warriors are way better. Warriors just faceroll into 10 man mobs with heavy armor and just two buttom mash everyone. The mage has to take a while to think, summon creatures, wait for mana to replenish, go in, kite, or use illusion which takes a while for enemies to kill each other. If this is for a couple battles it's more challenging and fun but for more people who fight thousands of battle, they'd rather just get the objectives done and faceroll with warrior.

Exactly my point. You switch to alternative methods to ensure your survival. The very point I have been trying to make to destruction casters. You are a straight 2h damage based class, rolling out massive amounts of damage. Even then, you rely on mana and spells to finish a fight. The point I made is that these particular few are dead set on using only destruction and are saying the game is unbalanced because of that.

Some would have claimed that your class is seriously overpowered and shouldn't be given unfair advantages. You have unknowingly proven again to them that you must utilize other perks and skills to efficiently proceed any fight.

um no. the healing spell everyone knows and I never put any perks into it. I don't rely on mana to finish a fight but healing comes in handy often (i mean why not use mana if it's only for healing and almost always full) and I never put any points into mana cuz it's not necessary beyond healing.

It's not only the damage superiority, much if it is the armor and health superiority. But I'm glad you realize warriors are superior in just about every way to mages (damage/defence/health).

I don't recognize that, sorry. I'm out for the night on that note. Will read more tomorrow.

moderators have said not to create these sorts of threads any more. It's clear who is right and who is wrong, let's stop trying to educate those living in a bubble.

And evidently you've been tasked with speaking on the moderators' behalf?

Yep, Destruction Spells are disappointing... thankfully you can use the exact same build as your mage, and replace Destruction with Archery and achieve greater results. (add in Sneak for extra ridiculous damage, just to spite the Destruction spells)