I was refering to the training part.

Ive already said that i want PA to generally be unlootable, that i want repair to be difficult and i want it to be difficult to acquire

Don't have that... :shrug:

In Fallout the BOS kept to their bunker, and the only ones found off of the compound were either dead or unarmored.
PA'd troops should be the devil to beat, for a low level PC, and the methods they have (if they have) should usually ruin the armor for anything but scrap sale.

A like new near mint suit of PA should be as rare as a live cat IMO.

**Here's an option (that goes against my earlier thoughts).... Make PA's unrepairable (No one will have the means in some shanty town, and there is no guarantee that any facility still exists that can either (The rig was destroyed).
Having no means to repair it would mean that you'd need to get another one eventually ~not my favorite idea, but it removes the "camping in power armor" dilemma.
(the means could perhaps be found in the end game)

i think training should be needed. I dont know why people oppose it, it makes sense! also i think it should be unlootable unless you have a great repair skill that allows you to figure out how to remove the power armour. and further more i want power armour to increase the stature of the wearer. In fallout 1 & 2 BoS guys were sorta scary (they looked like they were 8 feet tall!), and some of the FO3 concept art was awesome, like the paradise falls one which shows 5 slavers standing abriast over a dead BoS, and the corpse looks huge compared to them!

also in fallout 3, you encounter dead BoS when you go to GNR.... that is REALLY early in the game, way to early for power armour

A new idea: Damaged Power Armor

As we all know, Power Armor is different from normal armor because of its artificial intelligence systems. And we suppose that when the wearer of PA got killed, the system was already broken, and it couldn't be repaired by the normal wasteland technicians.

Various "Power Armors" are replaced by "Damaged Power Armor" (like "Damaged Brotherhood Power Armor", "Damaged Outcast Power Armor", "Damaged Enclave Power Armor", etc.) in the droplist of enemies and loots. The damaged ones have the same DR as the normal ones, but with no DT, Rad Resistance and STR boost, which are due to the lack of A.I. systems. So, "Damaged Power Armor" is only a normal armor with relative high DR.

Some suggestions:

-Remove "Power Armor Training" perk
-"Power Armor" drops change to "Damaged Power Armor" (A.I.systems are broken in combat)
-"Power Armor" from merchants change to "Damaged Power Armor" (most merchants' goods come from scavenging)
-Most "Power Armor" random loots change to "Damaged Power Armor"
-Several specific "Power Armor" loots (e.g BoS armor case)
-Several specific "Power Armor" sellers (e.g. BoS quartermaster)
-Several unique "Power Armors" (e.g. Hardened T-51b)
-"Power Armor" can be repaired by "Damaged Power Armor" (supposed that Dean Electrics have informations about circuits and chips)
-"Damaged Power Armor" can be repaired by "Damaged Power Armor" (only change damaged plates)
-"Power Armor" has a relative higher price than "Damaged Power Armor"
-"Damaged Power Armor" can be gained in early games
-"Power Armor" can only be gained in late games

If it's supposedly really powerful, I usually don't expect to come across it until late in the game, following the RPG Law of Equivalent Gear Upgrading, which states as an example "Wooden Stick to Knife, Knife to Rusty Sword, Rusty Sword to Greatsword, Greatsword to Magical Bastard Sword of End-Boss-Pwning."

Ah sorry, I didn't read through the whole thread.


That's a really good idea, if we had a rep system here I'd give ya a +1.

PA should weigh like 100 pounds when its not being used, and since it wont apear until late game they will probably just ignore training as they should, its not like putting on armor is that hard.....

it's not the easy though. it is a sophisticated piece of technology, that is like saying flying a fighter jet is like driving a car.

as i can see from the other replies, most people want it to "be rarer", or "harder to repair", or so "followers cant wear it", but i like it how it was in F3. i liked the fact that you could obtain it fairly easy and if you maxed out your repair you get get its condition to 100%. it is just a game and it needs to be fun, and for me, have a bunch of power armor is fun. :fallout: New Vegas

How about keeping power armor training as an item gate, but give it tiered effectiveness, ex:

Tier 1: +1 ST, -2 AG
Tier 2: +2 ST, -1 AG
Tier 3: +3 ST, +/- 0 AG

And as a further embracing of both c&c and western roleplaying ideals, you give players multiple options to acquire said training, making the item gate flexible.

Perhaps you could buy it as a holodisk containing the training from a shady info broker, you could find it at some hidden prewar cache that you have to break into, you could get it from another faction that has access to power armor through other means, you could sneak into a brotherhood compound and download a copy to your pipboy... I say yes to c&c, but also to intelligent options that reward the player for lateral thinking.

Rule number one of Power Armor: You don't talk about Power Armor.

so I say "Damaged Power Armor", it's neither rare, nor hard to repair, and followers can wear it. If you get an unique Power Armor from some specified place early in the game and repair to a higher condition, you'll be fun.

PA should weigh 500 to 600 pounds by itself when worn... but in the game (Fallout 1 & 2) its said to be made of lightweight materials (ceramic composites for ADVMKII). :shrug:

Power armor would make a person physically powerful enough to fight a supermutant HtH, and wield a minigun ~The original Fallout let you pull a minigun from out of your vault suit, but the FO series has been thrust into a realism rut, and so I would say that miniguns should require PA to use at all.

Its so sophisticated that a raw recruit can use it after a 15 minute course (and by that I mean that it is very very automated). Training IMO should not be needed (Though a stat/skill check might be cool to figure out how to get inside).
Training should allow access to non-intuitive features and greater advantages from its use.

PA may have a weight of 150 pounds and have a stat of +300 carry weights (while wearing).

id prefer if they didnt make every npc able to wear it except you unless you get training that always bugged me about fo3 i can have all my companions/followers in pa but until i get training from citadel i cant wear it

Still don't like the idea of multiple ways to learn how to use it.
"Oh, you messed that part up? Don't worry, there is another way to get it over here."
"Oh man... You messed that part up? No problem no problem, there's another way to get it over there."
I don't like that.
You should get one, maybe two chances to get it, and if you screw yourself over at both then it's your loss.
If we get too many ways to aquire it it doesn't feel like a real reward.
Just feels like the inevitable way for every single player to be able to get to use that armor no matter what they do or who they side with.

My way, you'd still wind up having to work for it, so there's no free ride. It's also not so linear.

I say NO to requiring training to wear it, since all that is is an artificial means of delaying when you get to actually use it. In addition to that, when you finally did get training (at least, pre-O:A) the armor turned out to be almost not worth the bother in the first place.

In FO1, the only way you could get a suit of PA was by running an errand in The Glow for the BoS. This turned out to actually be pretty easy to do since there is no opposition in The Glow, although you did need to bring a bunch of anti-rad supplies. The problem was that this could be done at an early level due to the aforementioned lack of opposition, which made combat for most of the rest of the game much less of a hassle.

In FO2 you cannot get PA prior to running an errand for the BoS in Navarro. This could also be done at an early level, which did not help, but was exacerbated by the fact you could get something even better while in Navarro- Advanced Power Armor Mk I. Now, getting to Navarro meant avoiding Enclave patrols, but with frequent saving and taking small trips in the general direction of the base that wasn't hard to manage. Once in Navarro, though, not only was there no opposition but the recruitment officer told you where to find it.

Now, I am loath to block a particular means of getting one's hands on PA, however at the same time it really should not be obtainable right off the bat. Between this and the above scenarios, about the only way I can think of to insure you have to be high level to get it would be to seal it away behind an incredibly hard lock guarded by some of the toughest opposition in the game. Talking your way to it would not be an option under this setup though, which goes against the idea of allowing multiple paths through the game. That said, a character specializing in Speech wouldn't necessarily have need of PA as such a character would be built with the intent of avoiding fighting wherever possible; however, there might well be situations that call for some 'gunboat diplomacy', at which point it would come in handy.

As far as repairing it is concerned, I would say that the armor's condition should affect whether or not it is field-repairable, as well as how much restoration the repairs actually accomplish:
From 75% CND on up, repairs can be done in the field at no penalty
From 50-74%, field repairs are 2/3 effective
From 25-49%, field repairs are 1/3 effective
Below 25%, field repairs cannot be done at all

Handling the armor reaching 0 CND could get tricky: if there are multiple suits available, then a suit at 0 CND would only be eligible to be broken down for parts, but if there is only one obtainable then that is not practical and something else would need to be implemented as well as the determination made on whether or not the PC him/her self is allowed to fix a suit that's been trashed.

1st: i would like PA to be rare....it would feel more rewarding when you obtain it.
2nd: i believe you should be trained in it...why?..because something that heavy would effect your movement,your muscle use & accuracy when aiming in my opinion,so training would fare in that aspect.
3rd: i also believe that people are saying it would make you (a tank) or super tough,maybe explaining why it should be more rare.But on the other hand i dont think it would make you a tank or super tough...why?
because 1,explosives would damage power armor & 2, the fact there are different ammo's to use aswell as mods for your weapons.
It will no dought make you alot tougher ( and it should..because of the DT & DR it will have )..but i get the idea that some people think it may make you too tough,which i disagree with.
but that being said, with all the different ammo & mods to weapons & possible very powerfull power armor, it makes the game more tatical in my opinion,making you think a little more about enemies & adding more fun element too.....i think this will be a great game
thankyou

PS: this is my first post, so hi to all & love all the comments etc (forums are great).

Welcome to the forum :foodndrink:

(Most folks would now offer you a http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj125/Gizmojunk/Dino-Fishy.jpg :laugh:)

As to point 1: I think most of us want it to be rarefied in some way
point 2: You likely feel no weight of it at all if worn, as the machine endeavors to avoid you as you move... Out-stretch your arm and it outstretches its own.
point 3: (see point 2). The armor "effectively" adds strength and weight ~should add Stamina; this "effectively" makes you tougher.

IMO if you are actually stronger than the PA, it should reduce your strength; more agile, then it should reduce agility... You don't wear it, you get in it ~same as getting in a tank.

........


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Do you....like fish sticks?

.............i like fishsticks........

EDIT: also, cmon guys. this is a little too much realism dont you think? its just a game made to be fun for everyone right?

There are "Power Armor"(rare, specific loot) and "Damaged Power Armor"(not rare, normal loot, e.g. dead bodies).
Power Helmet is intergrated into Power Armor (PE boost due to targeting system)
Power Armor: WGT 150, carry weight +300, Sneak -25, ST +2, PE +1, DR +x, DT +y, Rad Resist +z
Damaged Power Armor: WGT 150, carry weight +0, Sneak -50, ST +0, PE +0, DR +x, DT +0, Rad Resist +0

Best idea since ever

The case was that only high end government troops had PA ~No one else had access (or the facilities to maintain it). So I'd prefer that the armors only show up with BOS or Enclave troops (not necessarily living ones). The Enclave fights were dangerous ~actually dangerous to the PC (even if armored in PA); Fights in NV against more than one PA wearing opponent (which should be all of the fights), should carry that same player unease. (IMO same should go for Nightkin)

Did anyone here watch "Ghost in the Shell"? The cyborgs in it were superhuman, but needed weekly maintenance at a specialized facility; PA's could perhaps need the same?
How about PA's impose agility penalties when not maintained above a certain condition?