I know there are countless threads talking about adding weapons and spells to Skyrim, and most people I see mention wanting Polearms (spears/halberds) and spell combinations (like in the game jam) in skyrim.

My questions is, if implemented in Skyrim it will have to add a new skill tree for those abilities, also adding new perks and raising the level cap
And how will it affect the overall game and also what about sneak type characters? What new skill will they get? (throwing weapons/darts?)

Please say if you think new skill trees should be implemented and what skill if any, also how many? Example: Polearms and Flails for warrior, spell combinations and ??? For mages, Ect.

I'm just a little confused how will it be implemented into the exciting "classes" cause you can't just stick Polearms into One handed or two handed IMO. Same with spell combinations where the hell will they go???

On a side topic, I really like the way the werewolf and VL perk tree works, the more you "feed"/"use" the more perk point you can get in that Specific skill tree. Unlike if you level only two handed you can invest a point into alteration, which makes no sense. And although I really like the idea of perks points specific to the skills you use how will it affect leveling? (separate exp points for leveling?) and also you can practice every skill in the game and eventually have Every perk in the game if you choose so, which will create god characters. But, also make sense cause the more you practice something the better you get in it and learn new things in that skill.

Thanks for any imput, I need help sorting my thoughts around possible additions to the game.

They will NOT add new skill trees that effect leveling.

Polearms can go under 2 handed weapons

Darts and throwing knives can go under ranged

Spells would still be effected by their governing skill

Issues solved.

Why not? You have a limited number of perk points, so it's not like you could perk your usual rollout + all the new stuff.

I thought about that too, but I still can't help get my head around that cause. Using a poll arm is a lot different than a sword or a war hammer. I'm proficient in martial arts and using a swords in miles away from using a staff. Also throwing knifes and darts ect. Are miles away from archery with bows/crossbows. Spell could work but I just think if a perk tree was implemented it could offer awesome perks for various spell combos.

That's when you roll out a new character.

Huh? I don't care about starting new characters I love doing them. Im just trying to brainstorm with all you guys about how (if it was implemented in game) will it be done. Should they add new skills? Should they not? How will they add them? Ect. Plus my other question: how do you guys feel about if all perks/skills in the next TES were like Werewolf/VL perks?

If they put things under existing skills then there is no need for respecing or additional perks.

Using a mace is different then using a sword, yet they are under the same skill. Its not about styles, its about the simple defining characteristic of "Does it use 1 hand or 2 hands". The game isn't trying to be realistic.

The level cap of 81 is based off every skill being at 100. Tossing in a new skill will alter the dynamic of the already high level cap when the game "stops" at level 50. The only thing we gain from a higher level cap is more perk points and more health/stamina/magicka, which we do not need unless they included comparable scaled content.

We get 80 perks out of a possible ~250. Why do we need more? You are not meant to have a crap ton of perks in every skill.

I totally agree we don't "need" more levels or perks but, it would be plainly weird to lump Polearms into existing skills. I never used a mace but with a axe you pretty much use it like a sword you swing and hope to hit your opponent and you swing in a "slashing" motion, I assume maces aren't too different. With a spear or staff you don't try to slash your opponent (although you can) you try and "stab" at them. Thus leading me to believe a new skill tree might be needed.

And with throwing weapons they can't go into archery cause that makes no sense at all!
Its 2 different worlds entirely!

Also I wouldn't mind more skill trees I don't see them hurting the game most of my characters never reach above 50-55 anyway.

Sorry double post

It is purely animation differences. In the end, the perks that effect them would be exactly the same, negating the need for a special tree or skill.

Axes and maces are rather different in usage. Swords can slice through the air making their motions based more on a single fluid movement, where as a mace benefits more on its weight to make one powerful smash. This is why maces and axes were preferred against heavily armored foes, because they used raw force.

Also, your logic is a bit flawed, because swords like rapiers are made for stabbing as well.

Not really. How they are used, sure, but as i said above, that is purely an animation difference. The perks would be the same. At the end of the day, they are all based off the same core concept of marksmanship.

I completely see your points friend, but still I'm having trouble wrapping my head around it being lumped into those skills (it could just be my problem than )

I and about the sword (I've been training in kendo with various other martial arts for 15 years now) I can tell you yes, rapiers were meant for stabbing also short swords like the Romans uses. But Katanas and long swords were used both for slashing and stabbing, but most of the technique training and fighting techniques learned with those weapons are slashes mixed with a few stabbing techniques. And although when your fighting in Skyrim with a long sword or katana you don't do stabbing motions (I'm actually disappointed the forward power attack wasn't like in Oblivion, a straight forward one/two handed stab) you do get kill animations of stabs which is good enough cause a stab through your body should finish any one.

Those players who max out every single skill would be more than happy to reach ever higher levels. So let them. Meanwhile, serious TESers would enjoy new skills which could potentially open up entirely new character builds and retire the character at 50, as per usual.

Then let me throw this out there.

They will NEVER add on new skills with a DLC. This changes the core mechanics of the game, which DLCs would never be made to do. DLCs are meant to touch on the core game as little as possible, which is why the werewolf and vampire trees are not skills. If they added new skills, and somone was at this new max level, what would happen if you uninstalled the DLC? Thats right, your game would more then likely become corrupted.

Yep I see whey you mean with the corrupted savd thing. But I do t see how they can't be applied just like the Werewolf/VL perk trees except they affect your level. If you uninstall the game after getting skill pints and perks and levels with those skills I'm sure it could simply take them out with out too much difficulty. I uninstalled DG and when when on a savd I did the whole quest for it just if non of it happened and than I could do the whole thing over again. Maybe Thr new skills should be implemented through a mandatory update, but the actual DLC gives you the weapons to use with those skills. Idk? that's why I'm confused about this whole issue.

Or the game would force you to uninstall the whole of Skyrim. Problem?

I seriously doubt the percentage of players that uninstall a DLC yet keep playing the core game is anywhere remotely significant.

The same way Crossbows are under Archery, Polearm would be under 2-handed. I'm not sure why it's difficult to grasp? They won't change the level cap. Also, there is always the addition of skills that don't add to the maximum level.

For example, if they ever had spell making, they could make a skill tree for it similar to VL/Werewolf trees, where it doesn't have to do with your level. But Spears/Polearms? They won't get their own trees. They'll be one/two-handed.

Uninstalling the whole game wouldn't solve the corruption. You would have to start a whole new game or revert to a save before the DLC was even added.

You greatly underestimate the reasons why people would need to uninstall a DLC.
What would the the purpose of adding them like the vampire/werewolf skills? What would make them so special that swords dont get their own tree, or maces, or hell, crossbows?

Your concern is only based on real life uses of the weapons, which is clearly a non-issue because other weapons are clumped into a single skill. Your are just looking for a problem that's not there.

The last thing I'm trying to do us look for a problem, I'm sorry it came off that way. Just thought it will be interesting plus help make sense of it discussing it here.

There is nothing to make sense of. The aforementioned way of plopping new weapons into existing skills makes perfect sense.

I agree with Echonite - any new weapons would get lumped into 1/2 handed, and any new skills HAVE to be implemented like the werewolf and vamp lord trees.

No need for more levels and perk points - we have a (relatively) limited number of perk points for a reason.

I totally understand all these points and agree to an extant. Now saying that, I still don't see why implementing more skills, perks and levels will hurt the game, but just make it more diverse especially for RP reasons. But your points make sense although I think more perks for more weapons/abilities makes more sense.

^This^

There's really not much else you can say after that.

Sure, lets add 50 new skills and a max level of 200!

More skills means faster leveling. More perks would only aggregate the "demi-god" the player already becomes by level 81. So "Why not?" you ask? Because its unnecessary. Bethesda could if they wanted, but they wont. Its not the game they want.

You almost sound like you actually do not want new skills... If Beth won't add them, it won't be because of uninstallation issues, as they could easily find a fix for that. How many hundreds of RPGs are there where expansions raise the level cap?

Ah, I see your issue now. But it really is a non-issue. Why? Because you can't, for example, shoot a bow and swing an axe at the same time. You either use one or the other. Maxing both those trees won't improve your character much compared to leveling, say, sneak and one-handed. The problem arises from skills such as crafting which will greatly buff you no matter what build you chose, and which certain players almost feel forced to level.

So, for example, a tree dedicated to exotic weapons would just give you a new gameplay style choice, and wouldn't make you stronger like smithing would. Who would max archery, one-handed, two-handed, exotic and unarmed skills other than those peculiar players that absolutely must reach the level cap for some reason? And they wouldn't make you level any faster because, as I said, you can't swing an axe and shoot a bow at the same time.