Love my keyboard and mouse.

*raises hand* Yep, that'd be me . Err... actually, I only assume I'd svck at using a controller. I've never actually used one . It's what you're used to using, I guess. I was using keyboard & mouse... well, I guess before gamepads existed? So those just feel completely natural to me. I doubt I could adapt easily.

Yeah, not a very nice title at all

Yes, we are, the PC is objectivelly more powerful than any other platform. That's just the objective truth.

I find controllers to be unrealistically slow and clunky. Sounds like you like the controller because you svck at keyboard and mouse... see, don't assume things. It's ok to have a preference that differs from your own.

Yes. Utterly preposterous that people might have opinions and preferences that differ from your own.

I can't stand to use a controller with first person games. BGS games have always been first person (third person wasn't even an option until Morrowind, no I'm not counting Redguard) and they were always built with mouse and keyboard in mind. Mouse and keyboard is just more natural and objectively better. Controllers are sluggish and are not nearly as accurate. I can shoot with acute precision with a mouse and keyboard. It's impossible to have the same results with a controller, which is why developers will often incorporate magnetism to assist controllers in hitting their target. I only use controllers for action games, but never first person.

*For the record, I grew up a console gamer and played console shooters competitively such as Goldeneye, Halo: CE, CoD, etc., so I'm very proficient with a controller. They just aren't as good, even if they are more comfortable.*

I guess I've always thought of it as seeming unnatural in games. Very few actual people sans expert marksman can spin around and hit a target with dead accuracy. I've seen some people playing with K&M and their screen is crazy bouncing all over the place shooting at this and that. Not very realistic to me. But for sure it's more accurate I never mentioned anything about that. And sure it's preference but an argument FOR K&M can't be that you're just bad at controllers

Keyboard and Mouse easily excel in all areas except comfort. I acknowledge K&M superiority but since theirs no competition in FO4, I'll be using either my 360 controller or steam controller (whatever gives best enjoyment). I work 12-18 hours a day with a K&M so this also is a big factor when choosing the controller over the K&M.

Bottom line:

Guess what, Raiders and Mutants will still get disintegrated by the Mini-Nuke shot from my FATMAN when I squeeze the right trigger!

I personlly find the controller weird, bulky and uncomfortable. I never understood all the hype.

lol, I love sitting up straight clicking opposed to laying down/head on pillow. And lap desks? LOL!

I've used both forms of controls nearly as long as they've existed (well, my use of keyboards only goes back to 1980... ). And, like all tools, I find each of them better for different tasks. Like I said earlier, I use controllers for games they work better for - platformers, 3rd-person action-y games, racing, sports, JRPG.... things that were designed to work with controllers & on consoles. And I use M&K for "computer" games - RTS, FPS, strategy, WRPG, things like that. Sure, each of those types of games can use either, now that so many get ported to PC & console. But that doesn't change that controllers are lousy for things that need quick accuracy (since you aren't moving a crosshair to a specific point, but "pushing" your crosshair up or down towards the place you want, with acceleration/decel/overshoot/etc), and that keyboards are lousy for things that need smooth pushing (steering, etc.)

Do I have a contoller for my PC? Sure.... things like Bastion, the driving sections of Rage, and Dirt 3, were awful with keyboard controls. But I'd still never try to use the thing for shooting in Rage or any other FPS. Or to play Civilization, or Wasteland 2, or....

(and yeah - I play my computer games like I have for 35 years. In a chair at a desk. I've no desire to lounge on a couch while doing so. )

Eh, I'm playing a game and looking for good gameplay, not "accurate realism" or simulation. And I've shot guns & bows before. It's not the same as wiggling a mouse.... but it's also not as clumsy as waggling a thumbstick, either.

(god, trying to aim in Uncharted 1 was terrible. Nudge the stick a bit up, overshoot above the target. Nudge it down, overshoot the other direction. Nudge up, whoops got a bit of side motion there, too. Now I'm high and left. Try to correct, try to correct, try to correct.... now the NPC moves to a different bit of cover and I've got to start all over again. And somewhere in here, his buddy flanks my cover and shoots me in the back. I wasn't able to get past like the second fight in the demo, died half a dozen times. Aiming an actual rifle is nothing like that.)

Mouse and Keyboard all the way (I can't hit the frontside of a large (and non-moving!) barn with a controller...tried it at a friend's place (Playstation controller and me trying to play COD -.- damned, I felt like a damned monkey - while being competent with a mouse and keyboard (even in fast paced shooters like BF4))

And be honest: Why use a - IMHO - crappy controller (the only advantage might be force-feedback, if the controller has that), if you have a mechanical gaming keyboard (a Roccat Ryos MK Pro) and a good mouse (also Roccat: a Kone XTD)?

Even more so: Even a crappy mouse and keyboard are more precise (for aiming) and have more keys you can assign to whatever function you want (Hell: I could use makros with my keyboard if I wanted to!)...controllers are only good for playing games like Mario Cart IMHO (it's not a master-race thing for me...I'd buy a console - if I could plug in mouse and keyboard (!) - because of the exclusive titles (like HALO!), but with a controller? - No way, I don't even play Assassin's Creed with one (and that's made for a controller - unlike most FPS-Games!))

greets LAX

ps: I have an X-Box controller for PC but I don't use it -.- (as I said: I am too used to the mouse/keyboard (I have been playing PC-Games for over 20 years now and I am just familiar with those two devices - after all, I started out playing with both as a kid (I was 6 when my cousin let me try DOOM - and I got my dad's old PC after that (to play on))

Agree with the first sentence.

Disagree with the Steam Controller, even if it may seem nice. But the ones we got shown so far (not finished product) was rather cheap plastic. So I would stick to a 360 Controller as of now.

Anyway: I used to play my games with KB&M, therefore I stick to it. It's not a racing game or something like that. It just feels way smoother that way.

I don't get peoples problems with the term PC Master Race. Then again, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMzd40i8TfA.

I actually haven't tried a steam controller, it looks kinda odd in m opinion, but I would love to test one at some point.

I usually don't have any problems, though I do feel it in my wrist if I've been using a laptop.

IDK for me controllers always had this kinda clunky element I can't handle, I like controllers for fighting and racing games, but that's about it.

That's an interesting point. One that applies differently to shooters, than RPGs. For a shooter, one assumes that the game should let the player be as accurate as they are able; (and control issues being detrimental to the gameplay). But in RPGs, the PC might well be and expert marksman ~irrespective of the player's accuracy; and then personal accuracy (both expert and poor) can become either a cheat or a hindrance... neither of which should affect the PC. A developed [expert] marksman should make most of their shots (because they are experts, not because the player is good with a mouse or controller); and of course the novice marksman should not make most of their shots (because they are not experts), and player's accuracy shouldn't change that.

For the life of me, I can no longer aim with a controller as well as I use to. When I switched to PC I was a lot better with a controller, but as I used it less and less the skills seem to have faded. And for me, not being able to hit what is an easy target annoys me.

On this forum? On this internet? Surely you jest!

Yes, but the only way to do that would be to go back to a diceroll system, and I can't imagine that happening. And besides then you would rely on character skills, that in most cases aren't good in the beginning, so you could never start as a competent marksman (at least I have yet to come across a game that let's you do this). But to be fair, aiming isn't that hard, so being a master marksman isn't hard. And if you want to roleplay someone who svcks in a gunfight, you could miss on purpose I guess.

And dicerolls in a first person game seems to bother people (of people who complain about Morrowind, that seems to be the main complaint), so adding it to Fallout would probably cause backlash, unless they used a more oldschool rpg layout with top down view and point and click mechanics. And I don't think they will. It might be your dream, but I have a hard time seeing Beth doing that.

Of course, how silly of me.

once I get a pc that can run fallout 4, kb&m, but until I do, it'll be the xbox one controller.

and @Emberoth, just because one has a more powerful machine doesn't give one the right to be an ass about such things.

Eh, I've been using computers & consoles for decades now. And the whole stupid "PC Master Race" thing, while it may have started as a cutesy joke, has mutated into an annoying, elitist, etc.... blah, just more Internet PvP tribalism, part of the whole "trash talking people to make them feel worse/me feel better" scene. No "truth", just people trying to put others down in order to prop up fragile egos. (just like in every other stupid opinion/tribalism argument out there. "You drink ! You're an idiot" "Your sports team svcks, ours is awesome" "You shop at . What a moron, I shop at I'm smarter than you!" )

I've used both and for me I just prefer using the controller. I've played the original grand theft auto's all through GTA III on PC with k&m and then switched to consoles. I've played Dragon Age Origins with K&M and Skyrim with both. Both have their advantages and disadvantages. Keyboard does offer more options but using the mouse to look around in first person drives me up the wall. It's too sensitive imo, I over shoot all the time. And when I'm moving the mouse to look around I run out of desk and have to fix the mouse. Usually while I'm being attacked and trying to turn around then I'm dead. The best comarison I can come up with is it's like working with an old type writer and constantly having to slide it back into place to continue typing. I just cannot use mouse in first person.

Oh and I thought it would be some kind of hipster gibberish.

Actually I never used that term nor heard it in any professional area.

When I first read this, my german indoctrination came to mind "PC....Master Race?! WTF!". Crossed this with the nazi [censored] we got taught our whole life (in germany).

But the term itself is just plainly wrong. It's just hardware, in the end.

And back in the days of Xbox/early 360 days, those have been far superior! (Well after some copyright infringements, a new OS and stuff .)

Enough off-topic on my end.