Why don't followers have any depth to them?

Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:24 am

WARNING: LONG POST AHEAD!!!

One huge advantage that Oblivion and Skyrim have over Morrowind in terms of immersion is the fact that most of the characters in the former games have unique dialogue, personalities, and backstories. Morrowind's NPCs had almost exactly the same dialogue. Copy-pasted, in fact. The few NPCs who actually had personalities and backstories tended to be the most beloved by fans, such as Crassius Curio (Vivec's local town pervert) or Yagrum Bagarn (the last living Dwemer). However, they become so beloved because they stuck out like a sore thumb in a world of interchangeable NPCs with personalities on par with talking vending machines.

Oblivion and Skyrim, however, got it right. Although there's less dialogue overall, most of it is unique and specialized. Each person seems to have their own schedule and personality, even those who have no gameplay significance whatsoever. For example, there's a guy in the Imperial City who leaves his wife every Sundas to go and sleep in the bed of another woman. Bethesda gave him his own little "personality" (even if it was shallow and undeveloped), despite him having no gameplay significance whatsoever, simply for the sake of enhanced realism.

Yeah, Skyrim and Oblivion got it right... except for one problem: The followers.

Followers in Skyrim are about as bland and interchangeable as they come. All the housecarls have the exact same lines of dialogue... literally the EXACT SAME LINES! All of them have no backstory (they don't even appear in the game until they're appointed to your service), and no personality whatsoever. The Heirlings are much the same way; they'll fight by your side if you pay them five hundred gold... and that's the extent of their character.

The one-off followers aren't much better, eiter:

-There's a breton in Markarth who will be your follower if you give him a beer. So... he's a drunk. That's it; that's his character.

-Uthgerd the Unbroken of Whiterun and Benor of Morthal both love to brawl... aaaaand there's really nothing to them except that.

-Faendel and Sven are involved in a love triangle that you can resolve in two minutes flat. When that's done, their interestingness comes to a screeching hault.

Sure, there are SOME followers out there with personalities, such as...

-Mjoll the Lioness, a selfless retired adventuress with a heart of gold who will reminise about her past adventures when you enter places.

-Serana, a Vampire with a psychopath dad and overprotective mom who was locked in solitary confinement for a thousand years, while somehow retaining her sanity. She actually goes through a character arc throughout the Dawnguard questline!

-J'zargo, an overcompetitive cat-wizard who spent years searching for the right magic school so he could concentrate on his work without worrying about politics.

-Cicero, an assassin who spent only a few years in solitary confinement, but failed where Serana had succeeded and actually went bats**t insane.

However, these instances are as few and far between as the Morrowind examples I just gave. Most of the followers in the game (excluding user-created mods) could just as easily have been pumped out by a "make your own follower" machine added by a user mod.

The biggest sin in all of this is... the followers need personalities more than anyone else! They're the people you're going to be spending the most time with, the ones you will be getting to know most intimately (not necessarily in a romantic sense). They're the ones who need the MOST depth!

So... can somebody please make a mod that will give each follower some complexity? Here's some examples to start with:

Faendel

What drove him to live in Skyrim? He has his own house in Riverwood, so he's obviously been living there a while, so what drove him to do so? Also, what are his thoughts on the Aldmeri Dominion, seeing as how his is one of three races which make up that nation?

Lydia

I often fantasize about a movie being made about Skyrim's main quest... one of the creative changes that I picture is that Lydia accompanies the Dovakiin to Sovnarde, where she meets up with her dead mother. She explains to her mom that she's following in her footsteps by being a housecarl, and her mother is extremely proud, telling Lydia "In my life, I only served a Jarl. But you... you serve the DRAGONBORN! The only higher honor would be to serve Talos himself!"

This, I think, would be an INCREDIBLE backstory to give Lydia in-game! Maybe you could make it so that the player could ask her why she chose to become a housecarl, and she can tell you that her mother died when she was only a little girl, protecting the at-the-time Jarl of Whiterun, and she dropped out of school to focus on training in combat so she could follow in her mother's footsteps and make her proud as she watches from Sovngarde.

Those are just some suggestions to give the modder who takes up this request some starting material. I hope somebody can add similar depth and personality to every other follower in the game that I just gave to Lydia.

Any takers?

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Emily Rose
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 7:53 am

I agree completely. They should have fleshed out the followers a lot more than they did. I understand the reasoning behind the Housecarls being bland, because they're just bodyguards basically. However, each and every follower should have been a bit more characterized. While there are a few such as Roggi Knot-Beard and Mjoll (as you mentioned) who have some depth to them as well as some backstory, the rest are pretty insubstantial. This is a notable failing in the game.

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louise fortin
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 6:32 am

I like followers... except all males, Mjoll and Uthgerd.
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Gen Daley
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 12:23 pm

It's obvious they prioritized variety and having several available in each city rather than going into any depth on them. Just a question of developer priorities. With the way they went in the DLCs, however, I think they realize people wanted more.

Erandur is another one with a good amount of backstory. Most of them except the housecarls at least have a bit of personality in their dialogue. Example is Vorstag being a Nord who hates the cold, and Belrand being an old traditional Nord scrapper but who knows some spells.

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Harry Hearing
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:20 am

Nice post. I would have loved to see more fleshed out followers. Don't forget to add Frea on that list.
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Cat
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:22 am

I hear what you're saying; this is actually one of the more disappointing aspects of Skyrim for me personally. I was hoping the followers would be more like those in F:NV, where they were interesting characters with their own little questlines, and who you could sympathise with and actually care about. Veronica, Cass, and Boone were good companions for your adventures (most of the time!) and are characters I can actually remember. Lucky for me I have an active imagination, so I just make up back stories for my long-term followers, as I do for my player character.

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Jarrett Willis
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:26 am

I just wish they wouldn't step on pressure plates

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Floor Punch
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:50 am

Poor Annekke has just been setting those off. Good thing those spike doors haven't harmed that beautiful face of hers.
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Sharra Llenos
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:00 pm

Yes, i definitely see and agree with your point. Dragon Age: Origins did a pretty good job with the followers. They each had their own personality and actually interacted with your other followers. You could either grow your relationship with that particular follower, or kind of shove em away and never become too close. In Skyrim, with the exception of maybe 3 or 4,they have a couple set lines and thats about it.

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Lisa
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 4:44 am

The fact that they even bothered with companions is a positive sign. I'm sure this was them testing the waters, and seeing what people want more from followers. Serana comes to mind. She was an additional step by having a back-story and an attempt at radiant AI while following you(instead of drone like behavior).

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Sabrina Steige
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 2:04 pm

Pretty much do a fetch quest for anyone and they become a worthless follower. There are few that do have a personality and have more importance than just a fetch quest (Serana, Frea, Cicero, Erandur, etc.).

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Unstoppable Judge
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:31 pm

Bethesda could learn a lot from Fallout New Vegas. The characters in that game feel like real people. The ones in Skyrim feel mostly like cardboard cutouts. Which is a shame, but they can't give everyone a backstory so oh well.
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Rik Douglas
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:18 pm

It's not that they wrote a story for her because Skyrim lacked good followers... Anyway, I wouldn't call her perfect: she constantly leaves ever-remaining ash piles which contribute in filling your saves with rubbish.

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Emma-Jane Merrin
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 1:12 pm

This. While Fallout New Vegas had few followers, all of them had a different specialization, personality, backstory, etc. Not to mention the many commands you can have for them and change up the way they fight. I'd rather have eight fleshed out unique followers from New Vegas than the fifty (or however many there are) meaningless ones of Skyrim.

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Krystal Wilson
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:16 am

Of course she's not perfect. But it seems clear to me that her AI was an attempt at bringing life to companions. Rather than just have them mindlessly follow you in a straight-line like a drone.

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Vivien
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 3:47 pm

This is the way I see it too. I expect followers will be significantly more detailed in TES VI. Unfortunately, that will probably mean we'll have fewer of them, to compensate...

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Guy Pearce
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 10:05 am

Agreed they should of taken a page from Obsidians New Vegas play book on companions, and then expanded on it.

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Mandi Norton
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 5:32 pm

Kharjo is nice... :C
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Nick Swan
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 2:49 am

Well, Skyrim isn't really a party based game. Any time spent fleshing out one of the few dozen followers is time not spent on the ::ahem:: compelling narrative...(?).

I hope they do a better job in the future. The companions from Fallout 3 were a lot more interesting, but there was only a couple, New Vegas was a step up for a few characters. Boone and I-forgot-her-name-brotherhood-of-steel girl were the stand outs. Even Daisy had moments, though it's hard to get over the slapstick of a Super Mutant in a sun dress smashing faces.

That's not even touching on the (What I believe is) criminally underrated Dead Money DLC.

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Latisha Fry
 
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Post » Mon Aug 19, 2013 2:31 am

Daisy? You mean Lily. :disguise:

But like I said, I find few unique fleshed out followers better than many meaningless ones with no differences between one another. That one saying, quality over quantity.

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Megan Stabler
 
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