Why not make 4GB an 'Official' option?

Post » Thu Dec 08, 2011 5:04 am

I would just be surprised if they didn't HAVE to do the 64-bit work (and it's nothing on the scale of what they did since Fallout 3) in the relatively near future. Microsoft won't include 32-bit emulation forever. 2 games from BGS is 6 years-ish. Microsoft will, by then, have a drop-dead date for 32-bit support, if they continue to act as they have in the past.

To be fair this isn't a "problem" just with bethesda - the gaming industry in general make very few true 64-bit games at the moment.
Why I don't know but this is the current state of things...


I'm telling you, we wont see true 64bit support for games until the next generation of consoles.
That is, if those consoles work on a 64bit operating system, which they really don't need since running a game alone is a lot less RAM intensive than running everything the average home computer runs in the background while playing.
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Jonathan Egan
 
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Post » Thu Dec 08, 2011 7:00 am

Anyone using Vista or Win7 with huge amounts of RAM will benefit from superfetch.

I haven't run into any issues myself which makes hacking in an LAA flag necessary, and with 8 GB total physical RAM, the game runs like butter. Load zone delays are pretty damn short, and when I'm out in the wilderness, cell loads are practically unnoticeable.

And this is with 2 to 3 year old hardware.
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Kayla Keizer
 
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Post » Thu Dec 08, 2011 1:38 am

A 32Bit system can ONLY access 4GB of memory. This includes RAM and VRAM. And the system automatically reserves about 800MB of the 4GB for itself and system only tasks. If you were to enable LAA on a 32bit application in a 32bit environment, you are opening up the game to steal that system reserved memory, causing the entire computer to potentially crash.

And because BethesdaGS can't know what kind of hardware your computer has, they can not include such an option. And because, under normal circumstances, the game should never run into memory cap problems (Consoles only have 512MB of memory) they have no obligation to spend time working on implementing such a feature.


I'm not talking about making 64bit exe file, I'm talking about what the current LAA patches do. Which is simply flagging a 32bit exe as 'able to handle more than 2GB' in the file header. Which is what everyone has been using up until today when Bethesda released a patch that will not allow you to run the game while using these modified .exes. Which is why I suggested why not just flag the .exe themselves and then only block the program if it is modified after that date?. I mean how hard is it to write a script that detects if you using 64 bit windows and flag your 32bit exe as large address aware and take note of that date so if its tampered with further steam blocks it? They don't even have to write a new program as there are heaps of free applications flag an .exe as large address aware. All they would have to do is write a script that detects 64bit OS, run the program that flips the 2GB switch in the header, and take note of the date so that steam can block the .exe if its modified after the date it was patched...

As for the 'you should never run into the memory cap' thing, well you havn't seemed to have thought that through. Sure if you are running a vanilla install, no problem..but this is the PC version. Heaps of memory intensive mods are already available, and even more will be coming when the construction kit is released. You just won't be able to use a lot of these high definition mods without some sort of 4GB+ patch. Hence why I said it doesnt make sense, since they are basically going to fubar high definition mods, while always stating that they fully support the modding community.
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SEXY QUEEN
 
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Post » Thu Dec 08, 2011 12:17 pm

Anyone using Vista or Win7 with huge amounts of RAM will benefit from superfetch.

I haven't run into any issues myself which makes hacking in an LAA flag necessary, and with 8 GB total physical RAM, the game runs like butter. Load zone delays are pretty damn short, and when I'm out in the wilderness, cell loads are practically unnoticeable.

And this is with 2 to 3 year old hardware.


Wow about 5 replies while I was typing my last one. UnclePain, I didn't have any issues either while I was running a default install, but as soon as I started installing high rez texture packs and modified my skyrimprefs file to improve the graphics quality beyond the default I really needed that LAA patch. So this is more of a 'running Skyrim with mods and tweaks' issue.

@Flowz0r

when I said this

That doesn't make any sense. They get all kinds of good ideas, content and publicity from all the awesome mods that fans make for the PC versions which they can use in later games if they want, even if PC game sales are down and don't match consoles. The only reason I bought Oblivion was because I saw screenshots and videos of modded PC versions, I would never play the unmodded version. Its also the same reason I bought Skyrim, because of all the great mods I know are going to be made for the PC version. Although I must admit vanilla Skyrim has alot of the best ideas that were modded into Oblivion, so its already pretty awesome without mods XD


I was referring to the post 'YES I MAD' made directly above it about bethesda wanting everyone to buy the console version, I edited my post to hopefully prevent further confusion :wink_smile:

EDIT:

I've thought of an easier way than my earlier suggestion of writing a script, hows this;

Instead of writing a script to detect your version of windows and then installing the 32bit .exe with large address awareness enabled in the header, all they would need to do is ASK you before installing/patching if you want the file to be large address aware...
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Emily abigail Villarreal
 
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Post » Thu Dec 08, 2011 8:28 am

A 32 bit address space is 2**32 bytes in size = 4,294,967,296 = 4 gigabytes

A 64 bit address space is 2**64 bytes in size = 18,446,744,073,709,551,616 = 16 exabytes

Granted, it is not yet possible to actually cram this much memory into a computer so it's purely theoretical. Room for expansion, and all that. IIRC Vista/Win7 will only use a maximum of 128 gigs for now.


was you talking what the OS can use, or the 16gb being impossible/possible..because at the moment it would be 64GB into a general public type of motherboard, or if you had thousand 2 spend per dimm you could manage to get 128GB and that sort of RAM is still being worked on and as it is a ddr3 it will fizzle out because something new will come along before that is even near ready for wide customer base ..pointless that all would be..anything over 6gb of ram for games these days is kind of pointless, and 4gb in most cases is the most you need at least for the next few months
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Hannah Barnard
 
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Post » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:20 pm

I don't expect an answer on this because the answer will most likely upset the player base more than staying silent. 90% of game companies choose the "ignore it till it goes away" problem. Since the modding community has provided a solution they can do just that.
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Brιonα Renae
 
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Post » Thu Dec 08, 2011 3:10 pm

A 32Bit system can ONLY access 4GB of memory. This includes RAM and VRAM. And the system automatically reserves about 800MB of the 4GB for itself and system only tasks. If you were to enable LAA on a 32bit application in a 32bit environment, you are opening up the game to steal that system reserved memory, causing the entire computer to potentially crash.

And because BethesdaGS can't know what kind of hardware your computer has, they can not include such an option. And because, under normal circumstances, the game should never run into memory cap problems (Consoles only have 512MB of memory) they have no obligation to spend time working on implementing such a feature.


Does your PC have 5gb of ram or more? If so, then click the 'LA' option.
IMPORTANT: If your machine does not have the required specification, this may cause Skyrim to become unstable.

Anyone unable to grasp that, seriously shouldn't own a consumer product of any description, let alone a PC.
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megan gleeson
 
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Post » Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:41 am

To be fair this isn't a "problem" just with bethesda - the gaming industry in general make very few true 64-bit games at the moment.
Why I don't know but this is the current state of things...

Unless you rewrite a lot of things, you won't gain anything outside of using more RAM since pointers will use twice as much memory.


I'm telling you, we wont see true 64bit support for games until the next generation of consoles.

The current generation of consoles use 128 bits processor.
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Mr.Broom30
 
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