If you're wondering about the title, I'm not actually saying it's a bad game, it's actually far from it, but it is a bad game when you look at it after playing Morrowind, Oblivion, and Skyrim, or maybe like me, all of the TES games so far. If you're wondering why I'm just now posting this, it's because I feel most people probably had enough time to play Skyrim, Oblivion, and maybe Morrowind and would be able to see my points. I'll also have you know that I actually enjoyed Oblivion and still play it from time to time. So, here is why I think TES: IV Oblivion was/is a bad compared to the other TES titles.

• The Combat is sloppy and feels like you're slashing at stacks of moving Play-Doh

All you do is constantly slash with the same animation and being hit has little to no effect on the movement of both your character and your enemy

• The main quest story is boring and feels like a chorse

Saying "So don't play it" is pretty stupid, considering it's meant to be played. Oblivion Gates feel like a chore and there is little no reward for completing the quest.

• For a game from the PS360 generation, even though it was a launch title, the animation svcked.

The walking looked stiff and artificial, and the jumping looked even worse.

• Bandits in full Daedric and godly mountain lions

I fail to see the logic that enemies should get stronger instead of just introducing new ones. You just end up having a terrible time unless you spend hours and hours grinding for better gear. Enemies should not get stronger, but new and more powerful enemies should be introduced.

• It wasn't even close to living up to Morrowind

As someone who played Daggerfall and Morrowind before Oblivion, I was seriously expecting the series to grow and improve, but it worsened in almost every way. The dungeons were very similar, and even copy/pasted many times. I felt like the story would be more compelling, not less.

• It had very little memorable characters, or at least for me.

Nobody except for maybe Martin and Lucien, excluding Uriel Septim VII since he was in the previous games as well, was really memorable to me. They felt bland and two-dimensional. This was a slight improvement over Morrowind, though, since even more dialogue was copy/pasted.

• Conversation was boring with random civilians and voice-swapping was annoying

The moment when a poor beggar goes from sounding old and tired and starts sounding strong and brave is the moment when immersion breaks. A lot of people complained about Skyrim having less dialogue, but what they failed to understand was that it was because they had many, MANY more unique lines. And NPC's had conversations that made sense in Skyrim, but in Oblivion, one would be talking about the Fighters Guild while one talks about the local inn and tavern.

• There was a lack of variety in the gameplay, enemies, and dialogue

I know I already brought this up, but this part will be dedicated to the lack of variety. Ruins and caves were very similar or just plain copy/pastes of each other and rarely had anything worth exploring. In the wild, you would meet a lot of wolves, maybe an imp here or there, and a bandit every once in a while as well as being attacked by the occasional mountain lion.

Now, remember that some of this can be seen as opinion, but I think most of my complaints are valid and problems with the game itself instead of with my perception of it.

please don't spam

You're hurting yourself, actually.

As you said - most of it is just your opinion. Well, I disagree with all your points except point 4 regarding bandits and godly lions. I won't write why I disagree because I did it probably a hundred times and I haven't changed my opinion since.

Also, I noticed that you joined these forums today but I really hope you didn't join just for making this thread, right?

I honestly hate it. I just think it looks bad, feels bad to play and also is bad in every way. Skyrim is my favourite game of all time, then I can say fallout 3 is probably second and fallout new vegas might be top 10 just (I have some pretty harsh criticisms for it). Oblivion would quite honestly not be in my top 500. I think it's an abomination with no redeeming features whatsoever. Skyrim is the biggest 180 turn around sequel in history. I'm surprised I even gave it a chance, it's a good thing I was persuaded by internetters and screenshots because otherwise I never would have gone near elder scrolls again after oblivion.

Oblivion is definitely different to Morrowind and Skyrim. The latter are far more serious and are set in harsh lands. Oblivion is funny a lot of the time and has a more familiar setting than Morrowind.

My main gripe with it is that everything in PGE 1 was retconned. Jungles, the IC being a water based city on eight islands, the culture of the Colovians and Nibenese, river dragons...etc. Also, the game had so much unused potential that I feel kinda sad about it. So much foreshadowing in Morrowind and no build up from the quotes about the unrest in Cyrodiil.
And the level scaling.

Other than that, I still think Oblivion is a good game and really depends on my mood when I choose a TES game to play. They're all great in their own way.

"The Combat is sloppy and feels like you're slashing at stacks of moving Play-Doh"

Do you not use the power attacks? You can stun, knock back, disarm etc. I don't see your point.

"The main quest story is boring and feels like a chorse"

If you mean that it is a chore, then yes. Frodo had one heck of a chore, as I recall. I love the MQ.

"For a game from the PS360 generation, even though it was a launch title, the animation svcked."

Playing an ES game on a console is a waste. This is like French kissing your sister (unless your sister is Kate Upton).

"Bandits in full Daedric and godly mountain lions"

I get stronger sooo...the enemies get stronger. The bandits steal from the rich, right? That's how they can afford better equipment. So you want the lions to become tigers and then sabre-toothed?

"It wasn't even close to living up to Morrowind"

That's why it's not Morrowind II. People who couldn't figure Morrowind out whined endlessly. Modders stepped in and put training wheels on everything, so Bethesda created Oblivion as Morrowind with training wheels. I'm sure that the next game in the series will be Eldar Scrolls VI, The Legos Version.

"It had very little memorable characters, or at least for me."

Well Shivering Isles had lots of memorable characters, if I'm not letting the cat out of the bag. How do cats get into bags?

"Conversation was boring with random civilians and voice-swapping was annoying"

The beggars voice changes because they are doing a con. Of course they sound feeble when they are begging. As for the ridiculous conversations, my wife finds them hilarious.

"There was a lack of variety in the gameplay, enemies, and dialogue"

Daggerfall had incredible dungeons...and people hated them because they got lost. So dungeons got easier and easier to appeal to the lowest denominator.

When my characters are out and about I find Minotaurs, Ogres, Wisps, etc along the roads. Try leveling up.

I see your points. I just don't agree with most of them. It is very much personal preference.

There is very little feedback in the combat itself. That is probably what he meant.

You're completely missing the point. It's not about playing the game on the consoles, but the quality (or lack thereof) of the animation. Pc or console.

I agree with a few of the things you say. And disagree with a few others.

The Combat is sloppy
I disagree with this. I like Oblivion's animations. I think they are much, much better than animations in Morrowind and are as good as the combat animations in Skyrim.

The main quest story is boring and feels like a chorse
Well, I do say, "Don't play it." I've only done it twice in perhaps ten playthroughs. I know that Pseron Wyrd has only done it once in seven years, and I think Mirocu has never done it (I may be wrong). The main quests in all these games are meant to be optional. The whole game is designed around the possibility that we may not do the main quest on every character.

As far as being boring, I kind of half agreee and half do not agree. I think the main quests of Morrowind and Skyrim are, on the whole, more interesting. But Oblivion's main quest has a great many interesting moments. And I think we have to give it credit for at least trying to break away from the tired old "chosen one" gimmick, which, in my opinion, hurts Morrowind's and Skyrim's main quests.

The walking looked stiff and artificial, and the jumping looked even worse.
I completely disagree with this one. I think Oblivion's walking and jumping animations are the nicest in the series, including Fallout 3 and New Vegas. I thought the running animations in Skyrim looked poor in comparison with Oblivion's. The running animations in both Morrowind, Skyrim and the Fallouts look similar to me: characters in all four games look like they have broomsticks up their butts.

I don't have any opinion about the jumping animation. But I love the way our characters look in Oblivion when they hit the ground after they have jumped. To me, it feels like character have real weight and mass. In the Fallout games and Skyrim my characters tend to feel to me very light.

Bandits in full Daedric and godly mountain lions
I don't believe bandits even wear Daedric armor. And I know for a certainty that Mountain Lions are static, not scaled. And new and more powerful enemies are introduced in Oblivion. Have you never seen a Minotaur? I wonder if you have played this game very long?

However, your basic point is one that I can agree with. I don't like Oblivion's over-zealous level scaling. It is one of the game's worst points, in my opinion. I think the Fallout games and Skyrim did much better in this area. Actually, my dream system would be Morrowind's leveled-but-static system, only extended to go beyond level 22.

It wasn't even close to living up to Morrowind
I didn't play Morrowind first. I played Oblivion first, so I did not feel the intense disappointment in Oblivion that so many players felt. I think each game has had many great features removed (Morrowind was no exception) and each game has had some interesting new features added.

And by the way, the dungeons are never copy/pasted in Oblivion. If you want to verify this go look at dungeon layouts at UESP.

It had very little memorable characters, or at least for me.
This I can agree with. I think, for the most part, NPCs in Morrowind, Fallout 3 and Skyrim are more memorable than those in Oblivion.

Conversation was boring with random civilians and voice-swapping was annoying
I think beggars changing voices is intentional. I think it is meant to signal that they are not what they seem. But I think this effect is a little too subtle for some people to pick up on.

I agree that conversations were more immersive and made more sense in Skyrim. But a lot of us feel there is a certain charm to Oblivion's nonsensical conversations.

There was a lack of variety in the gameplay, enemies, and dialogue
I've already addressed the copy/paste fallacy. I agree that some of Oblivion's dungeons can feel a little empty in comparison to Skyrim. Ayleid ruins in particular feel very depressingly empty to me.

As far a sameness in the rest of the game, I think we have to keep in mind that the Elder Scrolls games are huge. And most of us play these games for hundreds - even thousands - of hours. I think we tend to put more hours into these games than we do other, shorter and more linear, games. So of course, after spending that much time in a game certain things are going to seem the same. It is not a real lack of variety, in my opinion, but the illusion of a lack of variety, brought on by spending huge amounts of time inside the game.

Just fyi, bandits do not wear Daedric armor (they only wear light armor) and mountain lions are always level 10. Maybe you're a bad player?

Those of us still playing Oblivion, generally speaking, have been playing it for years, you've apparently been playing for a few hours. Were you really expecting us to agree with your post? Especially seeing as it's just you recycling the same tired opinions that get thrown around everytime someone starts comparing TES games. I'm actually wondering if you played Oblivion, or just googled it and looked for the hate threads.

@Golden Sinner: "Playing an ES game on a console is a waste. This is like French kissing your sister (unless your sister is Kate Upton)."?

Please leave the PC elitism at the door, we'd all appreciate it.

Pretty much what I think too. Oblivion does have its flaws no doubt, but it′s far, very far, from being a bad game

I have in fact never done the MQ, your memory serves you well, Shelly Mars I′ve been far too busy doing all the things I want to do.

These games are not about the MQ. It can be if you want to but as the game is a free-roamer, the MQ is very much just another optional quest.

What I'm seeing here is a parroting of Oblivion complaints that have become cliches. The "bandits in Daedric" nonsense is such a well-worn cliche that people believe they exist.

Most of these complaints actually demonstrate a superficial experience with the game. Anyone who has really explored the dungeons, for instance, knows that they are all actually different layouts from one another, with hand-placed "clutter" and loot, and they often have little "stories" built into them, for people who bother to look.

I also don't understand the animation complaint. Morrowind is the TES game with bad animation. Just as a comparison, I've played hundreds of hours of both Oblivion and Fallout 3, and I think Oblivion's animation is better than FO3's animation.

I also disagree about the memorable characters statement. I think that's another example of not having played enough of the game to have met some of the more interesting people. How can anyone find unmemorable the likes of Big Head, Lucien Lachance, Cutter, Owyn, Savlian Matius, Alval Uvani, Falanu Hlaalu, Lord Rugdumph, Mazoga, Ancotar, and Bugak gro-Bol, to name a few?

please read the forum rules.

If you believe a post to be a problem, use the report button.

Bandits end up with glass.

Marauders end up with daedric.

All a bandit or narauder would need to do is sell their armor to retire. Robbery and mugging people is pointless at that point.

The leveling system does need to be tweaked at least, revamped at best.

Exactly. The title of this thread should be "Why TES IV is a Bad TES Game in my opinion

People like the OP always seem to state their opinions as if they are facts. So if TES IV is truely a 'bad TES game', then I guess that means I enjoy playing bad games, then. I am proud to be playing this "bad TES game".

Actually, it's all opinion, every criticsm you made in the opening post. All of it.

This is true of Skyrim as well. Skyrim may seem to have a lot more details in their lairs, but look closely. There's plenty of copy/paste action going on. Furthermore, the only thing that's truely 'copy/pasted' in this thread so far are your opinions, BBW, no offense. Do you think you're the only to complain about the NPC conversations, the 'copy/pasted dungeons, the daedric glass-wearing bandits? You are not. No offense, but even your opinions aren't original.

And you aren't swaying me. Or glargg. Or mirocu. Or Wyrd. We all love this game. Are you trying to sway us from not loving it? Keep trying, it'll only lead to this -->

This thread will probably make it to page 3 anyway and I doubt we'll read any more from the author. This thread should also be considered spam since there were hundreds of them with exactly the same pointless discussions. I don't know why NPC conversation threads got closed as soon as they are opened but one such as this are allowed to exist, the one about NPC conversations were at least innovative and funny.

I so agree with your comment on the "chosen one" gimmick. Iv'e never liked being the "chosen one." Although in Morrowind, one could argue that you are not the "chosen one" but merely one of many potentials, who can become the "one" through your actions in the game.

I have been playing Oblivion since 2009 and I have only recently gotten around to starting the main quest. So far, I am enjoying it.

I so agree with this! If you ask my opinion what is the best TES game, I'll say Morrowind hands down, but if you ask me which game I prefer to play, the answer is Oblivion.

you sir (OP) can

the ONLY flaw with oblivion that i see is the lack of race culture

why do i even bother coming to threads like this

You would think the opposite is true. If everyone is wearing Daedric/Glass armor it would be very lucrative to rob people.

*Only* the high level bandits and marauders. The npcs they are trying to rob are still level one, wearing civilian clothing, and carrying 5 septims.

Picking on the up and coming Champion of Cyrodiil who is usually wearing full enchanted daedric and armed with the best gear is a very bad idea, and definitely cuts into profits and future earnings. [at least my higher level champion was]

Well, I'm guessing they must have robbed some people with decent equipment, or else they wouldn't be wearing Glass/Daedric armor, heh.