I am using BOSS but it comes up as unknown. I aksed to find out where you guys have it. I reported it in the BOSS thread as well

Yep, I saw that - they're usually pretty quick to add to the masterlist - if you're unsure where to place it, just wait until they add it. That's what I'm doing

You could take a chance, but then BOSS will end up re-ordering it for you anyway (unless you put an exception to keep it where you place it) - drastic changes to load order partway through quests can break things.

If they don't add it to the masterlist today I'd be surprised.

...and it's now recognised by BOSS

Yep just checked out the BOSS thread

thanx m8s for posting the mod to the boss thread, i totally forgot about it.

@Mclericp thank you so much for your comment.

Added a tome that teaches the player to conjure a corrupted elite guard, it is one of he spells used by the conjurers.

I've just updated to the latest version - previously I was using a much earlier version without the Hall of the Dead.

The Hall of the Dead is a great idea, and the backstory works really well.

I also think that the maze is a fantastic idea, and well implemented. Feels like a maze, but not too complex to be frustrating. Ever thought about making a separate Maze mod with a couple of larger mazes?

What's your lore explanation for those parts of the city still intact in the cavern? Surely they would have taken at least some damage when plummeting to the floor? And how exactly did it end up in the cavern - did a large section of the city just fall to the floor and the cavern fall down on top of it? If so, why did the cavern roof not fall in and cover the buildings? Did mages intervene?

Some of the doors in the palace are activators, but some aren't - which feels odd.

I don't know if it's just my game, but initially the rogue mages in the inn didn't attack - I could talk to them. Once I got to the centre of the hedge maze one of the mages there ignored me, but the other started attacking, and when I responded to his attack the other mages then all became aggressive. The ghostly elite guard mages in the palace all remained non-agressive, as did the cleaners & chefs, while the other elite guards all attacked me. I chose not to take the weapon from the Hall of the Dead - maybe this affects things in the cavern?

I noticed quite a few spelling errors in the mod - most notable "college" was "collage" on a few occasions. Would you like me to proofread, or are the mistakes intentional?

I don't mean to be too critical, as I'm enjoying the mod - would like it to be just perfect!

Every type of positive criticizem is welcome, this is the only way to learn and progress.
Part of the rogue mages are designed to be none aggressive, why should anyone attack anyone in a pub? i wanted to give the player some moral choices to attack or not.
you can see that some of the mages that live in the houses will not attack you in the city or inside the pub, but thy will attack you at their home, there is even one mage that dost care if you enter the house.
One of the hedge maze mages ignored you? this is a bug that will have to addressed.

All the ghosts are none aggressive, some of them continue their daily routines, like cleaning and such. there is no connection between the axe and the cavern, i made it all about player choices.

Thank you for telling me about the spelling mistakes i will be happy if you will be able to pinpoint them to me in order to weed them out.

Regarding lore, there is an explanation for everything have you read the journal in the elite guard wing and the one at the jarl's room?

Some of the door in the palace are inaccessible, most noticeably at the elite guard wing and the door at the palace.

Edit: just checked the hedge maze center mages both of them are marked as very aggressive thy should attack the player on sight

I don't know what happened with the 1st hedge maze then - he completely ignored me! Maybe just a quirk in my game.

Just played again, and found the book in the Jarl's bedroom inside the fireplace along with some other items - must have gone flying off the table during the fight. Also found the other book on a table behind one of the doors in the elite guard wing - must have missed this before, as it was hidden behind some other items on the table when I walked into the room. Maybe put some sort of visual pointer to lead the player to look inside the room? I don't know if you've played the Half Life 2 series with developer commentary, but it seems that one of the elements of game design is effectively to treat the average player as a little dumb (they didn't put it quite like that!) and if you want people to see certain things, use lighting to subtly point it out visually (you could make other areas darker, or a quick way would be to make that door have a light outside it or something similar).

I like that the NPCs aren't all aggressive. I tend to play pacifist characters that avoid trouble, and prefer to avoid fights where possible. It just took me as a surprise that some are aggressive and some aren't - as this doesn't tend to happen in the vanillia game. Maybe a warning note in front of the palace grounds and in front of the hedge mage centre - "private property - no trespassing" or similar? Or if you want them to look more evil - "keep out - enter at your peril".

Why don't the Elite Guard kill the rogue mages? It doesn't seem logical that they all live together as a happy family. There's lots of different groups in the mod (passive rogue mages, aggressive rogue mages, passive ghost mages, passive ghost palace people, aggressive elite guard mages - it gets confusing as to who is on whose side, and who you should be attacking - particularly as you don't really get the chance to read the journals to find out what's been going on until you've killed a few!

I'll have a look at the journals again and let you know where the spelling mistakes are.

Thanks!

jackstarr: thanx for the comments your giving me some food for thought, i think that i should change the living elite guard faction to one that hate necromancers and warlocks.
I think that i should lock the doors to the jarls room and the elite guard wing that lock will opened by key only, the key will be held by the mage in the library in this way it will be logical to assume that the mages locked the elite guards there.
I have some other ideas but my scripting knowledge is none existent.

Wow, this mod looks great! Are you going to tell the story of Winterhold through the environment or will there be other clues as well?

Thank you Albinodunmer
The story of winterhold will be revealed to the player by reading journals and letters. the story revealed in the mod tries to be as lore friendly as possible.

Great that is what i am looking for!

great immersion mod.

I think locking the doors as you suggested would be a good way to tidy things up, both from a lore and gameplay viewpoint.

I like your use of "perceived" reality - the idea that the author of one of the journals believes that it's his actions that have caused the Winterhold collapse (rather than the otherwise assumed eruption at Vvardenfell). It's this sort of vagueness and conflicting records that have permeated the vanilla games for a while now, and it works really well.

Upcoming changes:
The jarls room will be free from enemies and open, the library and the elite guard wing will be locked the lock will be held by the master elementalist she will be in the upper wing, conjure corrupted elite guard book will be added to one of the houses and one of the enemies, the cavern will allow fast travel from it, and i will tray to find a way to create portals (i feel like thy will break something in the story).

Version 2.10 had been rleased today here are the changes:
Added a corrupted elite guard spellbook to one of the enemies and the ruined house (while facing the palace it is last house at the left row).
Added a portal to the hall of the dead from the jarl's room, and a spell that will bring the player back. Locked the elite guard wing door and the library door, the library is occupied by 2 elite guard mages (now the elite guards and the necromancers will not look like a happy family), the mage that was placed in the library now placed at the upper wing, those encounters are harder to overcome, every NPC will attack the player if that player enter their home but will remain non aggressive everywhere else.
Hopefully fixed the disappearing main gate error. some more placing changes and minor tweaks.
Smelter had been added to the elite guard wing. Every weapon and armor found in this mod can be upgraded. the blacksmith sell the elite guard armor and the elite guard mage robes. Elite guard armor can be created with the blacksmith forge.

Fantastic work. This will definitely become part of my game when I go to play again. Tracking it!

Great work! Loving the mod, but I'm currently using 1.38 - and probably won't upgrade yet because of the .esm file (every time I enable a new .esm file, I have to change the formID of the tracks in my music mod, due to a game bug). Do you mind telling why you chose to make the mod dependent on a new master file?

I'm sorry for that annoyance with your music mod but the reason that i used an esm is due to the navmesh bug. in v 1.38 i used windhelm's hall of the dead navmesh for wwinterhold hall of the dead,
In v2 i wanted to create an entombed portion of winterhold which means, more interior that doesn't rely on the vanilla game.
The new interiors in V2 are:

• Frozen tunnels
  
• The rotting minion (tavern)
  
• The cavern
  
• house 1
  
• house 2
  
• house 3
  
• Hedge maze center
  
• Palace main hall
  
• Palace elite guard wing
  
• Palace upper wing

Those areas are not linearly connected, in many cases the player need to return to a previously visited area, this design make the area extremely vulnerable to the navmesh bug.

Have you spoken with Arthmoor (he's working on the Skyrim Unofficial Patch as well as many other mods) about the problems with using an ESM as a workaround for the Navmesh bug?

I was reading earlier that Arthmoor has some strong arguments against creating ESM files (although I didn't take in the full details), and that they in turn can be causing other more serious issues for players later on down the line, so he recommends putting up with the navmesh bug for now.


Edit: Here's one of the threads discussing issues with Skyrim, and why some Quest mods don't work when combined - http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1374785-why-do-quest-mods-seem-to-not-work-with-other-quest-mods/

and the relevant part:


It seems that ESMs can not only break your own mod, but other people's mods too...

This mod is fantastic. Keep up the great work!

I really like the idea of this mod but I personally feel it oversteps the boundaries of just expanding the ruins of Winterhold. I'd really like to use this mod because as far as I can tell it's the only one that expands Winterhold, but none of extra features sound appealing. Do you perhaps have an earlier version of the mod without any of the added enemies, ghosts, or cavern city that you could share? The earliest uploaded version on the Nexus appears to still have new enemies like the Elite Guards.

@Bonehedge: Almost all the earlier versions of the mod are at the nexus, look at the change log and tell me which version you want, i ask you to tell me and not to download because in the earlier versions i deleted references from skyrim.esm for the version you want to download i will scale those references down and bury them underground in order to prevent ctds.

Well the earliest version is 1.37 so I'd like to go with that one, but in the changelog it mentions something about a ghost and an Elite Guard ambush. If you could take those things out, and whatever other enemies that may be added, that would be supremely fantastic of you.