I am putting a bit of planning into my character before beginning and as I look at the skills i plan to focus on I wonder if I need any perks in alchemy. I will likely not use it for anything more than bulking up my smithing/enchanting skill to make a nice sword ... so with that in mind, should i invest any perks into it?

YES.
Get alchemy to 100 and climb that tree.

The three ESSENTIALS for ANY character are smithing, enchanting and alchemy. Anyone tells you otherwise doesn't know how to play this game to the greatest enjoyment.

Listen to the godfather.

I've always done at least the 5/5 plus up to the concentrated poison, to get the 2 hits per poison.

hmm...guess i'm going to have to elimate another skill.

Here is the ones i would like to invest in:

Conjuration - For summons or bound weapons and soul trap (one or the other)
Destruction - Want to use this for Ice or Fire Magic/Cloaks
Enchanting - Plan on enchanting sword and armor
Restoration - not sure i'm going to use this now that i need alchemy

Archery - will likely use this to snipe an enemy then charge them, won't have too many perks in it.
Sneak - only enough perks for the bow damage
Light Armor - my main source of armor

Smithing - improving my sword(s)
One Handed - Main combat skill (with destruction)

I wouldn't say you have to do any one thing in order to enjoy the game but I will say this:

You can do the entire game without smithing and without enchanting, but not without alchemy.

You can do the game without alchemy and smithing, but not without enchanting.

You can do it without alchemy and enchanting, but not without smithing.

Etcetera.

IOW, you need to really kick ass at at least one of the crafting skills. In terms of simplicity, alchemy is the overall most effective if for no other reason than you can make restore health potions; and if you carry enough of those, you can survive almost any mission. Not the funnest way to play but it works.

Personally, I do all three. By the time I get to a certain level I want to have the best of everything and beat the sh!t out of everything that killed me so many times before. Then I get bored and start all over again.

hmm ... i want to have a challenge, the main thing i want though is an 'optomised' enchanted sword.

If you want the best possible gear, yes you want to invest in Alchemy.

You don't need the best possible gear to reach the armor cap.
Glass armor with smithing and a few light armor perks can easily reach the armor cap without alchemy or enchanting.

I maxed Alchemy to 100 and got all the 'beneficial' perks so I could make a strong enough Fortify Smithing potion so I could get leather-based armors past the cap. On that character I also have Smithing at 100 (all perks) and Enchanting at 100 (all perks except Soul Squeezer and Soul Siphon).

Of course, Alchemy has other uses, but that's how I use it.

My enjoyment comes from hitting max level and playing an end game build, so I definitely spent perks in Alchemy.

Alchemist 5/5
Physician
Benefactor

For 7 perk points spent.

Poisons in the game are already powerful without perking them.

Snakeblood, Green Thumb and Concentrated Poison are all useful perks, but if you are being economical with your point spending, you can probably live without them.

Purity is a hindrance, unless you find a particular potion and ingredient combo that you cannot live without and it included both positive and negative effects. I haven't encountered anything that would make me perk Purity, and it stops you making more money from Alchemy.

I cannot live without the perks that make beneficial potions better because it's those potions that ultimately add to how much damage your weapon will do, among many other benefits.

Yep. Those are the ones I've got.

I could see Green Thumb being really useful if you're a big time Alchemist, but, like I said, I just want the +120% Fortify Smithing potion for my leather-based armor improvement.

Also, a useful quest would be

Can you be any more arrogant? They are only essential if you're a power gamer.

I played my first character up to level 52 without a single level in Smithing, Alchemy or Enchanting. You don't need them to play this game. Do they make the game easier? Sure. But none of them are essential.

And yes, mister arrogant chickenkungfu, I did play that game to my greatest enjoyment.

Enjoyment is definitely in the eye of the beholder.

Some people apparently enjoy powergaming and one-shotting ancient dragons. Other people enjoy wandering around with 50 hitpoints without any perks or level-ups.

Me, I enjoy at the moment to only receive 1 extra point in Magicka or Health or Stamina per level, no perk points (Skyrim Uncapper makes this possible), and to buy my perks in the form of perk books that the seriously cutthroat merchants randomly offer. I could afford one perk book for Smithing yet. It's not essential, but I had 3k of money to spare and he didn't offer any more useful perk book at that point. Since I want to be able to create Dwarven jewlery at some point in the future, it's not a total waste. Definitely enjoyable - in my eyes.


I'd say that Smithing is the least important of the big three trees anyway. With enough Alchemy and Enchanting, you can improve your gear just as much without any Smithing perks. It's only important if you actually want to create your armor- and weaponsets yourself instead of using what you find.

I agree with Lytha. Just because I rarely use Alchemy, doesn't mean I don't enjoy my game to the fullest. I don't want to have to constantly drink potions to make my character more powerful or better at a certain skill. I mean, I totally understand why people like Alchemy, I just never got into it. I've seen videos of all of the "miracle" potions on youtube that can give you one hit kills on a Dragon Priest, but I'm not interested in killing a Dragon Priest in one hit. I'm interested in fighting him. That's why I never got PC guys who buy the game and then don't even really play it. They just use codes to kill difficult enemies and change entire layouts of cities, ect. Of course I use potions here and there, but I just find the ones that I use. I don't buy them or make them.

To me 7 alchemy perks just so you can buff up your enchanting/smithing is a waste.
With 100 smithing, a shop bought potion and 4 items that boost smithing (which can be found/purchased, not enchanted) you'll be able to boost your gear to legendary status even without smithing perks
If alchemy was an integral part of the build (like it would be for an assassain or some mages) I can see it but for the use the OP envisages well I'd rather use them elsewhere

I think so yes especialy id you got a characterlike a nord that refuses to use any sort of magic. Except enchanting
Instead of healing spell. Carrying as many healing potions will be crucial , especially low and mid lvl
So better your potions are less of them you need to carry

The first four on the list are useful.
Alchemist, Physician, Benefactor and Poisoner.

I never saw the need for Concentrated Poison, Experimenter perks are absolutely useless, Green thumb is unneeded, Snakeblood is a complete waste of a perk, and Purity only allows about half a dozen potions you could not make without.

I'm glad to see that it's not necessary - I planned on leveling smithing and enchanting anyway. I'd rather invest and use those rather than alchemy that I'm not going to use outside of bolstering those two skills.

Also, I'm likely going to use a blades sword which is under steel smithing, and then enchant it.

No. Just... no.

Like Merari said, there are four useful perks: Alchemist, Physician, Benefactor and Poisoner. Without the last one if you don;t want to use poisons.
On my archer/assassin I took Concentrated Poison, but none of my other character needed this perk.

I only ever perk one of the crafting skills with each character... I find that anymore than that is overkill and I'm not looking to waltz through the game.

If I've got a warrior, then I take the smithing route and simply buy enchanted gear (as opposed to enchanting it myself). I usually make my own potions, but I refrain from perking the tree.

If I've got a mage, then I take the enchanting route (playing a sorcerer - heavy armor), though foregoing that and running with alchemy would be the likely alternative if I was running around in robes.

I've yet to really play a stealth route, but I'd see alchemy as the route to go there with efficient uses of potions and poisons to negate the need for either a legendary smithed bow or double-enchanted bow. I'd buy the enchanted bow and use my poisons (and potions for boosted archery skill) to make up the difference.