» Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:28 am Hi. When I finished the main quest I was wondering what was left. I had never chosen a side in the Civil War, so I was just under the assumpion that my becoming the Dragonborn would put a stop to it. Oops. I then read a bit online and found out there are two different endings, depending on what side you join. However, I feel that Bethesda left out a possible ending, an ending that I would consider to be the correct one, and an ending that they in fact allowed for via an item that you find during the main quest. First, though, some background from in-game books is necessary:
The Thalmor, a radical minority of High Elves who consider the High Elves (and only the High Elves) to be the decendants of the Aedra, seized control of Summerset Isle in the wake of the damage caused by the Oblivion crisis. Seven years later (4E 22), working covertly with supporters in Valenwood, staged a political coup and took control from those who supported the Empire. Together they formed the new Aldmeri Dominion. They then broke off all ties and communication with the Empire. Then in 4E 98 the moons Masser and Secunda dissappeared. (Since there were no reports of massive tidal waves or ground quakes, the moons in fact were still there; they just couldn't be seen). While this was disconcerting to most of Tamriel, for the Khajiit (who center so much of their lives and society upon the moons phases) it was the end of the world. When the moons reappeared two years later the Thalmor immediately stepped in and claimed that they had brought the moons back with "hidden magik". Whether this was a trick, a lie or the truth didn't matter; Thalmor popularity rose in Elsweyr to the point that 15 years later another Thalmor led coup overturned the supporters of the Empire and brought the Khajiit into the Aldmeri Dominion. The Dominion was silent again for 56 years until:
"On the 30th of Frostfall, 4E 171 the Aldmeri Dominion sent an ambassador to the Imperial City with a gift in a covered cart and an ultimatum for the new Emperor. The long list of demands included staggering tributes, disbandment of the Blades, outlawing the worship of Talos, and ceding large sections of Hammerfell to the Dominion. Despite the warnings of his generals of the Empire's military weakness, Emperor Titus Mede II rejected the ultimatum. The Thalmor ambassador upended the cart, spilling over a hundred heads on the floor: every Blades agent in Summerset and Valenwood." Thus began the Great War.
It started as a two pronged attack into both Cyrodiil and Hammerfell. Later observers would come to the conclusion that the original intent of attacking Cyrodill was to tie down Imperial forces while the Thalmore seized their true objective: Hammerfell. However, their initial incursions into Cyrodill were far more successful than expected, and the focused changed. That divided focus is what would eventually lead to their failure to completely take either objective, and the signing of the White-Gold Concordat. The Redguard refused to sign, stating that the Dominion could be driven back completely, but the Emperor feared his depleted forces would not be able to do this. So on their own, the Redguard successfully drove the Dominion out of Hammerfell. The Emperor was forced to renounce Hammerfell as a provence to preserve the peace treaty, so the Thalmor goal of removing Redguard support of the Empire was still a success. This left the Nords as the only supporters of Empire.
The White-Gold Concordat itself was the next phase of attack upon the Empire. By disbanding the Blades they removed the only intelligence agency the Empire had, leaving the Thalmor free to act unobserved. And outlawing the worship of Talos would sour the relationship between the Nords and the Empire, and eventually lead to a civil war in Skyrim. For the Thalmore the winner of the war wouldn't matter, for the final outcome would be a Skyrim sufficiently weakened as to be of no help to the Empire when the Dominion attacked again.
As to how this all relates to the available choices for the Civil War quest in Skyrim, choosing either side will likely lead to an outcome where the next Elder Scrolls game will be centered on Summerset Isle, as the Dominion will control most if not all of Tamriel by then. But the makers of the game did leave us, the gameplayers, another possible outcome by including that dossier on Ulfric. The just didn't flesh it out. DLC? I hope so. But if not then it definitely calls out for a mod.
And to those who would say that even a united Skyrim/Cyrodiil force couldn't take on the Dominion, I would ask them to remember that the Dominion suffered losses just as heavy as the Empire during the Great War. That's why neither side could continue fighting and agreed to a treaty. You don't agree to a treaty if you still think you can win now. But while both sides suffered the same losses, those losses affected the Dominion far worse than the Empire realized. All of the Mer races (High Elf, Bosmer, Dunmer) have very long life spans; hundreds of years. But in nature (and this is documented in Elder Scrolls lore) life forms with long life spans don't reproduce as often. A High Elf couple might produce 2-3 children over the course of 300-400 years. Humans, however, reproduce like rabbits (in fact this is probably what led the Snow Elves to attempt to wipe out the first Nord immigrants. They had gotten along quite well at first, but after 20 years it would have become obvious to them that the Nords would eventually breed them out of their own homeland). That's why the Dominion would go for long periods of not taking action; they had to train conscripts from acquired nations to take the place of High Elves who died on the battle field.
And as for the ending that I felt was left out? That the Dragonborn would convice the Imperials and Stormcloaks to cease the Civil War and unite against their true enemy: The Thalmor. And although this option wasn't given, there was a sort of "placeholder" for it within the game. From this point on certain spoilers from the main storyline and the Civil War storyline may be mentioned, so be warned.
During the main quest you infiltrate the Thalmor embassy looking for info to find someone. While in there you find three different dossiers; two involved in the current issue in the main quest, and a third about... Ulfric Stormcloak! This dossier reveals how the Thalmor are using him (he doesn't know about this) and his war to weaken Skyrim. The Thalmor set the whole thing in motion by strictly forbidding Talos worship in the peace treaty they signed with the Empire, knowing that this would eventually divide the Nords. Whoever wins the war, the Stormcloaks or the Empire, it is the Thalmore who actually win. With the Nords, the Empire's last remaining ally, sufficiently weakened the Thalmor can now finish off the Empire. An ending that I would have liked to have been possible (and perhaps even added via mod) is where the Dragonborn, at the truce meeting that takes place during the main storyline, reveals the contents of the dossier and the true intentions of the Thalmor and the ramifications of continuing this Civil War. You could even make it so that this option is only available if you A) find this dossier and
have it with you at the meeting. From there the story could go in many directions. Both sides could just decide to end the war. Both sides could unite and turn against the Thalmor (who are still being resisted by the Redgard). Or Ulfric could refuse to believe any of this, forcing the Dragonborn to take him out and become High King of Skyrim himself. Being Dragonborn he could even convince General Tullius that he has a legitimate claim to the throne of the Empire. Many possibilities. Here is one possibility fleshed out:At the meeting at High Hrothgar where the temporary truce is supposed to be negotiated, the following option becomes available if :
1. You have found Ulfric's Dossier at the Aldmeri Embassy.
2. You have at least the Persuasion perk.
3. You are the Thane of every hold in Skyrim except Eastmarch
4. You grant Ulfric's request to exclude the Thalmore Ambassador from the meeting.
You then inform all assembled of the Thalmor plot to weaken Skyrim as a precurser to attacking the Empire, presenting the dossier as proof. You ask both sides to cease fighting and hold in place (defending the areas where they are from dragon attacks) while you deal with the dragon problem at the source. Both sides grudgingly agree. You deal with Alduin and then return to the Greybeards to find that the cease fire has been broken and the bulk of both forces are converging on Whiterun. You tell Arngeir you have a plan, but first you have to go and gather some friends. Also, you need a BIG favor from him and the other monks.
A cut scene immediately takes you to the battle about to begin at Whiterun, with both sides charging at each other. But before they begin the skies fill with the roar of numerous dragons, and rows of fire scorch the ground between the forces, preventing them from reaching each other. Both sides stop in place and watch the dragons circle overhead. One breaks away and lands nearby. It is Paarthurnax, and you dismount from him. As you approach the armies you are joined by Ulfric, General Tullius and all of the other Jarl's of Skyrim. You inform the Jarls of the information revealed in the cease fire negotiation (that the Thalmor are the true enemy we must unite against), and yet despite this General Tullius and Ulfric have chosen to continue fighting each other. Tullius and Ulfric blame each other, and the other Jarls look displeased. Then you tell them that you have a solution that will appease all. The Empire will remove all non-Nord troops from Skyrim immediately. Skyrim will no longer be a provence of the Empire, or allow others to dictate how they will live and govern themselves. But Nords are loyal, especially to friends, And the Empire has been a friend to Skyrim for many centuries. Skyrim wil now stand side-by-side as allies against the Aldmeri Dominion, or any other enemies that they may face. General Tullius is reluctant to accept this, and wants to know how he can be sure that the new High King of Skyrim will abide by this. Ulfric states that he is the High King and will never defend Imperials. You tell him that he isn't High King until approved by the assembled Jarls, and that you now officially request to be named the High King of Skyrim. When asked you state your credentials:
1. You are a Thane of 8 of the 9 holds of Skyrim.
2. You are the Dragonborn, chosen by Akatosh.
3. As Dragonborn, you are the spiritual heir of Talos.
All Jarls except Ulfric vote yes. If you have the Intimidate perk Ulfric will back down and accept you. If not, then he states he and his hold will never support you. You then challenge him to a fight for the High Kingship, which he has to accept as it is his only viable claim to the throne. He tells you that only a Jarl can challenge another Jarl in this way. You then reveal the coversation you had with Arngeir. High Hrothgar has always been acknowledged as being neutral in political matters, so for practical purposes it has no Jarl. Until now. The Greybeards have named you the Jarl of High Hrothgar. Ulfric attempts to dispute this when you ask him if he's afraid to fight someone who's actually prepared to fight, and this goads him into attacking you. After you defeat him you talk to General Tullius and tell him to take this message to the Emperor: A new day is dawning in Tamriel. No longer will people allow distant empires dictate to them how they will live. He needs to accept this new reality in order that the wonderful things the Empire brings to Tamriel may survive. He should try to mend relations with the Redgards, and approach former allies in Elsweyr and Valenwood to see if they want to be in the Dominion, or would like help in becoming independant. There is also a final scene where you thank Paarthurnax for his help, and state that he and all the other dragons are welcome in Skyrim as long as they don't attack any of the inhabitants of Skyrim or their settlements. Paarthurnax thanks you, but says that perhaps it's best if they are alone for a time. He and all of the other dragons then leave.
This post is a condension of posts from the Nexus forums on this subject. The reason I'm posting it here is that a few of the commenters there really liked what I had to say and said that I should forward this to Bethesda. I've heard that the devs occasionally read the boards here, so I look forward to comments from them (and anyone else) about the ideas put forward here, and the possibility of something like this becoming DLC, or lacking that, a mod. My thanks to all of you for taking the time to read this.
love to read posts like this
