I think people are just paranoid. I'm in a country with 'awful internet', yet I can DL the game in hours and never have any issues.

Over inflated sense of self worth IMHO. Nobody cares who you are ^^
Origin is a different story, I felt a part of my soul die when I got BF3. Sold it to the 'devil' I think.

PS: Digital media (including books/bills/post) also once fully established will save trillions of trees ^^ So it's nice as far as i'm concerned.

I always buy from Amazon. I just like having game disc. Never bought anything from steam.

No, most PC gamers have become familiar with and love steam. I was resistant at first, but Its just so damn convenient. I can see how the older crowed may have trouble trusting it. I think more people DONT buy games because of their not being available on steam.

I enjoy steam have been using it for ages never had a problem its alot better that the ill fated windows live.

not really true. Steam covers a relatively small group. not everyone has the bandwidth the service really requires & not everyone agrees with how it works thus it can divide gaming communities (as it has here) there was a poll prior to Skyrim's release & the number of those wanting it for Steam was roughly the same as those not wanting Skyrim to require Steam (about 40%) & the rest wasn't thrilled but would still get it.


Amazon is where I got my one Steamworked game. buying a disc doesn't mean Steam won't be involved

Cliffnotes from every Steam conversation I drop in on here :

1. Steam aggregates data, and while many other websites do this and you can block this spyware depending on which browser you use, you cannot do it through Steam without breaking terms of service.

2. I can remove my physical console copy of Skyrim and play it in ANY other equivalent console without having to worry about logging into an account that is tied to my finances. I can even copy an update to flash drive and never sign into my profile on any other console, just simply copy the update. Steam FORCES you to sign up and divulge information ripe for tracking.

3. Steam has many justifiable components for multi-player games, but I believe it has no place in a single player game.

4. Steam just gets in the way. Its the police officer in your car making sure you don't exceed the speed limit by 1/4th a mph/kph.

Its unnecessary, redundant and has driven many a player to the problem it is supposed to be combating.

Heh, for short the best way to sell a product is to make a bond with the Devil. For short once again, what Steam has done. Crafty work, but it gets the job done.

This is SO true.

Steam is less about being an anti-piracy initiative, and more about cornering the market.

Steam wants to be the ONLY distributor of PC games, its attempting to capitalize on the way LIVE and PSN distribute games.

It's a monopoly that is just bad for PC gamers.

Ask Steam supporters what they think about alternatives...

As I recall, one of the reasons cited for EA dropping Steam and creating Origin is that the Steam contract called for exclusive rights to host and release DLCs. EA wanted more control over that area of their games, so they had to drop Steam.

Well, it IS... EA after all.

Wal-Mart complaining about Target and all....

I think once the SK comes out with Steam support, many people will change their minds.

If you want a physical copy, there's always consoles. Takes away just about every single problem. PC gamers make compromises to get flexibility, it's a specialized niche. However, the model is shifting the same way on consoles too. I think of the methods of DRM available to publishers, Steam is by far the most consumer-friendly option. Offline-mode works great, I used it for years.

Also, many people like not being tied to physical media. I've re-purchased games (cheap ones, mind you) online so that I didn't have to keep track of my 4-5 disks per game anymore.



I'm all for releasing DRM-free stuff. But really, as with all things, some people become extremists. I get the feeling these are the same people that are heavily against Google cross-pollinating their services, or allowing location data from their iPhones to be uploaded.

To answer the question "Are people not buying this game (Skyrim) just because of Steam?" as much as I anticipated and wanted to, I did not buy because of Steam.

Sure, but in terms of trying to corner the market... If a company wants to offer games through Steam, then all DLCs, patches, etc must go through Steam servers. Of all the online sales sites, Steam is supposedly the only one with such a clause.

Now that I think about it, that might partly explain the Steam Workshop.

And GoG sells how many new games? They can offer that for Witcher 2 because they're from the same parent company as CDPR. Not to mention that I have more problems with my GoG version of Witcher 2 than I do with Steam.

If I could have gotten my Mass Effect and Dragon Age DLC through Steam, I would have. A DRM authentication bug made our Dragon Age Origins game unplayable with any of our old saves. We have 2 EA accounts and I forgot which one I originally used to buy ME2, this caused quite a problem and I'm really not looking forward to trying to authenticate ME3.

Touche...

Which is why I think, however much they may dislike the option, EA will go back to Steam.

Its all profits for these CEO's, they don't care about viablity or what it does to the consumer.

Which is why I think these convenient DRM's may be the second coming of the great 80's crash of the gaming community.

Oh, the irony that consoles are the 'liberty' platform.

That, I can agree on.

The only real usage of it for some is the flexibility & controlling systems. The rest can be done on computer with a few cables.

It is not a liberty platform, it is a companies fist around people's throats who use them.

Just take Microsoft for instance. They heavily limited what a player/owner can do, especially in the terms of even having a simple creation kits as Bethesda Softworks provides.

I'm not so sure they will go back to Steam. Origin gives EA a lot more control of their products than Steam does. And they don't have Steam taking a cut of the profits any more. And while I hear Origin has issues, it's also pretty new. Steam had issues when it was new, too (and arguably still does). If EA can get those ironed out and offers a more attractive deal/contract to other game developers, like more control over their own products, I can see it becoming serious competition for Steam. And if it gets the good games, the customers will follow.

A fair point in a market perspective, if Origin proves to be a competent competitor.

DRM's, currently, are proving to be less about convenience to me and more about control.

That was the irony I was talking about, computers have been the bastions of freedom in the gaming community for some time... I just hate to see them adopting a consumer approach that is more restrictive than that of consoles.

It can be said there are ways to circumvent this encroachment of DRM's, but... it just feels wrong on both sides of the equation.

Imagine trying to watch a movie on your PC, and then simply trying to watch that on your neighbor's TV.

These are the unfortunate complications, and most solutions only treat the symptoms and not the disorder.

My comment on Origin:

I am a big fan of Steam. It is very comfortable and the prices - if bought on sale - are great. I have now over 100 games bought there. I don't think that I payed more than 10€ for any of them. At the moment Origin has some problems that make it absolutely unacceptable to go with it.

BUT...

In my opinion competition is a good thing. If EA works more on Origin and makes the terms of use more acceptable (yes, they are different from Steam), it could make a fine competitor with its game protfolio. So even though I really like Steam, that they can manage to wipe out the flaws and give us another strong alternative to Steam, which pretty much has a monopole right now.

I bought Skyrim with no previous prejudices one way or another for Steam. Having experienced Steam's performance in the last 3 months...

It's too late for Skyrim, but it will probably be a long time before I buy another game with the Steam logo on the box.

I dunno... but I've got 72 games from them ~and only 6 from Steam. Whether or not they are old or new, I don't care, all that matters is that they are good. I don't usually like most new games it seems. I really thought I might like http://www.youtube.com/user/ReckoningTheGame?v=_xEr5HBoKhA and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=488L20UXUKU... but both demos were pretty bland IMO.

** GoG has said that they plan to branch out soon, to recent titles ~ no longer only good old games.

How? The GOG version is just the game... All other versions are the game plus drm. The DRM was causing slow downs in the non-gog versions.

I don't know about that, but a very good reason to not buy this game is due to how buggy and unfinished it is at this point.

I play on an xbox 360 and have had scads of problems; I've warned everyone away from this game. Its a game that should have
been fantastic, but is ruined by just too many bugs.

I did the pre-download and it told me it was invalid, for instance, so I had to re-download. Tried doing that through the GOG Downloader and it wouldn't work for some reason so I had do dl it manually. Now I get a nag screen every time prompting me to put the disk in. XD Not terrible, just annoyances and not the kind I have with Steam.

I'll be interested to see if they can offer non-CDPR new titles without DRM. I'm thinking mudcrabs will fly before that happens. Not from the big name developers, at any rate. If they can make it work with other indie titles, that will be great. I don't think they're a bad outlet by any means, but their special offer for Witcher 2 is a special case.

The point is, you could have those problems with Steam.

I don't care how stable it is, Steam is a target and will eventually get slammed by buckshot.

1. Not in the predatory manner you might think. Save that for EA's Origin service. Steam doesn't keep tabs on what programs your PC runs so they can "advertise to you better".

2. You can play any game on Steam, and make accounts, without giving any personal information. The only time you need to is when making purchases, and even then you can opt to remove your information.

3. Nobody has to use the Steam interface or even play while online to track achievements.

4. Not even sure what you're trying to say here.