Ok, I'm pretty much used to stupid bugs, but this is just the icing on the cake, and it really ticked me off.

So far until now, we've been able to give custom nakedskin to individual races and still be able to copy all the other armature.

The way I used was, create a new Armor Addon for nakedtorso/hands/feet, set them to default race and as additional race my custom race, then create a new SkinNaked armature, select my Race and make it use the newly created Armor Addons. Then, in my custom race configuration, I'd select that new Armature for the skin, and then I'd select Copy Armature data from Default Race.

This allowed the race to use a custom naked body with custom meshes and textures while still being able to equip vanilla armor.

After today's update (which was pretty useless imo), I just have to open and resave one of these mods, and it breaks this feature. The naked body will no longer show ingame.

So, my questions:

Did Bethesda change the way this works? If so, how is it done now? I seriously hope I don't have to edit every friggin' armor addon and armature record to be equipable by the new race, because asides from being extremely dumb, it's too much unnecessary work and it could cause problems later.

If it's just hopelessly broken:

Is there any way to download an older version of the CK? Because seriously, considering how slow updates can be, I can't wait, and I'm really getting sick of this.

Thanks.

One very angry customer.

Join the club.

I'm now the proud author of 6 busted race mods

These updates are getting pretty ridiculous. They break more than they actually fix or add to the game.

Trykz

Armor mods are affected too. I duplicated several vanilla monk robes and made minor changes to the enchantments on some mage robes and now they are no longer visable when you wear them. Strangely enough you can still wear them as well as other mage robes and get the stacked benefits of both.

These updates are getting very frustrating for the PC community because like you both pointed out the bugs and issues created greatly outweigh the small improvements. Horseback combat is completely impractical because the hit boxing is way off and you can't aim at all. The other fixes were for bugs that were completely inconsequential to the community and easily overlooked.

I mean what's more important? Delivering a few small bug fixes and a novelty or two VS sabotaging the entire modding community which is the reason why people are still playing your game? It's a very valid question.

It sounds like you've been bitten by the apparent incompatibilities between Skyrim v1.6.89 and below and the latest CK version (v1.6.91). The two updates are causing major headaches for all mod authors with both bugs and apparent incompatibilities. Unfortunately I don't know of a way to roll back the latest CK update. This is one reason why quite a few people, including myself, keep backups of Skyrim & the CK. Unless you've forced Steam to remain offline you can't guarantee that it won't automatically update (even if you've told it not to update your game). The forced-update thing is a bug with Steam, unfortunately. I'm just hoping that a new Skyrim patch will help address some of these issues. IMO the v1.6.89 Skyrim patch was released before it was ready to be released - for whatever reason.

Seraphiel - Can you throw up an ftp and share your old backup of Creation Kit? I'd like to download it so I can fix my mod for my users.

No can do - that's considered to be piracy.

And this is why Bethesda should let people download older versions of their software. They're bound to break stuff with every patch, and something as important as the biped slots to be broken is really bad, since it pretty much brings a stop to all the armor mods being worked on.

You're not really fighting piracy with this Steam Only download, you're pretty much annoying actual customers. You could even talk with Valve to be able to distribute old versions of the CK through Steam itself, if piracy worries you so much (you still won't be really fighting it with this).

I'll join the happy few,, the moonpath is now also a nice busted zoo for invisble broken raptors, imga , pahmar tigers etc.. i'm guessing you need something new in the nif

Come on! They will take it back, or what? If they break so many hours of modding, the community won't take that.

And it isn't just a few mods....

it's ANYTHING that uses any sort of custom mesh. Races, armors, edited NPCs, cell mods with custom assets, etc.....

we're talking in the TENS of thousands. Not just a handful, or any one specific type. Bethesda has but one option here. Fix this ASAP (or at least roll back the changes they made to the CK), or the modding community will abandon their game like it's the plague. After which it will surely die. Once the vanilla loving diehards blow through the DLC, they'll shelf it again as they return to Diablo 3 or whatever else they're currently playing.

Trykz

Creation Kit is free distribution software so it's not piracy. They have to prove loss of revenue to actually sue you or hold you liable and considering you aren't changing the software or taking credit for it you would be completely in the clear.

Well technically it's not bethesda. Steam needs to let us download older versions of software. But Yes I agree.

The one thing I will add is that this kind of thing was forgivable when the game first released, and everyone knew how incredibly complicated the thing was. Now were months from the game release, months from CK release and Bethesda seems to still not get that this is a PR nightmare.

I think they were incredibly generous in letting us get our hands on the creation engine. Unfortunately, we all now realize why the game was riddled with so many bugs: poor engine design. I understand the need to keep everything in house up to a point, but Skyrim's CK seems to be a cobbled mess that doesn't get along with anyone. I guess that's the reason I still like it... reminds me of myself.

Anyway, Bethesda Folks: Please help your modding community out. I know it isn't a revenue stream directly, but the longer people use the program, the longer life the game will have, and you can keep delivering DLC with a reasonable expectation that word will get out through use to get back into Skyrim. Otherwise, this could be the issue that causes too much unwanted backlash against the company and its products. While many look forward to games like Dishonored, I believe I speak for many who may be thinking in the back of their minds: Will Dishonored be as buggy, glitchy and as downright unpolished as Skyrim? Few who want a truly immersive experiece will want to tolerate it again.

Off the soap box.

Bethesda, respond here. If you let this bug go, then you poeple are seriously going to destroy skyrim.

Thats what you want isn't it? You want to Ruin the elder scrolls to scare of all the modders. You want to destroy this just to piss us off isn't it?

Don't lie. if you care so much, then roll the CK Back. Don't say you can't. Yes you can. It won't break your legs, it won't tear your arms off.

Don't ignore this thread seriously. Because unhappy consumers are dangerous.

Respond here.

Actually, rolling the CK back may not be the answer. I can confirm that using the previous CK against the races that were broken and hooking the biped information back up for 1st person works, but if you edited the mod with 1.6, then rolled back to previous and edited the mod again, who'se to say what type of nefarious sh!te that could have in the future. I'm really hopeful that the CK being 1.6.91 is a nod that perhaps 1.6.91 (or greater) skyrim will be out soon and will resolve the edit problems we're all experiencing. The mere fact that the 1.6 CK still sees the 1.6 biped information in the RACE edit as being hooked up when 1.5 CK doesn't indicates this is likely just a structure problem that the current version of skyrim.exe doesn't handle.

But yeah, in the mean time it does svck....

I hope you're right. Otherwise this, and likely any future games Bethesda releases will be DOA as far as modders are concerned.

There's a reason Fallout and Oblivion are still going strong, with new mods released consistently. And it has NOTHING to do with the vanilla fanbois who play it through once and shelf it.

Trykz

You sadly speak the truth.

Skyrim's modding community was already pretty handicapped and frustrated with the navmesh bug. Now with all you've mentioned (ESPECIALLY the armor bug), if it's not fixed ASAP, there's no telling what would happen..

Check out the other forum. I posted something there in generla Discussion as NexusCron.

Might interest you.

Trykz, thats for you I mean.

Will do. Thanks

i mean LL. I posted something in Skyrim General Discussion there. Please check it out. I also sent you a PM about it.

It seems it's been fixed. Tested with a mod that contains a custom nakedskin, custom armor and a custom race and it's correctly working now. Good to see Bethesda does read complains.

So, I can actually go back into my CK and NOT have to reset all the biped slots for my armor? Or am I still going to have to do that? That's going to take forever if so. EDIT - thank god this didn't take a long time. I'm glad I'm not one of those modders who made the monster mods with 100s of new monsters.

Glad I did not work on my half-orc mod... I guess it's back to TESVSnip then, for now.