Anytime an enemy runs away from me in FO3, they usually come back fairly quickly - sometimes they're gone just long enough for you to drop your guard.

Yeah, but losing a leg whilst on a pirate ship is much more fortunate than to lose it out in the Wasteland.
People have lost legs in old wars, but how many who lost limbs in the middle of a battlefield made it back?
And how many of those people were at an unfortunate location like the wasteland.
Plus, the weapons of 2281 should be deadly enough to kill someone, even if they only removed one limb.
I just can't see myself in the middle of the desert, with one arm shot off, finding a way to survive.
Maybe it's just me.

If you lost a limb to an energy weapon, maybe it would be cauderized (sp) by the extreme heat. It just made me mad when you would reduce both legs to zero health and they could still come after you, sometimes (like the bigger swamp person in point lookout ) it wouldnt even slow them down very much at all.

This sounds mysteriously like Star Wars.

Not everyone in the wasteland is alone. If an NCR trooper lost an arm, do you think his comrades would just leave him to die?
Losing a leg on a ship in the middle of the sea, with no real professional help is probably slightly worse then losing a limb in a wasteland where there are settlements around you with doctors and surgeons.
Most of the weapons in 2281 are just versions of weapons from 1940/1950, or otherwise made of junk. I doubt that a hunting rifle would kill you if it shot you in the arm, same as i doubt a cleaver would kill you if it cut off your arm, especially if you were near a settlement that could give you medical attention. in this scenario, your chances are probably better then being stuck in the middle of the sea on a wooden ship.

I'm all for it. It wasn't that much fun in Fallout 3 to mutilate already dead bodies. I'd say 75% of the dismemberment i saw in that game was me playing around with a knife after i killed someone, even with the bloody mess perk. For me It's not as appealing to take someones head off if they aren't gonna be alive when i do it. Having to mutilate a corpse to get my message across... Well that's just sick(and pointless).

Since a dismemberment system is already in place might as well flesh it out and improve it.

Actually with energy weapons blowing off a limb would not be that big of a deal. the laser would cauterize the wound and you would not bleed out. Infection would be the only danger at that point.

in the case of shooting off or being cut off, if you can effectively stop the bleeding and sterilize the stub you wouldn't die.

Getting a limb blown off wouldn't be instant death. If it was the lower parts of you legs/arms it would take longer to bleed out than it would to create a makeshift tourniquet.

I'm reminded of the story of the guy who hacked his arm off in the middle of a desert canyon because it was stuck under a boulder and he would have died because he was alone and had no other way to get free. cutting off his arm saved his life.

Man, you have never played Dwarf Fortress I assume? The most realistic medieval combat simulation made. Grab the link to the main page:
http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/

Anyone that has slightly paid any attention during his biology classes or any first aid courses knows that only a lack of oxygen or damage to internal organs kill something. Getting shot in your arm can lead to the first due to loss of blood, but one can survive the initial loss of a limb or external organ such as an eye. After that shock is the biggest killer, because it can lead to both of the above. After that infection is the next danger, but after that it′s not really much that can cause any danger to you dying from it.

I once nearly severed my index finger with a circular saw. I cleaned it, wrapped in bandage, applied a tourniquet and it′s fine now (except for bending it, wich takes a little more effort). I went to see a doctor just in case and all he said was that I needed to keep it clean and it would heal perfectly wich it did.

Also numerous accounts of people having lost limbs troughout history and survived. Just make sure that the loss of blood is kept to a minumum, survive the shock and avoid or treat infection. It's not easy, but managable. After that you'll be fine. Except for the lost limb that is.

The only thing that slightly bothered me was being unable to cripple multiple body parts. (Aside from the needle gun) That, and the fact that even if shot in both arms they were still able to fire a gun.

What I would like to see is a combination of what's mentioned above.

Being able to cripple every limb and NPC not dying of getting shot in a limb. People falling over when both legs are crippled, and what I really would like to see is people giving up. When having a crippled limb or two raiders or any other enemy they should take their losses and retreat or surrender. It is really weird that even after everybody in their little gang has been wounded or killed they'd still keep attacking you. It would make more sense if they'd just give up, retreat and try again another time.

I understand the technical limits they have, but It would make more sense to me.

Ever played Gothic? I like in it that when you take someone's all HP, he doesn't die, but falls on the ground, and you can either let him get up after a while, or finish the job, and the same with the PC. I would really like to see such a thing in some of the TES or Fallout games

I think they ought to have a death timer. A bit like in RDR, but better

Head blown off (Instant death)

One shot to chest (Without armor) Knockdown, but shooting from ground. (10 game minutes until death)

Two shots to chest (W/O armor) knockdown, no longer shooting, crying/screaming/cursing (5 game minutes until death)

Three shots to chest (W/0 armor) instant death.

Arm(s) blown off: (Death within 10 game minutes (roughly 10 seconds) unless shot again

Legs blown off (same as arms) unless shot again.


(Multiple crippled limbs that were not dismembered could cause them to lose consiousness with a 20 percent chance of dying while unconsious.)


Until Death they can crawl, cry, scream in agony, Beg for help (With a high doctor skill you could use "Mercy Healing) and save them for good karma and they will no longer be hostile (Only with some, others will turn against you. A mercy killing will also net you minor good karma, while letting them expire in pain will cause minor bad karma, but neither will affect reputation further) curse you. This is the kind of Fallout Game i want, and wanted since fallout 3. I know it isn't in NV, but PLEASE BETHESDA/OBSIDIAN for GOD'S SAKE, put it in 4! It would be such a realism improvement...In the mean time...I smell a mod.

This is all assuming Fallout 4 runs on a new, more powerful engine.

In the Civil War, they had horse-drawn field ambulances and field hospitals and doctors. The reason so many people lost limbs is that the instant reaction to being shot back then was to saw the limb off.

Pirates would lose legs and limbs usually do to complications rather then them being outright being blown off.

Fun and creative idea, but the game is just being copied/cloned and packaged now...

I like the idea, would give people a reason to aim for something other than a headshot.

I would realy like them to make eyes targetable again. Then I can bring back my signature move, cattle prod to the eye. I opened every fight with that in 1 & 2.

Most of what you're talking about, however - those sorts of dismemberments were actually because of medical intervention. If you were a one-legged pirate, it was most likely because your leg was smashed by an errant cannon-ball (or otherwise mangled beyond repair,) and the ship's surgeon removed it on purpose. Especially ditto with the Civil War reference. A doctor's proficiency used to be measured by how quickly he could remove and then stabilize a limb.

In general, if you were missing a leg and still alive, it's because it was removed by a doctor. If it actually was blown apart in a manner reminiscent of Fallout - the sudden system shock and mass trauma was just as likely to kill you instantly. At the very least the massive blood loss resulting from a wound that completely removed a limb was going to kill you before you could receive medical attention.

In short, if we're going for realism - an attack that blows off a limb is going to kill you. A wound that you otherwise survived, but that left you with a limb that was damaged beyond repair - that's where you're going to see instances where a doctor had to remove it. There's a world of difference between losing a limb on purpose under skilled medical care (even Wasteland-level medical care,) and getting it blown off in a battle.

you aren't going to have massive blood loss from a severed limb unless an artery was severed. I broke my leg when i was 16 and it was a horrible break. A car pinned my leg between a fence. The bones were popping out of the skin and it was oozing blood, but i wasn't losing it fast enough to die any time soon. You wouldn't see much more blood loss from a blown off limb unless a major artery was busted (IE the femoral artery).

I agree that the initial shock can instantly kill you, but the actual act of removing it forcefully wont. And if you can get through the shock you really do have a much higher chance of survival even without real medical attention than some of you are making it out to be.

You talk about realism yet act as though severed limbs gush blood like we all live in a japanese cartoon or samurai movie, which like i said they wont unless you hit a major artery.

Well most limbs have major arteries in them somewhere, odds are having it BLOWN OFF will sever it. Plus, that's one big hole to bleed from.

:thumbsup:

For a slightly more fictional example recall the film Beowulf, were Grendel's arm was ripped off, but he got away... They all took it as a given that Beowulf had killed him ~because his arm was cut off.

your limbs major arteries are on the upper limb close to the body. if your arm or leg was blown off at the joint it's likely that the artery will not sever.

It's not really one big hole to bleed from either. It's a lot of little holes from your veins that are bleeding. Putting enough pressure on it will stop the bleeding, unless like i said it was a major artery.

It seems apparent that the enemy will die as soon as they lose a limb. Anyone remember that vid where the escaped convict died when his arm got chopped off by the Cleaver?

people have been treating themselves from cut off limbs since ancient times .

you block the bleeding with a piece of cloth then burn yourself on the cut area . and LIVE

People. Persons?

If we're gonna use fiction as a basis for real life debate then according to nu_clear_day Sergeant Dan should haven died half-way through Gump's run back to base camp due to blood loss.

Without documented accounts ~and the generalized nature of the example... The pirate story is essential fictional as well (mine was more fictional ~as said). The point was, that with the assumption that the monster would get no medical treatment, the assumption was that the monster would die.

Eh, but there are documented cases of people going through some kind of limb trauma and becoming an amputee. not monsters.

Also we are all forgetting what the major factor in surviving something like this is going to boil down to. the individual. I'm sure a highly trained marine or extreme survivalist (a la Les Stroud) could pull themselves together enough to create a makeshift tourniquet and get themselves to a place where they could get some help. Someone without any type of survival training and/or an indomitable will is surely doomed.

It's also about getting yourself stable enough to get to somewhere you can get help, even if it takes hours. If you stop the bleeding and think oh ill be fine, then yeah you're gonna die still.