I see LV. To be honest I don't sell that armor. A few steel ingots and that garb is choice until about level 35 or so. I sell the light stuff. Besides the dead dude in the start makes for a great container. You can make several trips. I still say it's more profitable than the other. One trip or three.

I don't see why there'd be much rationalizing either way. Haven't you guys ever been chased by someone/something and ended up with an unlikely group or situation? That's how I see it. I've been shot at by crazy farmers, chased by skinheads, and street gangs. No bs. And every time I ended up bonding with someone I didn't think I would.

Well there was this time back in 2000 when I insulted the film Titanic...

And 8000 teenage girls screamed for murder?

Which totally works the first few times, I only realized I had a choice the second time but did keep on wondering why in heavens name I was following an Imperial the first time... Knowing what I knew the third time my decision actually felt important because I knew it was coming. So I followed the stormcloack and have only ever been able to follow the Imperial again, if I made a clear choice towards the Empire at the start of the game.

Me too. I see what the OP is saying about the intro. Thinking logically I wouldn't have followed the Imperial, but I didn't know where the Stormcloaks were after I jumped from the tower. I didn't even notice the stormcloak reappear as I was panicked because of the dragon attack. When a reassuring voice told me to follow I didn't stop to think what uniform he was wearing.

Because Hadvar makes it clear that he respects you and doesn't believe you deserve to be executed - Had it been up to him in the first place, you wouldn't have even been on the block.... My khajiit fell in love with Hadvar at first sight.

I think that I've only had 3 of my characters. Each time I tried to apply SOME internal logic.

First a male Imperial, who I turned into a Battlemage. I had him join up with Army in Solitude. Very loyal to the Emperor. It made sense that under the circumstances he'd side with his rulers.

The second was a male Altmer, Thalmor friendly, mage. An Altmer might side more with The Empire, even though the Thalmor very much see The Empire as ther lapdog.

The third was a Female Redguard warrior, which on reflection - given how the war panned out - doesn't actually make as much sense. If this was Oblivion, fine. But Hammerfell is now fiercely independent from the Empire, following The Emperor's conceding of Redguard land to the Aldmeri Dominion in signing The White Gold Concordant. They fought damned hard to kick The Thalmor out of their lands, and they'd almost certainly resent The Empire for what happened.

Needless to say SHE won't be joining The Legion...

On my first play through, I didnt even notice Ralof or even comprehend there was a conversation. I was still getting used to just moving and Hadvar was who I had been following and I just kept following him. But I see your point.

Originally, J'derras went with Ralof when his player first got the game, but after his first playthrough and seeing what a dike-tator Ulfric was to other races, his player changed J'derras story at Helgen to go with Hadvar for the additional reasons:

1) Ralof sounds creepy and suicidal in Helgen. He didn't really care whether he lived or died. J'derras doesn't think that's normal.

2) Hadvar's sympathy was sincere after that b**** of a captain sent J'derras to the block.

3) "Still alive prisoner? Keep close to me if you want to stay that way."

4) J'derras hears in on the way to Helgen and at Helgen from both Lokir and Tullius that the Stormcloaks started the war.

5) J'derras believes that the only reason he was sent to the block was the Thalmor bribed the captain to execute him even though he wasn't on the list. (Very likely, considering J'derras background as a refugee from Hammerfell because of some overzealous Thalmor murdering his parents over a gambling debt, then trying to murder him but failing.)

Edit: Further reasons.

6) Ralof is awfully chummy for a guy whose organization was ultimately at fault for innocent J'derras' unlawful capture. Really creepy.

My first character I fallowed the Imperial guy because I didn't know I had a choice. I had just been fallowing him at the time and didn't see Ralof run up. Plus it was a panicing situation.

So we get out of the cave and he talks to me more, then the quest "Join the Imperial Legion" pops up.

"Oh hell no!"

And I restarted my game.

Bethesda obviously meant for you to go with Ralof and not Hadvar. This is easy to figure out when you look that how much light imperial armor is worth vs stormcloak armour. So killing Imperials is far more profitable than killing Stormcloaks. Plus there is that chopping my head off business. Shoving a blade into that Captain feels goood everytime.

To answer seriously though, I don't think any character would overthink such things at the time. Chaos, confusion, you can't find the keep, the only nice Imperial you met so far showing you the way I can see how a character could just stick with him. And also, he doesn't attack Ralof and the other Stormcloaks or even make alarm at the keep so he's not out to win any merit badges by rounding up anyone.

Yeah, my first time I didn't even see the Stormcloak guy either, lol. I knew about it on my 2nd toon though and developed the following story for her:

My hot Breton female stealth archer had ONE singular purpose before she was sent up for execution: Hunting down killing ALL Thalmor she could find. (She only cares about revenge for them slaughtering her family.) Their Embassy is what led her from Jehanna to Skyrim in the first place.

While she doesn't care that much for the Empire, she understands that if the Dominion are ever to be defeated, the Empire is the most likely to be able to do it. Even though she's not an Imperial Soldier, she knows that there are many others within their ranks who believe as she does. They just can't openly discuss it right now. So, her story is that an ambush was set for her by the wretched Thalmor worms, and she was taken captive. A high ranking Thalmor Justicar pulled some strings, and had her carted off with the others being executed. That's why she wasn't on the list. (I also RP'd that Hadvar had a hunch who she was as word of her attacks have been rumored for some time now.)

I've played thru Helgen ten times now and have a character of each race with a different backstory of how they came to be at Helgen. My Orc 'gro-Bags Mr T' went with Ralof and got the captains heavy armour, but I could not find a single two handed weapon on any of the Imperials. Only the Stormcloaks who were on my side had them.

I can see people's logic behind Hadvor, as he does make it clear he'll protect you, however, I'd have had no way of knowing if the Captain along with her lackeys would have been waiting to grab/kill any prisoners that came their way. The Captain had no interest in my survival prior to the attack, in fact, quite the opposite and it's obvious only her opinion mattered. She had already dismissed Hadvor out of hand, so I think it's safe to assume it would only have been a matter of time before i had either been killed or executed.

Someone else in the thread made an anology between the in game situation and a real life prison break, stating would i go with my fellow inmates or go to the guards, with the possibility of getting a pat on the back for not escaping when i had the opportunity to do so. of course I'd opt for the latter, however, our judicial system doesn't work on a grab 'em and chop 'em basis.

A better anology would be a WW2 prisoner of war camp, where you're not given any trail, hearing or justice. In this case they just want to torture or kill you regardless. No matter what crime my fellow prisoner had committed, we're united in one cause and that cause is to either survive or to escape. until i escape i share nothing in common with those trying to execute or hurt me.

Except on one playthrough where I had in my mind that my orc was completely devoted to the Legion, I think all of my other characters went with Ralof, even though only one of those ended up actually joining the Stormcloak cause.

I don't see my character as a prisoner of war. Or even innocent. He's kind of open about his criminal nature (to a point.. it's somewhat obvious), and I was rightly imprisoned. I see him as someone who was giving the imperials a lot of difficulty, so they gave up asking questions, beat me down, and put me on a cart.

So.. that all said, the fact that Hadvar still has a soft spot might make me inclined to hear him out or follow him. He's got no reason to trust me either, and yet.. he does anyways.

Not everyone is going to be some good, innocent, wrongfully imprisoned character, destined to be a hero... who holds resentment against imperials.

The problem with this line of reasoning is that you're trying to make the opening situation out to be worse than it really is for your character. Hadvar makes it clear in several points up until the keep that he's trying to save and protect as many people as he can. I had no doubt the situation with the empire would improve once in the relative safety of the keep.

Other than the dragon attack, can you think of a worse situation than being seconds away from having your head chopped off? If anything, the dragon appearing was a case of "Saved by the bell".

Numerous - The captain could have been more tactful, instead of slowing down the process with her stubborn, offensive attitude. Hadvar could have been less sympathetic about the issue. It could have been a less Urgent execution. I could have been deemed worthy of Execution on my own merits instead of as part of a batch-action.

Once hell broke loose and the routine was interrupted, my standing in the Empire shot up dramatically. Once Hadvar found himself in a point with Agency, my chances of surviving shot up dramatically. I spend a good minute trying to choose which one I wanted to chase after, before deciding Hadvar was best.

I can't go with Hadvar 'cause he says "with me prisoner!" when you're supposed to choose between him and Ralof. I just can't see the logic in going with the guy who calls you prisoner.

Hadvar doesn't want you dead. When he tells you to go the block, he's following orders. But later, he says "Still alive, prisoner? Stay with me if you want to stay that way" That says to me that, as far as he's concerned, the execution order is no longer relevant.

He's also very respectful and apparently saddened by the fact that you're going to be executed, making it clear that your remains will go where they need to go.

First time through, though, I followed Ralof. But, having seen the opening scene more than a few times, I've come to the conclusion that Hadvar is an alright guy and that, imperial or not, following him isn't a bad idea.

I see Hadvar's character as someone I could be, if things had gone right. Maybe I like him for that reason alone. Maybe I'll invent a new backstory where my dad was an imperial soldier, and I'm the disappointing son. He would've liked Hadvar more.

It also feels a little humbling when I pick the Thief stone, and Hadvar is like.. "Thief, eh? It's not too late to change your life" or something like that. Ralof says the same thing, but it's more amusing from Hadvar.

It might make. I mean, Hadvar seems ok. He actually seems to be sorry for you. The only unreasonable Imperial there seems to be the Captain, and she's maybe just trying to show off as Tullius happens to be there. Also, the situation - decapitating Ulfric, endind the rebellion - kinda demands that there should be no outsider witnesses to it. That's why they're murdering a complete random type (PC) and a petty horse thief as well. Normally they wouldn't.

That said, I still wouldn't trust a faction that tries to murder me. Even if I saw the reason in their actions like I see here. Possibly I couldn't see the reason if it really were ME that they were murdering. Just no trust to them anymore. But in this case, I understand. It's either a must-murder, or the Captain is just a bad apple that makes the whole basket look bad.

To be fair though... you ARE a prisoner.