Hello All!

I just managed to get FCOM up and running after about 10 hours of downloading and tweaking. I have a few questions that I was not able to find answers to in the FAQs and the forum search so I decided to post them here.

1. When I decide to add in additional mods, such as a quest mod or a house mod, or a summon Dragon/New spells/Whatever, do I need to completely rebuild the patch or just BOSS and position the mods?

2. If I start Wyrebash and don't have dates locked, Wyebash automatically starts to reposition mods and change dates. Is this normal? OR should I always quit with Dates Locked?

Thanks so much!

1. Best practice is to rebuild the bashed patch whenever you add or subtract mods or rearrange your load order.

2. It may be that Wrye Bash is not actually rearranging your mods. Check to see that your modlist is ordered by load order and not some other scheme. Click on the Load Order column-header to sort by load order.

gothemasticator

Wrye Bash should not change date/load order without "Lock Times" being toggled on. Right-click the header in the mods tab and make sure it is turned off.

If it is turned on, and you often go back and forth between WB and OBMM, it will reset the times a lot because WB and OBMM have different opinions about how much separation is required in a timestamp.

Always rebuild your patch when adding new mods. First Boss, then rebuild. Make sure to check the Bash Tags and the options in Wrye Bash and how they relate to the new mod.

Well thank you very much

I am coming into this after being away from the game for 3 years (never had the time), its great to see the game still going after all this time...

If I dont have lock times on, every time it starts, it will tell me it is changing dates, and generally modifies the load order. If I lock it, everything stays where it should.

As for the Bash tags and options, you are referring to when you rebuild the patch? I'm sorry for my ignorance, I just started using the program

Might you be using Vista or Windows 7 and have your game installed in the Program Files directory? If so, you'll want to reinstall it outside of Program Files - C:\Games, for instance. The operating systems are jealous and protective of the Program Files.

gothemasticator

I think its installed in the Oblivion directory, but I'll double check.

I have a few more questions that I have come across since trying out FCOM.

1. None of the DLC quests (Wizards Tower, Battlethorn etc) have popped up. Is this normal in FCOM? Do I just need to go to them to start the quests?

2. Is there some type of leveling guide or beginners guide I anyone could point me to where I can find out where to go before dying almost instantly. I was trying to get to the starting quest location at night on the road and was jumped by bandits and died lol. Another time I was jumped on the way to and inn and I ran inside, with the enemies following me inside to kill the patrons. Any points or links to posts (I searched but couldn't find any) to help me would be greatly appreciated!


Thanks again!

FCOM doesn't affect the DLCs in that way, so you must have something else running that does.

There's an OOO spoilers thread, and and OOO beginners guide around the forums somewhere. OOO is the core of FCOM in terms of levelling, so those guides do apply for the most part.

Hmmm...

I can see frostcrag spire from the Main city, but I didn't get the quest telling me to go there. Not sure about the other DLC, strange, the only other things I have running other than FCOM is Realistic Leveing, Progress, LAME, Supreme MAgicka, and Audious MAgery. I have the unoffical DLC patches, and I Frostcrag reborn. I also used BOSS to position the Load order, with the only change being putting LAME before Supreme Magicka...

The SM plugin refurbish mods change the way you get those quests, as well as several others.

DarnUI and a few other mods prevent the popup messages telling you that you received a quest, but you still get it in your journal.

Post a complete mod list, including anything you installed that does not have an ESP file if you want to know for sure what's going on.

Ok, here is my list:
Active Mod Files:
? 00 Oblivion.esm

? 01 Francesco's Leveled Creatures-Items Mod.esm
? 02 Francesco's Optional New Items Add-On.esm
? 03 Cobl Main.esm [Version 1.72]
? 04 Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm [Version 1.34]
? 05 Mart's Monster Mod.esm [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 06 TamrielTravellers.esm [Version 1.39c]
? 07 FCOM_Convergence.esm [Version 0.9.9a7]
? 08 Progress.esm [Version 2.0]
? 09 HrmnsOblivionScriptOptimizationv1.0.esp
? 0A Younger Hotter NPC's v1.0.esp
? 0B Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp [Version 3.2.0]
? 0C DLCShiveringIsles.esp
? 0D Unofficial Shivering Isles Patch.esp [Version 1.4.0]
? 0E SM Plugin Refurbish - SI.esp [Version 1.05]
? 0F Francesco's Optional Chance of Stronger Bosses.esp
? 10 Francesco's Optional Chance of Stronger Enemies.esp
? 11 Francesco's Optional Chance of More Enemies.esp
? 12 Francesco's Optional Leveled Guards.esp
? 13 Francesco's Dark Seducer Weapons Patch.esp
? ++ FCOM_Francescos.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? ++ FCOM_FrancescosItemsAddOn.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 14 FCOM_FrancescosNamedBosses.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? ? ? Fran Armor Add-on.esp
? 15 Fran_Lv30Item_Maltz.esp
? 16 Natural_Weather_HDR_by_Max_Tael.esp
? 17 Natural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.esp
? 18 Natural_Water_by_Max_Tael.esp
? 19 CampfireBehavior.esp
? 1A WindowLightingSystem.esp
? ++ Item interchange - Extraction.esp [Version 0.76]
? 1B Living Economy - SI.esp
? 1C Living Economy - Items.esp
? 1D Cutthroat Merchants.esp
? 1E Choices and Consequences.esp
? 1F DLCHorseArmor.esp
? 20 DLCHorseArmor - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.5]
? 21 SM Plugin Refurbish - HorseArmor.esp [Version 1.11]
? 22 DLCOrrery.esp
? 23 DLCOrrery - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.3]
? 24 SM Plugin Refurbish - Orrery.esp [Version 1.11]
? 25 Choices and Consequences - SM Plugin Refurbish - Orrery.esp [Version 0.1]
? 26 DLCVileLair.esp
? 27 DLCVileLair - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.5]
? 28 SM Plugin Refurbish - VileLair.esp [Version 1.21]
? 29 DLCMehrunesRazor.esp
? 2A DLCMehrunesRazor - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.4]
? 2B SM Plugin Refurbish - MehrunesRazor.esp [Version 1.11]
? 2C DLCSpellTomes.esp
? 2D DLCSpellTomes - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.1]
? 2E DLCThievesDen.esp
? 2F DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.5]
? 30 DLCThievesDen - Unofficial Patch - SSSB.esp [Version 1.0.4]
? 31 SM Plugin Refurbish - ThievesDen.esp [Version 1.2]
? 32 KDCircletsOOOOptimized - NPC Equip.esp [Version 1.2]
? 33 FCOM_KDCircletsOOOOptimizedNPCEquip.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 34 ExnemRuneskulls.esp
? ++ FCOM_ExnemRuneskulls.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 35 Cobl Glue.esp [Version 1.72]
? 36 Cobl Si.esp [Version 1.63]
? 37 OOO 1.32-Cobl.esp [Version 1.72]
? 38 FCOM_Cobl.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 39 Bob's Armory Oblivion.esp
? 3A FCOM_BobsArmory.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 3B Loth's Blunt Weapons for Npcs.esp
? 3C FCOM_LothsBluntWeapons.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 3D Oblivion WarCry EV.esp
? 3E FCOM_WarCry.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 3F Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp [Version 1.34]
? 40 OOO-Water_Weeds.esp [Version 1.33]
? 41 Choices and Consequences - OOO.esp [Version 0.2]
? 42 FCOM_Convergence.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 43 Choices and Consequences - MMM.esp [Version 0.2]
? ++ FCOM_EntropicOrderRebalance.esp [Version 0.9.9beta2]
? 44 FCOM_RealSwords.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 45 FCOM_DurabilityAndDamage.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? ++ FCOM_SpawnRatesReduced.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 46 Mart's Monster Mod - More Wilderness Life No Gates.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 47 Mart's Monster Mod - More Passive Wildlife.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 48 FCOM_SaferRoads.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 49 FCOM_NoReaversInGates.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 4A FCOM_NoAdventurersInGates.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 4B Mart's Monster Mod - Extra Wounding.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 4C Mart's Monster Mod - Looting NPCs & Creatures.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 4D Mart's Monster Mod - Less Bone Loot.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 4E Mart's Monster Mod - Safer Quest Locations.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 4F Mart's Monster Mod - Gems & Gem Dust.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 50 Mart's Monster Mod - Hunting & Crafting.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 51 Mart's Monster Mod - Farm Animals.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 52 Mart's Monster Mod - Diverse WaterLife.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 53 TamrielTravellerAdvScript.esp [Version 1.39c]
? 54 TamrielTravellers4OOO.esp [Version 1.39c]
? 55 TamrielTravellersItemsNPC.esp [Version 1.39c]
? 56 TamrielTravellersItemsCobl.esp [Version 1.39c]
? 57 ShiveringIsleTravellers.esp [Version 1.39c]
? ++ FCOM_TamrielTravelers.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? ++ FCOM_DiverseGuardUnity.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 58 FCOM_BobsGuardUnity.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 59 FCOM_HungersUnitySI.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? ++ FCOM_Archery.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? ++ FCOM_ArcheryRealSwords.esp [Version 2]
? ++ FCOM_ArcheryHunting&Crafting.esp [Version 1]
? ++ FCOM_FriendlierFactions.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 5A FCOM_MoreRandomItems.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 5B Mart's Monster Mod - Shivering Isles.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 5C OOOLivingEconomyWornRebalance.esp
? 5D OOO-WaterFish.esp [Version 1.34]
? 5E MMM-Cobl.esp [Version 1.69]
? 5F Enhanced Quest Roleplaying.esp
? ++ Enhanced Quest Roleplaying - OOO.esp
? ++ Enhanced Quest Roleplaying - FCOM.esp
? 60 DLCBattlehornCastle.esp
? 61 DLCBattlehornCastle - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.4]
? 62 SM Plugin Refurbish - Battlehorn.esp [Version 1.2]
? 63 DLCfrostcrag.esp
? 64 DLCFrostcrag - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.4]
? 65 SM Plugin Refurbish - Frostcrag.esp [Version 1.2]
? 66 Knights.esp
? 67 Knights - Unofficial Patch.esp [Version 1.0.9]
? 68 SM Plugin Refurbish - Knights.esp [Version 1.06]
? 69 Mart's Monster Mod - City Defences.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? ++ FCOM_Knights.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? ++ FCOM_UnofficialFranArmorAddon.esp [Version 0.9.9]
? 6A Natural_Vegetation_200%_by_Max_Tael.esp
? 6B Harvest [Flora].esp [Version 3.0.0]
? 6C Harvest [Flora] - Shivering Isles.esp [Version 3.0.0]
? 6D Harvest [Flora] - DLCVileLair.esp [Version 3.0.0]
? 6E Harvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.esp [Version 3.0.0]
? 6F Salmo the Baker, Cobl.esp [Version 3.08]
? 70 RealisticForceMedium.esp
? 71 MidasSpells.esp
? 72 SM_OOO.esp [Version 0.87]
? Delinquent Master: SupremeMagicka.esp
? 73 SM_MMM.esp [Version 0.82]
? Delinquent Master: SupremeMagicka.esp
? 74 bgMagicEV.esp [Version 1.7EV]
? 75 bgMagicEVPaperChase.esp [Version 1.68EV]
? 76 bgMagicSpellTomes_for_WryeBash.esp [Version 1.68EV]
? 77 SupremeMagicka.esp [Version 0.88]
? 78 SM_ShiveringIsles.esp [Version 0.86]
? 79 SM_DLCSpellTome.esp [Version 0.80]
? 7A SM_COBL.esp [Version 0.86]
? 7B SM_EnchantStaff.esp [Version 0.80]
? 7C SM_Scrolls.esp [Version 0.84]
? 7D SM_SigilStone.esp [Version 0.83]
? 7E bgMagicEV_Conjuration_for_Supreme_Magicka.esp [Version 1.5]
? 7F AudaciousMagery.esp
? 80 Syc_AtHomeAlchemy_No_Bounty_v2.esp
? 81 attack and hide medium v2.1.esp
? 82 No psychic guards harder v1.2.esp
? 83 ProgressMBSP.esp [Version 1.0]
? 84 ProgressSBSP.esp [Version 1.0]
? 85 RealisticLeveling.esp
? ++ Item interchange - Placement for FCOM.esp [Version 0.77]
? ++ Mart's Monster Mod - Resized Races.esp [Version 3.7b3p3]
? 86 Bashed Patch, 0.esp
? ++ Cobl Filter Late MERGE ONLY.esp [Version 1.53]
? 87 Streamline 3.1.esp

Also, I am getting 2 Delinquent Master: SupremeMagicka.esp for the OOO and MMM cmpatability patches. Not sure what this means...

Thanks so much for the help!

Delinquent master means that the mod is loading before a mod that it is dependent on: Just means that number 77 Supreme Magicka.esp should be loading before those two files.

You have the SM Plugin Refurbish mods, so not getting the quests right away is the correct behaviour. You'll have to find out how to start them yourself. Or find the SM Plugin Refurbish thread/readme and check the changes. More fun to find it yourself.

Things worth addressing:
? 09 HrmnsOblivionScriptOptimizationv1.0.esp >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>You can drop this one. It does exactly nothing helpful (event though it sounds like it does) and it could do some harm if you don't have the SI version.
FCOM Convergence Version 0.9.9MB3>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Do you have the latest version? Yours shows 9.9a7
UOP Version 3.2.0>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>You should get the hotfixes, which will up the version to 3.2.4 or 3.2.5, whichever it's up to right now

Don't at least two of these merge into the bashed patch? Are you checking all the available options when you build the patch?
? 6C Harvest [Flora] - Shivering Isles.esp [Version 3.0.0]
? 6D Harvest [Flora] - DLCVileLair.esp [Version 3.0.0]
? 6E Harvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.esp [Version 3.0.0]

This means that the patch is loading before the plugin that it is patching.
? 72 SM_OOO.esp [Version 0.87]
? Delinquent Master: SupremeMagicka.esp

The above lead me to suspect that you are not running BOSS and rebuilding your bashed patch after each load order change. BOSS would sort out the delinquent master and the bashed patch would sort out the flora issues.

Suggestions:
Drop the following in favor of All Natural. It's better. (And you can keep the Habitat plugin alongside All Natural_
? 16 Natural_Weather_HDR_by_Max_Tael.esp
? 17 Natural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.esp
? 18 Natural_Water_by_Max_Tael.esp

Drop the following (and its patches) in favor of Enhanced Economy. Newer, better, more configurable, more powerful. If you decide to switch, you will have to reinstall Fran's, though, this time choosing the option not to install Living Economy.
? 1B Living Economy - SI.esp
? 1C Living Economy - Items.esp

Thanks, the odd thing is I put in order according to the Supreme Magicka Readme. Also thanks for confirming the DLC is there!

For 09 HrmnsOblivionScriptOptimizationv1.0.esp, that was what was reccomended to me, but I can drop it if you suggest it.

As for FCOM and UOP, I found this files as part of a big rar torrent which had everything included. Can I just update those two files and not break anything else?

For • 6C Harvest [Flora] - Shivering Isles.esp [Version 3.0.0]
• 6D Harvest [Flora] - DLCVileLair.esp [Version 3.0.0]
• 6E Harvest [Flora] - DLCFrostcrag.esp [Version 3.0.0]

You are right, I wasn't incorporating them correctly, they are checked, not +(added). You would delete Taels Natural Environments, for All Natural? I can keep the other Tael esps though?

As for me not using BOSS, I am, I can assue you, but the problem is it puts Supreme Magicka after LAME, which I want to take effect after LAME. According to SM readme, the OOO and MMM eps should go first. Here is the text:

"Plugin Load Order

OOO files (optional)
MMM files (optional)
LAME files (optional)
Supreme magicka.esp
Supreme magicka Optional esps
SM_VanillaSpells.esp
SM_UnlockSpells.esp (Must be last if using VanillaSpells plugin)
LAME conjuration override plugin (Only if you want new LAME summons)
LAME Start Spells.esp (optional)
Deadly Reflex files (optional)
SM_DeadlyReflex.esp (If using deadly reflex)"

Thanks for looking at this and offering suggestions, I am a real noob at ll this modding stuff
*edited to add FCOM and UOP comments...

That readme seems a bit unclear as to whether "OOO files (optional)" refers to the main OOO files (OOO.esp and it's optional add-ons) or to the SM OOO patch.

You'd have to question it in the SM thread (or look at it in TES4View) to know for sure, but whether it's a problem depends on what exactly it does. If it edits parts of the main SM file, then it needs to have the order corrected. If it only edits things from OOO to make them match with SM, then the order doesn't matter as much.

The Delinquent Master warning from Wrye Bash indicates that when the file was created, the order was the other way around though, with the MMM and OOO patch files loading after the main SM file. Which is a good indication that the author intended it that way.

With the UOP hotfixes, yes, you can just install over the one you have and you'll get the updates.

For the FCOM updates, you probably want to check in at the FCOM thread. Read the first two posts, and ask in the thread if you have further questions. But, since you are using the updated MMM, you really should get the updated FCOM files, too.

And, it's probably best in the future to get your downloads from the links provided in the threads here. 99% of mods are hosted at TESNexus and Planet Elder Scrolls. With torrents, you have no idea which version you're getting, and it can mess up your game or your chances of getting good support in the threads here (i.e., mod authors will be annoyed at the torrents, and will demand that you update from a legit source before they will help).

gothemasticator

Note that the latest version of Enhanced Economy detects if Living Economy is running within Frans, and will then give you the option of disabling Living Economy without affecting the rest of Frans, so while it is better to install Frans without LE, it is not a requirement anymore.

But since Bladorthin had LE as separate files in his load order, he of course have to disable/delete those in order to switch to Enhanced Economy.

Thanks so much for the help guys, I have been tweaking things. Any other suggestions to improve my mod list?

Could you re-post the latest version of your load order? It has kind of been chopped up, it looks like...