That's what I was thinking.

I hope that it is possible to mod the time that the AI remains on heightened alert. The other day I shot two bandits - one shot stealth kills and they were not that close to each other, so no reaction is not unreasonable. Then a third comes along, sees his dead buddies, vows to avenge them, stands there for a few seconds and then says "must be my imagination". Ahem ... your buddies are lying dead at your feet with arrows through their chests.

Spotting a dead body should = heightened alert for hours and immediately calling for help.
Taking an arrow and surviving should = heightened alert for hours and immediately calling for help.
Taking an arrow and surviving should = moving towards the arrow.

For those saying it's cheap; tell that to a real-world sniper.

After the first shot, people will be alerted to their prescence yes, firing an arrow will alert nearby foes to your presence too in Skyrim - but it may take many shots before they finally pinpoint their position and begin trying to root you out. This gets even worse if the sniper keeps moving un-seen between different positions before setting up another shot. The highetened alert state doesn't much matter, as long as an enemy hasn't spotted you (visually), they are open to sneak attacks.

If you feel that sniping is too easy, then don't do it. But this is one example of fiction mimicking reality, people often [censored] how unrealistic Skyrim is, but this is one example of realism and you're STILl [censored]ing about it >.<




Only a year or two ago an Iraqi kid with a rifle managed to pin down an entire US army unit for the best part of a day... and he got away on a bicycle.

Nerf bicycles and rifles plox? - Unfortunatly, nerfs don't apply in real life, but when you get to pull off the same stunt in Skyrim, don't [censored] it's imbalanced. It's no more imba than real life.

If you're playing on PC, there is a mod called Pluto's Improve Skyrim Experience (PISE) that, among other things, tweaks the AI to make things more challenging.

You think that's cheap? You should see the tactics my lvl 12 Orc berserker (Master difficulty) has to resort to if he doesn't have a follower...and sometimes even when he does. Exiting the dungeon and re-entering after pretty much every hit, stealth arrow shots and then running away, chugging potions like Red Bull. I'm using (but not abusing) smithing, but my gear is still sh1t right now. I appear to have no choice. I'm hoping things get better as I level up.

[edited, not really relevant]

Pssst, Skyrim is a game. It's not real life. Unless you personally know people that can shoot lightning bolts out of their hands.

Fixed. Get your memes right.

No cheap, Time passes faster in the game, so you may think the enemy gives up quickly but they actually look for you for a while.

Using stealth tactics for a stealthy character makes complete sense to me. There's nothing cheap about it. It's clever, requires patience and makes use of your best skills. I'd find it more unrealistic if I didn't have to use any strategy as a stealth based character.

I am with thejlas, I like it. Just did a cave full of pirates (forget what its called) and one-shot one-killed about 5 or 6 of them in a row. (I then had to jump in the water at the bottom of the cave to loot them, but that is small beans.) Now, in order to increase other skills - and level - I switch off with other methods every now and again.

This also. I kind of use the tactics that I would use in the given situation. And I am not stupid enough to give enemies a fighting chance if I don't have to. The only straight-up fights should be in tournaments and when you absolutely, positively have to.

Yeah I think it's worthless. Dosent help that much,

Cheers

No, they shoot metal slugs out a tube at faster than the speed of sound that can put a hole through a sheet of metal... the means of killing isn't what we're debating, it's the fact that stealth as a means of defence is incredibly "OP" even in real life.

Crysis 1 was not sandbox.

Don't you people like challenge in your game? It's not clever, it's trivial. A 3 yo. could play a stealth archer in this game.

It's the only way an assassin can really fight; hit and run, or hit and disappear, is what you do. For a class that operates by stabbing and shooting people in the back your morality for what constitutes a fair fight is misplaced. If you think it's cheap to fight from the shadows make a warrior then rush in a shield bash/power shot his face in.

I do wish there was some kind of phasing out or bending light texture wrap around the character to actually make you appear less visible, though. It's a little awkward being very visible crouching in an NPC's line of sight and having him act like he doesn't see you.

Of course it is a game, but that doesn't mean that some of the tactics from RL shouldn't be able to apply. It is how are brains are wired. If it is so totally fantastic and fake, why do we have an up-down, colors, depth, etc..? Our brains are grounded in RL and to go away from that so completely is a waste of time, and makes a game unfun - for everyone. It is enough fantasy for me to pretend to be the Dragonborn with magical powers, wandering around a fantastic world with mythical creatures. Lets keep gravity and some other basics, shall we?

I wonder how he handles the concept of real lfie warfare. Where an unmanned drone can end your life from 6 miles away; no amount of armour, concealment or hiding in shadows being able to save you, at the hands of a guy sat behind a computer in another country ;p - it's a far cry from the fantasy model of "honourable combat"

If we're talking about realism then landing that first arrow would be the end of the fight against any humanoid opponent. Arrow to the leg or groin and he's hobbled; arrow to the head and he's dead; arrow to the shoulder he's pained and disoriented enough for you to at least remain hidden. In this game a human opponent bum rushes immediately to your location with the arrow stuck in his head.

At most I think the AI should try to take cover when it's shot, which would mean you'd have to at least reposition and risk exposure to get your next one off. Them teleporting to you or having other means to magically find you and force a straight up fight would defeat the whole purpose of an assassin.

That abstraction doesn't work well as it doesn't affect everything in the equation: Time, distance, and speed. So in "local area" it is best to think of time as real time and acknowledge that stealth is somewhat broken. I know its way better than stealth in previous TES, but similarly to regeneration, it now all feels too cheap to do without consequence. Given those other "exploits", I think stealth is actually quite balanced to those - everything would have to be scaled back to remain balanced. Thiefs have their cheap escapes, but not in all circumstances. Mages have their cheap escapes, but not in all circumstances. And fighters have their cheap escapes, but not in all circumstances. It all adds up (stamina is not the thiefs best friend in combat, stealth is).

Personally I wouldn't mind if the game brought back more from Daggerfall, in that you didn't regenerate. At least not fully. The bars could loose their max potential over time as you used them, but recharge up to the updated potential. You'd had to rest/sleep/eat etc to fully restore your max potential.

If that was in, stealth could be brought down by increasing the search radius and time they spent searching, together with better logics on how they react to what event. Spotted - just the wind - makes sense. Wife dead on the floor with an arrow through her skull - just the wind - seriously? In the latter scenario, the search time could be increased tenfold, with a more randomized pattern on where they look. Falmer are so easy to skill up on given that they're blind, and only go to your last knows position without any searching at all, it's ridiculous. Given the new penalty in that it takes longer, you risk more by trying to take down more at the same time to get it overwith, which in turn increases the risk of getting spotted.

But, the game is now written for "those who don't have time to play it", so Beth doesn't want these kind of penalties because it's less money earned. So for those of us who is not in a rush, and could have these penalties that makes sense, we get the bad end of the deal because we're not the majority of "players" (even if I consider us more "role players"). It's sad, but TES is no longer made for role players, but for players who wants to race through yet another game in the collection.

And I repeat; currently stealth is balanced badly to match the balance of the other elements that "fast players" can't endure. They shouldn't rebalance stealth without also rebalancing the other stuff (regeneration in particular).

stealth is the greatest killer, as it should be. However, once discovered, thieves have a hard time unless they are orcs. Light armor and daggers aren't the best solution to heavy armor wielding maces.

hoblak- the addition of automatic, full, regenerating health is a big disappointment for me.

I've done similar. Even with a Nord skilled with two handed throwing most points into health, on master at level 25 there are many enemies that would kill my character in under a second. So that technique is the only one that would work.

I won't say whether it is "cheap" or not, but it may be the only way.

My main problem with the AI is that once shot they well go to investigate, but eventually end up at exactly the same spot so you can shoot them again.I don't recall that from Oblivion, they'd move around. But in Skyrim they return to exactly the same spot no matter how many times you snipe at them.