As much as I'm digging FONV, 80 hours in, if I run into another freaking invisible wall where there should be no wall...I mean OUT IN THE MIDDLE OF FRACKING NOWHERE...I might just have to chuck this damn trip. Seriously. Why (BLEEPING) Explore if there's a GOSH DARN MO MONEY Freaking wall where ever you go?

I can hang with the bull pucky lag...but if I wanted to be guided through the instance or funneled rather, I'd play KOTOR or some crud. Beth really should of had more oversight of this game's production, cuz that is just crap. It ruins the whole damn experience. I spend a half hour trying to get from point A to point B am feeling real good about finally finding a way up the rocks to get on the Plateau and ...yup you guessed it. Ok maybe you didn't need to guess it since I'm totally telegraphing my punch here but ...yup... Inviso Wall. Arrrrrg... STUPID OBSIDIAN.

It's going to take mods to save this game fo sure. Otherwise. One play through tops.

Oh, come on. <------(Not meant offensively) Its one mistake, I understand the frustration but...

Screw it, I actually agree about the walls. I hope they patch 'em out. :celebration:

Not all should be patched out but some that really are in the way should be removed.

I agree, it seems Obsidian is trying to "guide" our experience using invisible walls. (which is annoying In a game that is about freedom and exploration)

I like the game alot also but the invisible walls in the middle of the map are dumb.

If i have taken the time and effort to get on the high ground i shouldn't be punished by being pushed right back off it within a step.

This irked the heck out of me where there was a pass with some deathclaws,that would have made a awesome shortcut,early on,but my efforts to find a better tactical posistion to snipe them were rewarded with bieng stopped dead in my tracks.

Map edges...great set up walls everywhere.

Middle of map not so cool.

One place I didn't understand was the long invisible wall between Primm and the railroad.
I mean, I understand the invisible walls at the Quarry, they're meant to keep the player from doing a shortcut through them.
But that long invisible walls between Primm and the railroad serves no purpose.
There is no super dangerous enemies along the road or the railraod.
Since I can walk down the railroad it doesn't mean I have to go through Primm for storyline reasons either.
So why is it there?

Invisible wall's made me so annoyed! I'd travel along the cliffs only to discover i wasted my time because i can't get over them.

Would have definitely liked a high nest a Quarry Junction. Sniping from dumpsters, while effective, still kinda svcks.

I really do try to be supportive and constructive with less QQ. Bugs are bugs are bugs and the track record shows they tend to get handled by the devs or the community. This, however, is a major aspect of the game by design and it's just downright LAME in almost every way. I can see barriers at limited locations to keep quest lines intact if it could break by triggering an event or ruining an event trigger by entering an area from an unforeseen way. But this...is Fubar.

I'd even be understanding of it if they wanted to make places accessible through a Mountaineering Perk or something... .. sigh. Honestly man. The Fallout Experience is taking a big hit from this.

Fun tid-bit, we could traverse over a lot of mountain in Fallout 1 and 2 without running in to a invisible wall. :angel:

I wasn't too irritated by the invisible walls until I wanted to go to Vault 11. So I fast travel to whatever the was closest and low and behold, I have to trek all the way around this fairly small hill to get to the tiny ass path to get me into the vault. Why not make is a mesa or something that would have required climbing gear to get over instead of this nice little hill?

I fully am for invisible walls that stop us from basically cheating or making our live far too easy, but that was just mean.

As much as I dislike them as well, they are there for a reason.

AI pathing via NavMesh there is all but impossible, so in order for the enemies and your companions to not go crazy and possibly kill themselves trying to get to you or trying to get off (or even getting lost forcing you to never see them again), they blocked some sections off so you don't end up breaking the game's AI or something like that.

If there was a better way to path the now very aging AI in the engine, then the invisible wall meshes wouldn't be there.

How is it cheating or making life easy if someone has taken the time and effort to make their way to that point?

The two alternatives are taking a very long detour or fast travelling.

Since i play on hardcoe i don't like fast travel and the long detour means consuming alot of food and water while having to make several sleep stops(after which i have to consume even more food and water).

I dislike having to have a 3rd of my carry weight taken up by consumables because of invisible walls and the breaks in them being populated by uber creatures.

You can't be serious man. You can still kill enemies from locations they can't get to you. What's it matter if I'm up 10 feet or up 30 feet? If I use the companions then I should be mindful of their capabilities and limitations. This is the same AI that existed in FO3. I didn't see alot of creatures killing themselves to get to me. No..nice try man but that's not it.... It's Oblidian. Too used to making "Funnel you down the Track" games. They just can't get it out of their blood. I liked KOTOR. Was a good game. But it was a different kind of game. This is Fallout...not Kotor or Neverwinter Nights. I like alot of what they did for Fallout. They seemed very mindful of enhancing the game in ways that make alot of sense. The funnel mentality makes no sense to me. Not for a Fallout game.

By keeping us from basically cheating or making our lives too easy I mean things like getting into locations that no matter what you cannot be attacked by an enemy or be able to dodge a whole lot of stuff. Similar to being able to get yourself almost outside the map, those type of things is what I meant. I'm not a fan of them in the middle of the map or them keeping things separate. I would have no issue if they put in something that was a natural block though.

I've put in just over 100 hours so far, and have yet to be truly annoyed by the invisible walls. However, most of those 100 have been spent in settlements and surrounding areas involved in quests, since 90 hours was mostly just sticking to main quests and 1-10 sidequests over 4 playthroughs. The last 10 or so hours have been on my 5th playthrough which I plan on exploring a lot and doing all sidequests available. I may even carry this character over into the DLC that will be releases in the next few months. I probably have another 10 hours or so in this character just going over different quests that I've already done before, but after that I plan on exploring and doing quests that I've yet to do, even though I may have encountered their starting points in past playthroughs. I haven't even gone into a single vault in any playthrough yet.

The invisible walls have sprung up perhaps 4-5 times since I started playing in a way that annoyed me. I know they're their, but I've mostly been sticking to the roads as I haven't even gotten a single character to level 20 yet. I know they're likely to hinder me at quite a few spots in my current playthrough, and I'm really not looking forward to that... I know they're there because of issues with companions following you almost everywhere, but that same issue existed somewhat in Fallout 3 too. I prefered the way 3 handled it, teleporting your companion to you if it got too far away. I hardly ever use companions though so these walls are going to hinder me to stop a problem I won't be having except for the times I take a companion on long enough to its quest, and I doubt I'll be doing them more than one time since I only care about expierencing the story behind them, and won't be keeping them with me after I get their upgraded gear anyway. I know they can be easily edited out with the GECK, but still that doesn't solve the problem for us poor console players... I'd really like it if they'd just admit it was a mistake and edited them out in a patch.

Some of the mountainous places definitely seemed like a place you should be able to access. If it was a cliff wall I'd understand more of their choices. Opening up a few more high passes that take some skill to navigate would be fine with me personally. Then any flat ground walls could have mine fields leading up to them or like the boomers, just start lobbing shells at you when you get too close.

I understand that theres places the developers don't want us to go for some reason or another, but in my opion invisible walls are just lazy! why not simpley place on object or somekind in the way? a high level of radiation that will kill you? a fatal trap?

Yeah, I'm pretty sure http://www.gamesas.com/index.php?/topic/1124143-invisible-walls-invisable-walls-everywhere/page__view__findpost__p__16523991.

Not the way I worded it, but I was close enough. :shrug:

Also, in FO3, many people complained about losing their companions via this issue, so that's another reason it was probably implemented.

No man. .. That's a "reason." Not the reason. It was just flat out lazy. Most of these places the walls exist are places your companions or AI can't possible get to anyway. I wouldn't be there if I was taking my companion with me. I wouldn't be there if I wasn't trying to stay the BLEEP out of reach of the AI. That's WHY I Go the way I go. Not to mention It saves time. I honestly don't care what they "Say" is the reason. It's Bull Pucky. We know when we're being led by the nose. I guarantee there will be more people QQ about these stupid walls then those crying about their companions dying. The teleport solution worked pretty decently in FO3.

sorry man. The reason is weak IMO. There are other solutions.

There's just no reasoning with you, is there? :shakehead:

I'm pretty sure Jorge Salgado, aka Oscuro, creator of OOO (Oscuro's Oblivion Overhaul) which is the best and most well known overhaul mod for Oblivion, wouldn't lie to us.

I'm pretty sure that's the definite reason. If you don't believe me or him, try consulting him or one of the other devs about it. I'm sure they'd be happy to tell you why.

you lose for calling KOTOR crud. you lose completely, and for that i hope you run into an invisible wall trying to get into the lucky 38 and your entire game is ruined :celebration:

Let me get this clear..you were trying to get on place where AI was not capable of getting to , so you can have easy "I win" button, and since you couldn't do that, it's "bad design" decision.I can't stand games with linearity and walls , but if (like in this case) that will prevent us from abusing AI , then i can accept it.From what i am seeing Obsidian spent time trying to level playing field for us and AI.Not that game is hard anyways , since i am playing on HC/VH and not having any issues.


And there is your answer about what was their main reason for "invisible walls"...

Having such exploitable areas in the first place is a bad design decision. "Invisible walls" is the consequence and NOT a solution.

True, but leaving exploitable area accessible there is even worse.FO3 used DC ruins to keep you out of it, and since this is not highly urban area (at least was not in 50's) they went with this. Placing rocks wouldn't stop someone persistent and raising hills to be heights of Himalaya's would be even more criticized.