I need a no bullspit assessment of gaming laptops.

Post » Tue May 29, 2012 2:39 am

This simply isn't true with modern laptops. Unless you play games with it on your bed, blocking all vents... Or you don't know how to clean out dust bunnies.

When I look at my CPU and GPU heat levels on my gaming laptop, everything is perfectly fine. Just avoid laptops with bad design reviews.
Not everyone uses a laptop in ideal conditions, and it isn't some sort of abuse or ignorance as you imply. If you have such rigid parameters for placement and use use of a portable computer you might as well be using a desktop.
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jesse villaneda
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 1:13 am

Lethos, AMD dual graphics does not work with Direct X 9 games. Skyrim is (shamefully) a Direct X 9 game.

For other games though that laptop is an amazing deal for its price.

True, there might not be native support for cross-fire by skyrim, but I do see a marked improvement in performance when I force it.
It should be noted, that for the Llano, Dual Graphics and Cross-fire works abit differently. Hence why I might see a difference and why someone sporting two Radeons 6X00 series might not get cross-fire to work.
Either way I run it on ultra with the below specs. So take that as you will.

With or without cross-fire this laptop is playing skyrim on Ultra. So to me it's acheived what I wanted from it. It's also a slightly lesser variant of the one I'm suggesting for the OP.
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Rachie Stout
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 7:57 am

Not everyone uses a laptop in ideal conditions, and it isn't some sort of abuse or ignorance as you imply. If you have such rigid parameters for placement and use use of a portable computer you might as well be using a desktop. But do please continue to entertain us with anecdotes about life in your perfect world.

Actually it IS ignorance for the most part. I would say a majority of people that use notebooks, that don't use some type of flat surface, such as a lap, or worse, a bed or couch, don't realize they're blocking intake/exhaust vents. Abuse... not in a knowing sort of way. But, for IT professionals that have to deal with someone complaining about their notebooks frying... usually because they don't know about the notebooks needing proper air exchange, it is usually abuse.

Please note my use of the word NOTEBOOK vs LAPTOP. Laptop is a misnomer and should be deprecated as it implies that a LAPTOP is safe for use on your lap. It is not, for hardware and for male medical reasons. =D
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GLOW...
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 8:27 am

Actually it IS ignorance for the most part. I would say a majority of people that use notebooks, that don't use some type of flat surface, such as a lap, or worse, a bed or couch, don't realize they're blocking intake/exhaust vents. Abuse... not in a knowing sort of way. But, for IT professionals that have to deal with someone complaining about their notebooks frying... usually because they don't know about the notebooks needing proper air exchange, it is usually abuse.

Please note my use of the word NOTEBOOK vs LAPTOP. Laptop is a misnomer and should be deprecated as it implies that a LAPTOP is safe for use on your lap. It is not, for hardware and for male medical reasons. =D
Enjoy using your notebook in your officially proper manner. You inspire visions of a user sitting rigidly in an ergonomic chair, working on their notebook on a perfectly cleared desktop in a well lit, dust free room, chilled to a proper 68F. Users must be dressed in a cleanroom suit, using only the tips of their fingers to type through thin, white cotton gloves as is only proper. Failure to follow mandated usage parameters will not be tolerated! :biggrin:

Oh, and IT called, they want to bolt the notebooks to the desks to further bring them into policy compliance.
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Smokey
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 11:52 pm

True, there might not be native support for cross-fire by skyrim, but I do see a marked improvement in performance when I force it.
It should be noted, that for the Llano, Dual Graphics and Cross-fire works abit differently. Hence why I might see a difference and why someone sporting two Radeons 6X00 series might not get cross-fire to work.
Either way I run it on ultra with the below specs. So take that as you will.

With or without cross-fire this laptop is playing skyrim on Ultra. So to me it's acheived what I wanted from it. It's also a slightly lesser variant of the one I'm suggesting for the OP.

There's support for Crossfire but Dual Graphics is not the same thing as Crossfire. They're not interchangeable terms. Additionally, Dual Graphics should not be confused with AMD's old "hybrid crossfire" where they paired a 4200 series integrated chip with a low-end GPU.

Dual Graphics is automatically disabled when running Direct X 9 applications, switching automatically to the fastest GPU. Here's AMD saying as much:

"AMD Radeon? HD 6000 Series graphics, found in both AMD A-Series APUs and discrete video cards, are designed to deliver the best possible DirectX? 11 experience. As such, the dual graphics performance increase is applicable to select DirectX? 11 & DirectX? 10 enabled applications. For DirectX? 9 applications, the combined performance will be disabled and the fastest graphics engine will perform those tasks"...
http://www.amd.com/us/products/technologies/dual-graphics/Pages/dual-graphics.aspx#4

So you can switch Dual Graphics on and run Skyrim, however it's just going to use your HD 6750 GPU and nothing more. If you're feeling a difference it's likely just a placebo effect.

And wait, you're saying you're running on ultra with that rig? Does that include ultra shadows? What FPS are you saying you're getting? I have an A8-3500M laptop and a coworker has one that's almost identical to yours and neither of us can sniff a happy frame rate with ultra shadows. My understanding is that shadows hit the CPU hard, and that's not Llano's strong point. It's just a die-shrunk Athlon II X4 chip with double the L2 cache...
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Alyce Argabright
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 3:53 am

Thanks for the advice (some better than others) guys and/or gals. I wasn't expecting three pages worth, but the consensus seems to be I got lucky in my original linked choice. However, the decision is not final and I'm still open for more opinions.

To the HP Pavilion: It does look good and has a great price. However, I am a bit wary of the customization for fear of doing something wrong (knowing my luck). It seems I'd get more peace of mind knowing I bought a laptop intended for gaming.

The Alienware looked spiffy until the YouTube review mentioned no DVD/CD drive. It also seems Alienware
http://www.asus.com/Notebooks/Gaming_Powerhouse/G74SX/

http://www.xoticpc.com/custom-gaming-laptops-notebooks-15416-laptops-ct-95_51_149.html Which of those is best?

I may be computer illiterate, but I know not to block the vents and provide proper airflow. Overheating shouldn't be a concern unless it happens even in ideal conditions. As for runtime, there are power outlets everywhere.
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Sara Johanna Scenariste
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 3:01 am

@ OPer...to help clarify for people, to get the best possible advice (and to prevent more dike-waving between some posters),

1) Is the $1000 limit an absolute? What is your honest "not a penny more" price?
2) When you say you need to have mods, do you mean fixes and gameplay tweaks or hi-res texture improvements?
3) What is your target screen size?
4) Being completely honest, is "don't buy anything" an option (even if most people were to tell you that you couldn't get what you want for your price limit)? Or are you getting a laptop come hell or high water? (I'm in the minority in advising to rethink buying altogether, but your answer to this will help people with specific recommendations, cause they understand your mindset)
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Jesus Duran
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 9:31 pm

4) Being completely honest, is "don't buy anything" an option (even if most people were to tell you that you couldn't get what you want for your price limit)? Or are you getting a laptop come hell or high water? (I'm in the minority in advising to rethink buying altogether, but your answer to this will help people with specific recommendations, cause they understand your mindset)

As opposed to stealing one? :thumbsup:

What's your angle on not buying at all?
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Chris Cross Cabaret Man
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 7:31 pm

@ OPer...to help clarify for people, to get the best possible advice (and to prevent more dike-waving between some posters),

1) Is the $1000 limit an absolute? What is your honest "not a penny more" price?
2) When you say you need to have mods, do you mean fixes and gameplay tweaks or hi-res texture improvements?
3) What is your target screen size?
4) Being completely honest, is "don't buy anything" an option (even if most people were to tell you that you couldn't get what you want for your price limit)? Or are you getting a laptop come hell or high water? (I'm in the minority in advising to rethink buying altogether, but your answer to this will help people with specific recommendations, cause they understand your mindset)

1) I'd say, if it was absolutely necessary, I could push it to $1100. But that's pretty extreme.
2) I'm mostly looking at mods that add quests, homes, and items (like Lost Spires and Unique Landscapes for Oblivion, I think it was called). High-res textures and additions would be a nice bonus if the computer could handle it.
3) 11' seems a bit too small. I'd say between 13-17 inches, depending on price. I could also try hooking it up to a TV through HDMI when convenient.
4) "Don't buy anything" is indeed an option, I am very much on the fence about this. It's a lot of money. I'm content with the 360, but having played Oblivion with fantastic mods in the past and the upcoming release of the Construction Kit, I know what I'm missing. Mods make a great game incredible, and I've already run into broken quests and items on my 360 that could have been fixed with the console.
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No Name
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 1:39 am

@ cebalrai...My angle is that I personally find that if I spend money on something that does a mediocre job, I'd rather not buy it at all...and I haven't seen a good gaming laptop for less than $1500...doesn't mean they don't exist, just saying I haven't seen one. So if it was me, I'd consider "don't buy" a distasteful but potential option. If "don't buy" isn't an option for him no matter what, well then doesn't that help us give him proper advice?

If we were talking about the difference between a $30 and $50 item, it wouldn't matter so much. But for a student, a $1000 purchase is major (or should be), so if it were me I'd want to be sure that I didn't spend a grand on something that left me feeling wanting a month later. You guys are better at giving the laptop advice I guess...I'm just giving a little life advice (he can take it or leave it).

(ninja'd)
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Wayne W
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 10:05 pm

1. Agree
2. Agree
3. Haven't had any issues on our Precision Notebooks (higher end workstation/desktop replacement notebooks) with the Quadro FX1500/Quadro 2000 CPUs or with our Latitude Series Quadro NVS 140 series. Possibly the Inspiron based chipsets with the Geforce Mobile graphics that has issues?

I'll second the vote for Dell's Precision line. I needed a cheap gaming laptop, and for some reason workstations go cheaper than comparable gaming machines. My M6300 with a Quadro FX 1600M can run Skyrim on Low-Medium settings with acceptable frames, though it's by no means as pretty as my desktop with a GTX 560. On the plus side, I do get less CTDs with the laptop than my desktop. This is probably a result of the extra stability of professional graphics drivers.
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R.I.p MOmmy
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 11:20 pm

Even though you said no, I'd strongly recommend not buying a gaming laptop.

My brother bought a $2000 gaming Asus laptop a few years back. Within two years, he could barely even play new releases on the lowest settings.

It's simply not worth it.

Buy a cheaper/better desktop and use the saved money to get a tablet for your portability needs.
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Raymond J. Ramirez
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 2:06 am

Even though you said no, I'd strongly recommend not buying a gaming laptop.

My brother bought a $2000 gaming Asus laptop a few years back. Within two years, he could barely even play new releases on the lowest settings.

It's simply not worth it.

Buy a cheaper/better desktop and use the saved money to get a tablet for your portability needs.


If someone buys a $2000 gaming laptop that becomes completely obsolete in less than 2 years, it's their own fault for buying already old junk.

Btw, the OP said not to advise him to just get a desktop. But you did so anyway, lol.
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Kristina Campbell
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 7:44 pm

To the HP Pavilion: It does look good and has a great price. However, I am a bit wary of the customization for fear of doing something wrong (knowing my luck). It seems I'd get more peace of mind knowing I bought a laptop intended for gaming.

It is intended for gaming, also I suggest almost the exact configuration I used. I bought mine a few months back so I was able to upgrade a few parts.
Not like you'd be assembling it yourself, trust me customising a laptop is becoming alot more normal now. They don't give you any option that doesn't work.

But hey, I understand you want to feel comfortable with your choice.
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Elizabeth Lysons
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 7:25 pm

And wait, you're saying you're running on ultra with that rig? Does that include ultra shadows? What FPS are you saying you're getting? I have an A8-3500M laptop and a coworker has one that's almost identical to yours and neither of us can sniff a happy frame rate with ultra shadows. My understanding is that shadows hit the CPU hard, and that's not Llano's strong point. It's just a die-shrunk Athlon II X4 chip with double the L2 cache...

Yes I am running Ultra. 25-30 steady frame rate with ugrid 9 in the open and in nearly all towns. It's smooth, unless I have fraps I won't even realise they were as low as 30.
Admitedly isn't usually more overclocked than in my signature, thats just my normal settings, it's at 3Ghz +, when I want to run Skyrim.
Shadows are rarely worth having on ultra, they still look like crap. If I have them lower it is a nice 45-60.
Sure Llano stock speed might be slow, but I'm not using it at it's stock speed, I've pushed this up to 3.1Ghz at 1.3volts. That is still less than stock voltage of what boost uses.
I guess people just some people underestimate what it's capable off once you open the taps.

We can argue all we want of our own issues, I was just here to advice a guy on a new laptop.
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Sasha Brown
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 4:21 am

I'll second the vote for Dell's Precision line. I needed a cheap gaming laptop, and for some reason workstations go cheaper than comparable gaming machines. My M6300 with a Quadro FX 1600M can run Skyrim on Low-Medium settings with acceptable frames, though it's by no means as pretty as my desktop with a GTX 560. On the plus side, I do get less CTDs with the laptop than my desktop. This is probably a result of the extra stability of professional graphics drivers.

If you put your desktop on Low/Medium it would probably crash less too. Skyrim's Engine can't really handle its own settings on High or higher very well, as it's designed around consoles like the PS3 which only have 256MB of shared memory to work with.

I know for a fact the drivers Nvidia forces on you for their professional video cards generally perform worse than the desktop counterparts. This is especially true for OpenGL games. I wouldn't say they're less stable, just perform worse.

It's not really bad as long as you're not paying a premium for that professional graphics chipset -- if there are cheaper solutions with consumer graphics chipsets, those would be superior for gaming.
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Ann Church
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 1:00 am

Yes I am running Ultra. 25-30 steady frame rate with ugrid 9 in the open and in nearly all towns. It's smooth, unless I have fraps I won't even realise they were as low as 30.
Admitedly isn't usually more overclocked than in my signature, thats just my normal settings, it's at 3Ghz +, when I want to run Skyrim.
Shadows are rarely worth having on ultra, they still look like crap. If I have them lower it is a nice 45-60.
Sure Llano stock speed might be slow, but I'm not using it at it's stock speed, I've pushed this up to 3.1Ghz at 1.3volts. That is still less than stock voltage of what boost uses.
I guess people just some people underestimate what it's capable off once you open the taps.

We can argue all we want of our own issues, I was just here to advice a guy on a new laptop.

I've wondered why AMD didn't clock their Llanos higher...
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J.P loves
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 7:57 pm

If you put your desktop on Low/Medium it would probably crash less too. Skyrim's Engine can't really handle its own settings on High or higher very well, as it's designed around consoles like the PS3 which only have 256MB of shared memory to work with.


How come I play on high/ultra with nearly perfect stability then?
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Anna S
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 6:51 pm

I've wondered why AMD didn't clock their Llanos higher...

They have always been over cautious, used a flexible voltage and core speed to keep things stable, leaving plenty of wiggle room.
This has continued with them embracing the overclocking community more.
I hope in later revisions they atleast consider pushing their processors more and have more high end models.

It can go further, their own in-house tests have pushed these processors to something silly like 7.5Ghz with more extreme cooling.
However I'm sure if I just modified my cooling alittle I could worry less about any thermal downclocking, when I go over 3.2Ghz.
I don't expect to do the extremes that a desktop can which can utilise a bigger and more effective cooler.
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Rude_Bitch_420
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 6:22 am

How come I play on high/ultra with nearly perfect stability then?

As I do on beyond Ultra super-maxxed out settings. However, I was referring directly to Jhelzei's insinuation that his laptop is crashing less because it has an Nvidia workstation video chipset.
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Alan Whiston
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 5:36 pm

Gaming laptops are a disappointing waste of money. They cost way too much, and are far more difficult and expensive to repair and replace parts. I paid nearly $3000 for a gaming laptop. After 2 years, the on-board GPU was overheating, causing the laptop to just shut off on me. There's no way to prevent it now, other than keeping it inside of a refrigerator while playing. The cooling fan stopped working. Good luck finding a replacement. If your warranty is over (and it will be, when this does happen, and it will happen), you are screwed. Do yourself a favor and MAKE ROOM for a desktop. You can get a micro-ATX motherboard, and that's plenty enough anyway.
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jadie kell
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 8:10 am

Gaming laptops are a disappointing waste of money. They cost way too much, and are far more difficult and expensive to repair and replace parts. I paid nearly $3000 for a gaming laptop. After 2 years, the on-board GPU was overheating, causing the laptop to just shut off on me. There's no way to prevent it now, other than keeping it inside of a refrigerator while playing. The cooling fan stopped working. Good luck finding a replacement. If your warranty is over (and it will be, when this does happen, and it will happen), you are screwed. Do yourself a favor and MAKE ROOM for a desktop. You can get a micro-ATX motherboard, and that's plenty enough anyway.

Well you're paying for portable power. Whether or not that's worth the money depends on how much value you place on that type of thing.

If you pay $3000 for a laptop though, you should be getting the extended warranty or an actual insurance policy. If you bought a $3000 diamond ring you would have it insured so why not a laptop? The GPUs on those things can cost several hundred dollars to replace.

That being said the ASUS laptop in the OP is a tiny fraction of the cost you paid and is in a total different category. It has no more chance of overheating than the average laptop with gpu.
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helen buchan
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 8:28 pm

It is intended for gaming, also I suggest almost the exact configuration I used. I bought mine a few months back so I was able to upgrade a few parts.
Not like you'd be assembling it yourself, trust me customising a laptop is becoming alot more normal now. They don't give you any option that doesn't work.

But hey, I understand you want to feel comfortable with your choice.

I'd have to disagree with the statement that a DV6 is intended for gaming. It is a media laptop, intended for music, movies, and light gaming, but it certainly isn't a true gaming laptop and would not match the ASUS in performance. The cooling is also subpar under heavy stress based on what I've seen with several friends of mine who have that laptop.
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A Lo RIkIton'ton
 
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Post » Tue May 29, 2012 4:25 am

I have an ASUS G74, which is the 17" version of what you are looking at (the G53), and with better specs (naturally). I bought mine for 1k (down from like 1.5k) on Black Friday, and so far I'm extremely satisfied with it. Granted, it's relatively beast as laptops go, but I can tell you that I'm satisfied with ASUS. Look around for a deal on a G74 if you can.

My specs involve a GTX 560M with 3 GB of GPU RAM, 12 GB of main RAM, a fast processor, and other goodies. It runs Skyrim on Ultra, no problem. I had to tweak some to get rid of some stuttering indoors, but I suspect this is more of a game thing than my rig, since others are experiencing it too.

I can't speak for this particular model you have in mind, but a great site to check out specs, rigs, and how they compare to others, right down to detailed fps anolysis for specific games is notebookcheck.net. Check it out and read reviews before you buy anything.

Just a quick edit to add that the cooling on this laptop is superb. I forgot I was running starcraft 2 and opened up skyrim, and the laptop didn't even break a sweat.
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+++CAZZY
 
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Post » Mon May 28, 2012 7:18 pm

if anyone is looking to replace their sata hardrive with something fast but cheap and yet not nearly as expensive as an SSD and also has relatively decent capacity.. i'd suggest a seagate momentus XT 7200rpm drive.... combine the SSD+HD technologies.... it'll boot/shutdown fast and it's automatically able to determine what to load onto the SSD for fast load times and it'll change that over time too...

great for a significant boost.
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Horror- Puppe
 
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