that every mechanic could have been done better.

the crafting? a pitifully short list of items can be crafted, with no real variations within its own design...

the melee? once again we get the slashfest that is TES FPS (first person smashing). There are once again steps in the right direction, the shield moves add something nice. however...no ability to dodge/roll? really? hit detection is still woeful as well. against anything more then 2 enemies its just a confusing mess of flailing limbs. so many games have good combat...why does TES still fall behind?

the archery? there are plenty of shoting mechanics to rip from and yet they stick with such a barebones approach.

stealth? well from a immersive PoV its laughable, makes 0 sense.

magic? the dualcasting is cool at first until you realize its more gimmick then anything, so few combinations to be used, so few interesting things to discover.

dialogue/quests? wasnt aware that no matter what i choose to play as my char is a 12 yearold manchild with no free floating thoughts or opinions of his own. made evident by hte lack of dialogue options and the more often then not only one dialogue option to select...why do i haev to click on it if there is only one?

skyrim is a promising game, i can only hope that the modders can do miracles to make the mechanics of this game truly be something to talk about. right now its a pretty exploration game with incredibly dated and shoddy mechanics alla round.

i also blame the perk system, so much potential wasted! oh look the sneak tree i can put points to make my sneaking beter...herp derp fun

And you constructive arguement is...? We really need a "Baseless Complaints" thread.

baseless is th wrong word sir, what your looking for is unconstructive which i admit may be slightly true., my base for my argument is the mechanics in this game while numerous, are all poorly done. which for me at least, detracts from the game.

I like tight gameplay in my games, always have /shrug, i find the mechanics in this game mirror mechanics in other games, but said other games do it more indepth/better controls/more options, etc.

You mean everything in the game could have been done differently and you would have been happier? Welcome to the club, it's a very exclusive club that only has as many members as there are people who played the game.

No one said anything about Skyrim is perfect and every part of the game could be improved in some way to them. The same can be said for anything.

I forgot where it is, but there are perk points for rolling.

I stopped reading after the part about having more than two enemies the combat becomes a mess of flailing limbs. Because you obviously dont understand how reality works. Unless you are in an action movie if you have three guys surrounding you, its not going to look like a pretty choreographed dance, its gonna be a mess of flailing limbs, especially when you're dealing with an 4 idiots with swords who dont really know what the hell they are doing.

Unconstructive as in you provide no solution to the problem, and baseless as in you state that its not right yet provide no reason as to why that is. And as for combat, you could do a LOT worse. Be glad this isn't Call of Duty's point-and-shoot combat.

im not talking that it could be different, im saying the current mechanics are straight up inferior to similar products (as a game that embodies so many types of gameplays, its easy to make comparisons) im not asking to have th combat of x and the shooting of y and the stealth of z...but make it on a similar level and not feeling like its 5 years older.

and the person commenting about the logistics of melee combat...yes, lets take a game wher ei can breathe fire and inject reality based melee combat in it. certain things arent in a game because it isnt fun, and sloppy combat be one of them. even 1v1 its a by the numbers and very rigid experience.

and my argument isnt baseless because i did provide a information, the mechanics are unprecise, unrefined echoes of more fleshed out mechanics of other games.

maybe this is what they meant by not looking at the game too closely. the more i play it the more i find myself going back to games like dragon age (origins), witcher 2 adn dark souls. TES scratches my (make yoru own hero) itch but then it leaves a lot to be desired mechanic wise.

i'd lilke a short list of the CONSOLE games that you feel have "tight gameplay" and are so much better than skyrim.

who cares about consoles? my ps3 is a blue ray player

and you fail at reading a bit. i never said a game was all around better then skyrim, but skyrim has many gameplay mechanics as its a build your own kind of adventure. however, each of thsoe mechanics (dialogue/choices, stealth/crafting/melee/ranged) are all inferior to games that have done those specific things better.

dialogue, most older rpgs (even older TES games), most recent...dragon age origins.

stealth, splinter cell series

crafting, well..honestly, most games do it better.

melee, dark souls, god of war, hell...halo has more satisfying melee (discounting the higher damage) half the time

ranged, virtually any fps to date

now before you open your mouth (i know, probably too late for some) im not saying i want the exact mechanics of each ported to this game. im saying, in a world where so much is done so well, why does TES strive to be mediocre at it all? why not some better ai scripts for dealing with stealth? why not more then left click for melee? power attack is nice, but there can be a lot more. why not some real interesting spells other then the strict almost 6 hour long main story fps feel the spells are atm.

and the perks, the perks couldve addressed all of this, but instead they give perks boring stat modifiers like more damage, better sneaking, % chance to proc some effect, etc.

good examples were shield bash, time slows, zoom, shield charge (knocks down opponents), twohander power attack hitting multiple opponents, to a extent sneak rolling.

these few perks changed how you played, and had a real impact on your gameplay. making you feel like you really are better at x skill. its just too bad they are so stark.

i hope modders do a perk overhaul where they get rid of static effects and add some real depth to gameplay.

edit: an example of things id like to see, a cover system both for combat and stealth, the ability to par kor (ya mispell) for more agile players. a better stealth system with more reasonable AI actions and reactions. more going on in melee combat then a mass of left clicks punctuated by a block or power attack. the ability to dodge/roll. AI that shows the I. better hit detection/weight with weapons. a lock on feature of some sort. a counter system. elemental magics interact with eachother/environment. more then one choice to do a quest, as well as the option to permanently deny it. etc

So you are commenting on the fact that Skyrim as a game has inferior mechanics then games based solely around that mechanic? No duh.

Skyrim Stealth vs a 100% Stealth based game. Who do you think will have the better stealth system?

Ranged combat versus a Shooter's ranged combat: That's just laughable that you would even compare a single type of gameplay to a game that's very genre is "First Person Shooter". Those games certainly aren't about the deep background lore and open exploration.

As for the perks, some have to be stat boosts. They can't all be dynamic game changing features.

This is definitely a case of unfair comparison. And as for why Bethesda would "strive to be mediocre at all", it's because they didn't have several million dollars, a couple hundred more staff members, a couple of extra years, or see the need to expand their data usage to that of 2 DVDs or more to try and be the best at everything.

Just 2 cents on melee.

I agree about the 1st person is very cumbersome and awkward, in 3rd person though, I find it way more rewarding, better controll and varied animation.

Pardon. What's you age? I'm starting to feel the millenium gens are ought right spoiled.

Couldn't agree more. This game is a turd.