This is canon : Fallout: New Vegas

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:33 pm

I can't imagine it being canon. It's not only the most boring possible ending, but I simply can't imagine the NCR winning. The NCR can't possibly hold on to the territory they have and they aren't strong enough to fend off their enemies. They won the Dam the first time, and had to fight for it again four years later. If they win again now, it'll only be a matter of time before they get challenged again. Be it by the Legion, the Great Khans, the Brotherhood of Steel, the Enclave (they're still in Chicago, might as well be in a lot of places).

Winning Vegas will be the eventual death of the NCR, not their gain. A Legion win would be the immediate destruction of the NCR. Mr. House, as I see it, will oddly enough be the savior of the NCR. He will prevent the NCR's expansion. This seems like a bad deal for the NCR, but I really think it's best for NCR to hold on to the territory they have and not expand any further. It'll only weaken them and they will end up losing not only their newly-annexed areas, but very likely also parts of their current territory. The other thing Mr. House will do is having Vegas and the Mojave area function as a buffer between NCR and Legion territory. He'll hold off the Legion and allow NCR to regain their strength. They won't need to fear Mr. House as he is not interested in annexing NCR territory, and they'll be able to profit from his technological advance and development.

A Mr. House win is not only the most logical and most interesting ending, it's also the 'best' ending for humanity and the NCR.

That's what makes it great! An NCR win actually overextends them even more and continues their problems, thus keeping the Mojave hopping and ensuring it remains an interesting place in the long term. If House wins, he defuses tensions between NCR and the Legion and forces NCR to sit back and build up strength, and where's the fun in that?

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:55 pm

I feel really bad because ncr will be cannon because of moore's speech at the battle (on iPod right now cannt post links sorry)

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:41 pm

You know, I know how this is going to sound, but what if there's no canon ending? What if Obsidian has decided to adopt a Bioware-ish policy here, A.K.A. being able to import your save game into FO4 with all the decisions that entails?
If not, I'm going to guess the Independent ending, mostly because that means no actual faction gets control of Vegas. Anarchy makes for interesting story, and more quests in FO4.

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 5:51 pm

Eiher Independence or House, will be canon and here 's why.
First, It can retain the status qou between the Legion and the NCR, leaders on bothsides are alive. Neither side is persuing the other until there gone. This lets the NCR and the Legion remain stable. If the legion wins the loss of the dam would be a huge blow to the NCR as they've been using it for power for the past five years. If house or Yes Man is canon the NCR can still buy power from Hooverdam.

Second if either Yes Man or House wins in the short term the larger world isn't really effected. they could refer to the Independent State of Vega that beat out both the NCR and the Legion without directly stating if House is in controll or not.

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 9:52 am

I think that the NCR's ending will become Cannon.

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:49 pm

I think it is quite obvious that the House ending will be canon. I mean, why would they not want an enigmatic character with robot army lording over Las Vegas. It keeps all factions and leaves the door open for future conflicts in the Vegas region. I just don't see why they would want to kill House off, he has potential. Options are good for future storytelling.

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:53 am

I think it is quite obvious that the House ending will be canon. I mean, why would they not want an enigmatic character with robot army lording over Las Vegas. It keeps all factions and leaves the door open for future conflicts in the Vegas region. I just don't see why they would want to kill House off, he has potential. Options are good for future storytelling.

This a hundred times over.

The House ALWAYS wins. B)

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:34 pm

I don't see any reason why it should be House, because it basically just leaves New Vegas where it started. With the NCR grasping for control, the Legion waiting over the river, and House in control. I'd be disappointing in the canon ending of New Vegas just serving to return things to their original status quo. For similar reasons, I don't think the Independent ending would work either, because it essentially replaces the interesting and developed character of House with the unnamed Courier. So, judging from the series disposition towards "good" endings, I would say that most likely the game will be canonically NCR aligned.

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 5:09 pm

I don't even know if there will be a for sure canon ending relating to WHO won the dam. I think that in the future if you just ask someone what happened at the Hoover Dam, they'll just say "it was too bloody to speak of." Of course, if it was a Legionary that said that, it would either be Independent or NCR as Canon, or if trooper it would be Independent or Legion, etc. Just think about Fallout 3, the only canon ending was that the Enclave lost, it never spoke of the Purifier (to my knowledge).

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 2:01 pm

That's what makes it great! An NCR win actually overextends them even more and continues their problems, thus keeping the Mojave hopping and ensuring it remains an interesting place in the long term. If House wins, he defuses tensions between NCR and the Legion and forces NCR to sit back and build up strength, and where's the fun in that?

Exactly. If the NCR wins this one it means they continue being inefficient, it means that the warhawks become the norm. I WANT to see the NCR collaspe/go into civil war trying to overextend itself. That would be an amazing tale of empire. Can you picture Fallout Arizona? The Legion is coming back, the NCR's alliances are falling apart, they've learned no lessons from the Mojave campaign due to the Courier solving most problems AND because of the Hoover Dam they have more bad ass troops, guns and dare I even say vechices? By the NCR winning we get a more compelling story later. If they lose they stop expanding, they reform and then House creates a buffer zone between them and the rest of America. We're probably not going back to the Mojave, so a House or Independent ending simply stops NCR related things, and most Fallout fans love the NCR. And even if you don't love the NCR can you picture a fall out where you get to see it collaspe?

» Thu Jun 30, 2011 1:26 am

I think it is quite obvious that the House ending will be canon. I mean, why would they not want an enigmatic character with robot army lording over Las Vegas. It keeps all factions and leaves the door open for future conflicts in the Vegas region. I just don't see why they would want to kill House off, he has potential. Options are good for future storytelling.

Quite the contrary, as a matter of fact. House actually stops any potential future inter-factional conflict in the New Vegas region. He will create an unassailable pre-War stronghold, which neither NCR or Legion will be able to penetrate. This will defuse tensions between the two completely, as House establishes a buffer zone.

However, House has no expansionist inclinations himself. So the Mojave essentially becomes a tribute to pre-War America, all conflict in the region stops, and it becomes a rather sedate place.

If NCR or Legion wins, they begin pressing up against each other even more, and further mass conflict is virtually guaranteed.

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:36 pm

Quite the contrary, as a matter of fact. House actually stops any potential future inter-factional conflict in the New Vegas region. He will create an unassailable pre-War stronghold, which neither NCR or Legion will be able to penetrate. This will defuse tensions between the two completely, as House establishes a buffer zone.

However, House has no expansionist inclinations himself. So the Mojave essentially becomes a tribute to pre-War America, all conflict in the region stops, and it becomes a rather sedate place.

If NCR or Legion wins, they begin pressing up against each other even more, and further mass conflict is virtually guaranteed.

We'll agree to disagree on this. I think conflict would be inevitable. And Vegas would not be impenetrable. There are so many ways a writer could write in a way to neutralize the Securitron army, EMP, Hacking, etc. In fact, Vegas would probably become a trading hotspot as some people push east. And Legion and NCR, or any splinter of those groups, would want Vegas because of what it represents. Plus with a seemingly endless supply of power, it would still be very attractive. Remember, wars are over resources normally, which is why the dam is so important.

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 8:22 pm

You know, I know how this is going to sound, but what if there's no canon ending? What if Obsidian has decided to adopt a Bioware-ish policy here, A.K.A. being able to import your save game into FO4 with all the decisions that entails?
If not, I'm going to guess the Independent ending, mostly because that means no actual faction gets control of Vegas. Anarchy makes for interesting story, and more quests in FO4.

Theres no way that can happen it would would probably require to much work.

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:36 pm

We'll agree to disagree on this. I think conflict would be inevitable. And Vegas would not be impenetrable. There are so many ways a writer could write in a way to neutralize the Securitron army, EMP, Hacking, etc. In fact, Vegas would probably become a trading hotspot as some people push east. And Legion and NCR, or any splinter of those groups, would want Vegas because of what it represents. Plus with a seemingly endless supply of power, it would still be very attractive. Remember, wars are over resources normally, which is why the dam is so important.

True but that would require us going BACK to Vegas again, and honestly
A.That's probably not going to happen
B. More places need to be explored, Legion terrorities, The Commonwealth, Maybe Baja

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 1:51 pm

Yeah, probably the only real effect that this canon is going to have is some reference in a later game. Which is fine with me. But, they could keep the door open...

» Wed Jun 29, 2011 9:34 pm

Yeah, probably the only real effect that this canon is going to have is some reference in a later game. Which is fine with me. But, they could keep the door open...

I would think that, but I have a feeling Obisidan will want to finish the story of the NCR and probably flesh out the Legion. Just go look at Van Buren and see how many things from that game they've put in here. The whole concept of the Legion is from that unfinished Fallout among other things. Honestly the story of the southwest is just getting started though if they continue the NCR's role will probably be diminised which is sad. I honestly would love to see the story of the fall of the NCR...