That's what I mean though. What forces do the thalmor have to dominate with? 20 years isn't enough time to rebuild their forces, heck it took nearly 200 for them to feel somewhat confident about attacking the empire in the first place. If this war is finished quickly for either side, that spells bad news for the thalmor.

I just murdered a certain orc. I'm sure I will see what you're on about soon.

I suppose that is a good point. Still, I like to have some sort of reason in my head for supporting the Imperials. And after slaughtering several Stormcloak camps already, I guess there's no going back, eh?

Well it's kind of a meta-gamey reason. I wouldn't expect every citizen of tamriel to be up to snuff on all events that have taken place. It's as good a reason as any. Believing the empire is the best choice isn't a wrong or terrible decision. It's had a good track record til the most recent past. Heck for my characters I've done on the legion side, they had the notion that they were going to reform the empire from within to prevent such disasters from ever happening again.

For the OP: Fight for the cause which you think is just. Everything we tell you here is twisted by our own opinion. Read the ingame-books on the topic like The Great War etc and talk with NPC's to gather knowledge.

Just remember: Neither side is "good" or "bad".

But there are a few FACTS, which helped me to decide:
-Titus Mede II is a coward. Read my first post in this topic or the great posts of Cecilff2 and you'll know why. I will never support a coward who can't do the best for the land because of his fear. He has responsibility for the Empire and he screwed it.
-You could call Ulfric Stormcloak racist. But I call him "suspicious of other races". If you prove to be trustworthy, you gain his respect. A great example for this is the Altmer shopkeeper in Windhelm. Heck, I think it's the best proof that he's NOT racist!
-Ulfric knows how to use the Thu'um and he learned it from the Greybeards. If you played a bit of the main quest, you'll see that they wouldn't let any barbarian jerk study with them.
-Ulfric Stormcloak has one highly valuable thing Titus Mede II does not: Determination.

I'm starting to lean more towards the Imperials now, but still haven't made a final decision, because it will allow the Imperials to focus on the Thalmor, and after they're decimated with the help of the Dragonborn, maybe Talos will be brought back into the Empire.

Another reason is because I shouldn't let my character's first experience with the Empire taint his attitude towards them. After all Hadvar seemed sympathetic, but couldn't stop the execution because of his ***** of a superior.

Also the above post is also tainted by opinion

All I had to do was visit Windhelm to see Ulfric for the racist pig he is that's just out for his own glory. Yeah after that visit to all his people especially those he didn't give a rats ass about made up my mind. As a redguard it was a easy choice the legion made a mistake a almost fatal one for me but liberating all people should be above all in my eyes not just the few...

Hahaha. Like the redguards don't act the same way. This isn't the real world. The redguards along with the bretons almost completely genocided the orcs(Twice). The empire protects cyrodiils interests and leaves the provinces to their problems. Argonians tend to kill most non-argonians that enter black marsh. Dunmer hate nords and beast races and believe themselves better than everyone else. Nords don't like other races in their land and believe men to be greater than mer. The altmer of Summerset want to genocide the men and end the world. Bosmer stand divided against themselves(One bunch support the thalmor, the other don't. The ones that didn't were eliminated when the thalmor arrives) Which leaves the Khajiit. I don't recall anything too out of hand there, but I don't remember much about them besides their crazy physiology and the moon cycle stuff.

Also, how do you feel about the khajiit motherland and other members of your own race?

The khajiit are one of the 3 Aldmeri Dominion (Thalmor) races, apparently growing up in hammerfell has caused your khajiit to hate his own people xD - it's in the aldmeri dominion's best intrests if the stormcloaks win (They're more likely to enter into a truce or alliance than the empire which still has machinations of returning to it's former glory). Even better if nobody wins and the fight drags on as that'll weaken both sides and make it easier for the Thalmor to just walk in and "save the day", resulting in both populations being happy for their intervention

Wait, what? You didn't read the Thalmor dossier about Ulfric, did you? It clearly states that a Stormcloak victory is to be avoided at all costs.

Huh? The one side that's crying out for thalmor blood is more likely to form an alliance with the thalmor than the ones currently obeying their every whim? What?


If he's taking a khajiiti approach to things, the Khajiit worship the moons in the sky as well as Azura. The moons in the sky are Lorkhan's rotting flesh. Talos is mantling lorkhan which means the 2 have become indistinguishable.(In the same way the CoC is now Sheogorath)

So that makes me wonder what the thalmor have going in Elsweyr, or what the Khajiit in Elsweyr thought of the WGC when the thalmor showed their true intentions.(The thalmor had tricked the khajiit into thinking they were the ones that returned the moons to the sky, so the khajiit hailed them as saviors)

LOL

This one thinks you're making a lot of assumptions. Not once did you even SPECULATE that Skyrim could indeed hold back the Thalmor in their mountainous region, withstand Imperial influence for the long haul (they're no big fish anymore) and, based on the Thalmor's own speculation, the Stormcloaks quick victory would be a disadvantage.

The Thalmor are weakened too. Ulfric blazing through Skyrim and gathering support may well make their snooty arses realize that an angry Skyrim and Hammerfell DOOMS their plans.

Fun playing assumption, no?

Does J'derras like awesome, manaiacal laughter and badasses who spit lightning out of his mouth? Go Stormcloaks. Does J'derras like to be bored? Go with the Empire.

Correct. Elves fear the nord uprising even though they support the concept for weakening purposes.

Elves know the axe is mightier than the quill.

You do know the Khajiit pledged allegiance to the Thalmor, right?

Well, at least Elsweyr has.

My guess is the northern tribes couldn't care less. Probably the city cats that brokered that deal....

...or maybe not. The moon thing probably freaked out the sand-dwellers in the boonies.

The OP was very insistant he joins a side, players like to play all the content no matter what. In which case the Stormcloak victory is the lesser evil as noted by the dossier - but best case scenario, as I said and the dossier clarifies is that the war be kept boiling over as long as possible to maximise damage to both sides and to pave the way for Thalmor occupation/liberation/annexation.


Skyrim alone is weaker than skyrim under the empire. They will fold to the Thalmor, the empire has machinations of their return, which is why they want skyrim so badly - but yeah I spoke out of line there thinking about it again. Thalmor would never allow them to worship Talos which is the one thing Ulfric cannot give up since he's made it his rallying call (Even if it's not his actual belief, his actual motivation just seems to more about power and vindicating the sacrifices in the great war), so an alliance would not be possible as Talos worship is the one thing the Thalmor can't let stand as it's counter to their own objectives.

A seperate skyrim is still easier to conquer

I asked the lore guys about this, seen it quoted before and they couldn't agree whether Talos IS Lorkhan's mantled successor or not. But I have pondered whether there'd be a long term problem. The khajiit might not worship Talos, but they are irrevocably tied to lorkhan, and it's Lorkhan more than anything that robbed the elves of their immortality. As for how the khajiit take it if or when it was revealled they were tricked with the moons; you only have to look at how the khajiit have benefitted from Thalmor rule in contrast to the Empire - I'm pretty sure I'd forgive them ;p (The Dutch conquered England which ended the dark ages and paving the way for new development without the yoke of the church; there is such a thing as the right invasion at the right time).

incidentlly, the player character seems to be walking the same path as Talos/Tiber Septim, are they implying that the Dovahkiin is going to take up Talos' mantle? - Given Talos led the nords to conquer tamriel where does this leave the khajiit or argonians... Argonian or khajiit conquering Tamriel would certainly mess with the timelines xD