I don't do any smithing and very little enchanting... because of the lack of variety of weapons (and even weapon damage!), I found myself using the same weapon for 10-15 levels or more before something else came up.

I just don't want to "bother" with smithing - i know that this is a personal preference, of course.

But a little too often I come out of caves wondering why I risked my life. An occasional "word wall" or powerful item comes up, but not often enough for my taste. And I also just went through the quest where I got the Ebony Mail... it isn't so great compared to the Ebony armor I was already wearing...

R

Yeah, it'd be cool if finding those materials became an perilous adventure in itself.

In my opinion, it is a major step forward to not put as much magical loot in the game as Oblivion and Morrowind.

At higher levels in those games, enchanted and Daedric stuff was just way, way too common.

It was like you couldn't stroll 10 meters without tripping over a Mundane ring or something like that. It really killed immersion.

I found plenty of interesting stuff. But, then, I like the fact that the TES games pile on the "normal" stuff, too. Rather than the typical "grind out 4000 kills hoping for some "epic" Prefix Sword of Suffix. So, when I found 50% fire resist Elven Boots in a chest, that was a great find. Ditto with the 50% frost resist Glass shield. I also liked Dawnbreaker and Azura's Star. Also found some "rare drops" of unenchanted Daedric and Dragon gear. From where I stand, there was plenty of generic "loot" to sell for cash, a good variety of magic loot to use or D/E, and plenty of options for unique artifacts.

But, again, like I said - I'm not expecting loot like in Diablo or WoW. When I want to do a Random Colorful Loot fest, I play one of those style games.

(The character I describe used Smithing - so I could improve those magic items I found, and make things for slots I didn't find good stuff for; but didn't have Enchanting... which meant that those random magic items I found? Were better than what I could craft. Actually, at 50% bonus, they were better than what I could make unless I hit 100 Enchanting and started stacking dual enchants across multiple locations.)

most loot i find is on the unimpressive side. but there's a perk that increases your chances to find magic items and more gold (i think in lockpicking tree...don't quite recall all the details). has anyone taken that perk and then gone done dungeon crawling? i haven't but based on how strong so many perks are, i would be interested to see what someone with that perk finds. of course the counterargument is 'look what i can make instead' and it's still probably better than anything one will find with a loot perk.

i will add that my characters find good quality loot (especially armor components) and before i even think about touching smithing or enchanting (if i do) i typically have some nice pieces of equipment that suit my build.

the only flaws i see with the loot system are:

enchanting and smithing kill the motivation to go treasure hunting

and magic items too often have inferior versions of what the player can enchant themselves. i would have liked to seen more items like daedric artifacts, in that they have unique properties but not necessarily powerful. loot should offer the player tactical possiblities where the player has to consider the item's value outside of raw numbers. i hope that made sense.

I'm not in it for the treasure, I'm in it for the adventure. And nothing gets kills in that respect.

It is a fine balance between loot and crafting. It needs to have similar levels so that people can equally do either. I have noticed that when I play a smithing playthrough the loot is crap but when I play a loot only playthrough (smith only to improve) the loot seems rewarding.

i don't disagree. it's still fun finding a new area. what i refer to is the repeated disappointment of opening chests or looting bodies only to find a lockpick, 7 gold, and junk weapon/armor item. it kills the fun of opening a chest when you pretty much know what you're going to find....and what you're going to find is pretty much junk (though i hear some may call these 'treasures').

i like looting, it's like christmas every dungeon. but after a certain point in the game (and that point comes far too soon), it's a waste of time because i no longer need money, gear, or crafting materials.

Access to materials in shops is leveled, if you want advanced materials early you have to go an mine them. At high levels you also run into the weapon and armor.

Considering how enchanting works, no.

It's a good thing that smithing and enchanting is relavent, compared to the best items in the game. Otherwise why bother? I think it's good that it's at least as good, if not better than the best items. This is just a case of "different doesn't mean better". The special items in the game are unique, and you cannot make them. The unique enchantments are good alternatives, despite the item being less powerful. Know what I mean? You sacrifice some Armor Class or weapon damage for the [sometimes] better, or more useful enchantment.

I think the balance between the two is perfect. Especially because not everyone puts a bunch of points in crafting.

As a side note, I do think that smith improving is overpowered.

Regarding loot, I would like to see very rare item drops. I personally don't "farm" creatures or read hint guides, so it would be amazing to find something really rare (and powerful) once in a while, and have no idea what the conditions for the drop where. I also am partial to magenta.

Also, people claiming to find stuff in shops, like Deadra hearts. I have not experienced loot showing up at vendors until I have already come across them in the game world. For example, once I have found gold ore, vendors will start carrying it. Once I've found a daedra heart, vendors start carrying it. It's quite simply a good idea by Bethesda. So, I don't know if you are mistaken, or if it's just my game. No way I will find ebony armor at a shop until I have seen ebony armor in game already.

Semi-related, there's a particular vendor (no spoilers), that carries far too good of loot. Better than the stuff I've ever found, and always has a lot of it. Very bad for gameplay, hope it's just a balance issue, and not by design. It's either the drops svck and need to be improved, or the vendor needs to be nerfed, in my experiences (~1000 hours). EDIT: I suppose they should be equalized. So that yes, you can buy great items occasionally, but you should also be able to find them occasionally. If shops didn't have anything worthwhile, gold coins would be useless. But if drops svck, it's just less exciting and motivating for dungeon crawling.

Maybe make all things you can smith svck, and normal loot is always just as good or better than that.

But you can find 'legendary recipes' by historic smiths that are very rare, but when used, the things you can make are excellent.

Uniques should be more powerful and the benefit you get from crafting is that you can improve them further. But for the most part many of the Uniques are pretty weak and they do not upgrade very well at all.

I found a 'helmet of water breathing'. But I'm not sure if it's quite the same...