[Mandi Norton]

I think there is plenty of room for blame here. Sony should have designed the PS3 to be more developer friendly, and Bethesda should have had the logic and foresight to design their engine to accommodate the PS3 specifications like many other developers.

The problem isn't that Skyrim and its DLC can't work on the PS3, its much more likely the problem is that to get it to work would require more of an overhaul of the game than Bethesda is willing to do.

[Alberto Aguilera]

As for people calling for boycotts, my advice would be to just buy used copies of Bethesda games.


That way you get to play the game, and Bethesda doesn't get any of your money and doesn't get an additional sale recorded.

[kat no x]

Don't worry I won't you see they [censored] lied and said Skyrim was on a new engine and would run just as good as the xbox and pc version. I won't be fooled again trust me.

Yes, PS3 got "lots of attention". That's what they told us. How were we to know differently?

[tannis]

I think there is plenty of room for blame here. Sony should have designed the PS3 to be more developer friendly, and Bethesda should have had the logic and foresight to design their engine to accommodate the PS3 specifications like many other developers.

The problem isn't that Skyrim and its DLC can't work on the PS3, its much more likely the problem is that to get it to work would require more of an overhaul of the game than Bethesda is willing to do.

You can't blame Sony Bethesda has had since 2007 to learn how to code on the PS3 like pretty much every other developer has.

[Elea Rossi]

*raises hand*


How did we go from "not satisfied with the way it runs on PS3" to "We may not be able to fix it"? I briefly saw the update at work this morning (while on break, of course ) and thought "hmmm.. odd..". I've posted pithy quips and light hearted silly poems to soften the mood, but this is an interesting turn of events. At this point it looks like my waiting comes down to these choices: never play DG (most viable because I have a PS3), buy an Xbox and Skyrim, along with an Xbox Live membership AND the DLC (absolutely no way in an icy cold hell), or buy it for PC (again, no way as I don't play games on my computer anymore. I could, but.. I just don't. Also, I most certainly will not purchase a game I already own!). Can we say "dropped the ball"?

And for Hearthfire.. yeah right. SHOULD it come out for PS3 forget it. I see enough of house-building and child-raising when my kids play Harvest Moon. You can keep that junk. I initially thought I'd get it for a more complete Skyrim experience, but I'd rather have DG than the opportunity to have kids running around the house. Already got that thanks

I have been thrilled with the series.. and I love the lore. But I want to redirect to my opening question overall: How did we go from "not satisfied" to "it's broken"?

Huh.

[Maya Maya]

As for people calling for boycotts, my advice would be to just buy used copies of Bethesda games.


That way you get to play the game, and Bethesda doesn't get any of your money and doesn't get an additional sale recorded.

This is exactly what I will do from now on. I will NEVER buy the game new again, and I will be sure to read all reviews and forums before purchasing. But even then you wouldn't know you would never get promised DLC. Best just not to buy them at all.

[Manny(BAKE)]

I think there is plenty of room for blame here. Sony should have designed the PS3 to be more developer friendly, and Bethesda should have had the logic and foresight to design their engine to accommodate the PS3 specifications like many other developers.

The problem isn't that Skyrim and its DLC can't work on the PS3, its much more likely the problem is that to get it to work would require more of an overhaul of the game than Bethesda is willing to do.

There is nothing wrong with sony or ps3 i never saw a compony having a problem with the ps3 exept bethesda they are saying that coding with the ps3 is hard i think its just an excuse for them to not telling us the truth about whats happening

[Naomi Ward]

the ps3 does not have memory issues. you have to use the memory differently when programming for the ps3 and bethesda is too lazy to figure out how to properly program on the ps3. if they would actually code the game for the ps3 instead of forcing the 360 code onto the ps3 there would be no problems.

Bottom line is they can try and fix it and they don't have to if they don't want to. They're not obligated to.

[Lakyn Ellery]

so after what gstaff said we are not getting dawnguard ?

Not necessarily. These are all theories and conjecture. They could announce tomorrow that it's ready to play. None of us really know. The post seems to indicate Bethesda doesn't really know either. Even if we don't see it as downloadable dlc, we may still get it in a game of the year edition in the future.

[neil slattery]

Don't worry I won't you see they [censored] lied and said Skyrim was on a new engine and would run just as good as the xbox and pc version.

I wish I could get a big giant blow horn loud enough for everyone 'round the world to hear. This should be common knowledge, but Bethesda won't tell the masses. They've been working with the Netlmmerse ( ) engine since Morrowind.

--

I do feel for PS3 users though. I have a PS3 myself and promised never again will I purchases any Bethesda Games Studio product on the PS3. From my perspective, Fallout 3 was terrible.

Now I know I may sound like I'm making excuses for Bethesda, believe me I'm not, but the way the 360's memory is set up is more practical for games like this. Yeah Bethesda does need to figure out how to better utilize the PS3 architecture, but what do you expect them to do? Rewrite the entire Netlmmerse ( ) engine for the PS3? Sacrifices had to be made for a port of this magnitude to work on both consoles, I'm sure.

These games are some of the most memory intensive games I've come across. Worlds as large as these are different from games like GTA or Assassin's Creed. Bethesda games takes a snap shot (each time you save) of the world just as the way you left it. The amount of memory that takes is staggering.

Though, I'll always be in the 'if you can't do it right, don't do it at all' crowd.

[Krista Belle Davis]

Addendum:

I would also like to point out how lovely the media clearly states "hey, at least PS3 users get mounted combat!".

You're joking, right? I mean is it a belated April Fool's joke? I would like to point out how useless mounts really are (and this is personal preference, but hear my rationale). There is fast travel, which negates any reason I've used mounts to begin with. Secondly, has anyone ever fast travelled to a location, only to have their mount (ie-Shadowmere) spawn next to you (for example, near a ledge!) and bump you off to your death? This has happened a few times and I finally put her down. Last night I fast travelled to a location and so did Shadowmere. On a ledge.. bump off ledge.. dead. So on game restart I killed that darn horse. Good riddance.

But hey, at least I have mounted combat!

[Big mike]

Addendum:

I would also like to point out how lovely the media clearly states "hey, at least PS3 users get mounted combat!".

You're joking, right? I mean is it a belated April Fool's joke? I would like to point out how useless mounts really are (and this is personal preference, but hear my rationale). There is fast travel, which negates any reason I've used mounts to begin with. Secondly, has anyone ever fast travelled to a location, only to have their mount (ie-Shadowmere) spawn next to you (for example, near a ledge!) and bump you off to your death? This has happened a few times and I finally put her down. Last night I fast travelled to a location and so did Shadowmere. On a ledge.. bump off ledge.. dead. So on game restart I killed that darn horse. Good riddance.

But hey, at least I have mounted combat!

So you just fast travel to towns you haven't discovered??

[Emily Shackleton]

So you just fast travel to towns you haven't discovered??

No my good sir. I use the coach.

They are available from the start, are dirt cheap, and have access to all the major towns/cities.

From there, if a quest points me to a location I haven't found, I fast travel to the closest town/city and hoof it. I have never needed a horse. Ever.

[NAtIVe GOddess]

People were losing interest in Dawnguard after the first month it was out for XBox and this recent update hasn't done anything other than confirm that the DLC has varying performances on the Ps3, most of them seemingly poor from the impression that Bethesda has left us with.

What I can't seem to get over is why this topic has hailed twelve threads. Every thread it's the same thing: disappointment, bitterness, and arguing, and I don't foresee that changing in the next thread or the thread after that. [censored] happens, move on.

Well to answer only your question and not your annoyance at seeing customers rightly express their anger at shoddy business practices(see what i did there?), its not really 12 different threads, its just one very big one. For some reason there is a post limit on the Bethesda forums and when that limit is reached a mod pops in, calls for full-stop and moves discussion to next 'thread'. I don't see a reason for it either personally. I guess maybe the forum starts rotating backwards or something if a thread starts having too many posts in it or something...

Addendum:

I would also like to point out how lovely the media clearly states "hey, at least PS3 users get mounted combat!".

You're joking, right? I mean is it a belated April Fool's joke? I would like to point out how useless mounts really are (and this is personal preference, but hear my rationale). There is fast travel, which negates any reason I've used mounts to begin with. Secondly, has anyone ever fast travelled to a location, only to have their mount (ie-Shadowmere) spawn next to you (for example, near a ledge!) and bump you off to your death? This has happened a few times and I finally put her down. Last night I fast travelled to a location and so did Shadowmere. On a ledge.. bump off ledge.. dead. So on game restart I killed that darn horse. Good riddance.

But hey, at least I have mounted combat!

I agree with your sentiment. The mounted combat is practically useless as you are stuck in 3rd person. I still find myself just out-running encounters i dont want to bother with on horseback or getting down to fight if i feel i need to.

Two things horses are good for is fast-traveling while encumbered and for scaling mountains(if you mess up and fall, they take most of the dmg if you aren't TOO high).

[FABIAN RUIZ]

WONT BE MUCH LONGER GUYS...IT IS PLAYABLE ON PS3...JUST NOT IN ALL SITUATIONS...THEY ARE CLOSING IN ON THE PROBLEM!

[Kitana Lucas]

If you're a PS3 customer, you really can not argue the games are more stable.

Oblivion > FO3 > FONV > Skyrim.

It has actually been getting WORSE.

This is probably why: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/114550-Fallout-New-Vegas-Dev-weighs-in-on-Skyrims-PS3-Lag-Issues

Dunno how many people are familiar with that article, but this is months old.
Basically Josh Sawyer of Obsidian says the issue is that PS3 has a split RAM pool and with big games like Skyrim, there's TONS of clutter, locations, NPC etc that, every interaction you make with them creates more memory for your character file. That iron helmet you picked up, that NPC you talked to: everything gets stored in your character's file, and the larger the file gets, the more pronounced the difference.

This would also explain why the situation gets worse over new titles. Because Skyrim is bigger than New Vegas is bigger than FO3 is bigger than Oblivion.
Though I do have to wonder what they did or thought they did to fix it. New Vegas, it's a classic case that PS3 players can play most of the base game + 2 DLCs, then they gotta start a new character cause of lag. Skyrim, at initial release, the lag came even faster (again, probably because Skyrim has superior graphics etc so more data to save), BUT they fixed it. Not completely, but they improved it. Nevertheless though, it's obviously not enough. I always wondered what the hell it was to fix it when Josh Sawyer was basically say "PS3 is fundamentally flawed for Bethesda's engine" and then Pete Hines was simply retorting with "we fixed it."

[Lance Vannortwick]

Bottom line is they can try and fix it and they don't have to if they don't want to. They're not obligated to.

That's the problem they should have laws in place to protect gamer's from companies releasing broken product's just like every other buisness.

[Jason Wolf]

Just out of curiosity, am I the only person that hasn't had any problems with FNV:UE? Other than overheating(I just put my PS3 in a bookshelf) and falling through a rock.

[Zach Hunter]

then they gotta start a new character cause of lag.

I didn't have to start a new character and I'm at level 37 and have completed all the DLC.

[Marcin Tomkow]

Just out of curiosity, am I the only person that hasn't had any problems with FNV:UE? Other than overheating(I just put my PS3 in a bookshelf) and falling through a rock.

Have you played a decent part of the main game (~25 levels worth from the main game alone, excluding DLC) and more than 2 DLC? Problems typically don't arise until after that.
But no, there ARE a few people that report 0 problems with it too. It's really like a 9-1 ratio that people have problems with the PS3 version of NV: UE, so it's an obvious majority that have problems. The degree of the problem varies too, but just from posts, I can tell you the vast majority typically have to re-roll a new character after 2 DLC visits.

[Cheville Thompson]

That's the problem they should have laws in place to protect gamer's from companies releasing broken product's just like every other buisness.

Yeah then they'll have every PS3 player suing them and utimaltly stop making games for PS3. Maybe they shouldn't make consoles with split RAM and everything will be good.

[Cartoon]

This is probably why: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/114550-Fallout-New-Vegas-Dev-weighs-in-on-Skyrims-PS3-Lag-Issues

Dunno how many people are familiar with that article, but this is months old.
Basically Josh Sawyer of Obsidian says the issue is that PS3 has a split RAM pool and with big games like Skyrim, there's TONS of clutter, locations, NPC etc that, every interaction you make with them creates more memory for your character file. That iron helmet you picked up, that NPC you talked to: everything gets stored in your character's file, and the larger the file gets, the more pronounced the difference.

This would also explain why the situation gets worse over new titles. Because Skyrim is bigger than New Vegas is bigger than FO3 is bigger than Oblivion.
Though I do have to wonder what they did or thought they did to fix it. New Vegas, it's a classic case that PS3 players can play most of the base game + 2 DLCs, then they gotta start a new character cause of lag. Skyrim, at initial release, the lag came even faster (again, probably because Skyrim has superior graphics etc so more data to save), BUT they fixed it. Not completely, but they improved it. Nevertheless though, it's obviously not enough. I always wondered what the hell it was to fix it when Josh Sawyer was basically say "PS3 is fundamentally flawed for Bethesda's engine" and then Pete Hines was simply retorting with "we fixed it."

Yes. But Tweet Hines™ has already told us they solved those issues long ago.

And he is still telling us https://twitter.com/DCDeacon/status/241583045176590336 Yeah, so terrific they have dropped supoprt.

This is exactly what has me most pissed off at this point. They KEEP lying to us.

[Phillip Hamilton]

Not sure if this has been noted, I haven't bothered to read through this thread. I was browsing Pete Hines' twitter account (@DCDeacon) and saw this...

Twitter user @HPLA1 asks: "https://twitter.com/DCDeacon Let me ask you this, is Dawnguard playable on PS3, as it is now?
To which @DCDeacon (Pete Hines) replies: "https://twitter.com/HPLA1 yes, it's just doesn't perform well in all scenarios. Some folks would be fine, some would not",

So, what does this mean? Dawnguard does work, but would maybe crash, freeze (or something) in certain scenarios. Am I the only one thinking, "GIVE US A BETA!"

I hate to keep reiterating this, but it's true. We need a beta. It's an ingenious way to prove investment in the system, calm the people who don't believe that gamesas is even working on the DLC, and it will most likely help with the bugs and performance issues.

And we know it's possible, because they did it with the Xbox and the PS3 has had plenty of other betas in the past.

[Ann Church]

I hate to keep reiterating this, but it's true. We need a beta. It's an ingenious way to prove investment in the system, calm the people who don't believe you're even working on the DLC, and it will most likely help with the bugs and performance issues.

And we know it's possible, because they did it with the Xbox and the PS3 has had plenty of other betas in the past.

How would they have a beta if they can't get it to work correctly to begin with and the beta was to fix minor bugs not frame rate issues and stuff like that.

[Austin England]

I'd be in for a beta test. My copy runs terrific on PS3 and very minimal bugs/freezes.