Hello All,

I am playing a Battlemage - currently at level 32. I would say that my "alignment" is Lawful Neutral in D&D terms.

Having completed the Companions and College of Winterhold quest lines, I am now at about the point in the Main Quest where I am supposed to head up to Solitude.

My rationale for doing the Thieves Guild now and then maybe the Dark Brotherhood is to prepare for "what I am supposed to do" up in Solitude (trying to minimize the spoilers here).

What do you guys think? Did anyone else think like this?

Otherwise, why would my mage pursue a life of crime, if not to train myself in the art of espionage?

R

Um. Well.... you don't need any training for what you're going to do. But if that floats your RP boat, that's fine. I don't have any way of rationalizing TG at all. DB, well, don't have to rationalize that - I kill 'em all.

Yeah, I don't think I'm gonna' do TG on any characters, but I'll DB on at least one. I may regret the DB questline after I start it (need to observe my targets), but just from the beginning of the TG quest I was turned off by what I had to do.

I am at level 35 and an Archer / sneak / warrior type. I have just joined the Dark Brotherhood. I was very hesitant concerning this as I am of a lawful neutral style of play as well.

I then rationalised that the Empire is completely stuffed, the Thalmor are out there killing whom they want to, and you get sent by the Jarls to off supposed bad guys for being not aligned with the Jarls. Bandits are bandits, but Giants are living in the land and people can avoid them. I am still sent to kill Giants. Why? i do not know why, I am expected to follow Bounty orders and kill.

This then set my minds justification for the Dark Brotherhood. I am sent on what was honourable for my forefathers to go out and fulfil Contracts on people. Now they are named, but someone else wanted them dead. Okay, just like the Jarls.

Joining the Dark brotherhood allows an expansion of what I appear to be, a Heroic person for hire that kills opposition. Look out Thalmor, the Shadows are coming, and they are armed well. (Three Thalmor took down some Stormcloaks outside of Falkreath, I am not involved with the Civil War, but I am not of a high opinion of the Thalmor for transporting prisoners about and killing sons of Skyrim).

i hope I can keep my Dark Brotherhood activities from Lydia.

To rationalize joining the thieves guild, you could join for financial or information purposes, as they have many contacts in all the main cities. For a good character, it's really kind of hard to rationalize joing the dark brotherhood. Some could argue it would be to remove certain Imperial influences, but you have to kill many people to get to that step.

I rationalized joining the Thieves Guild because they're better than the complete chaos currently existing with bandits, piracy, and worse everywhere.

Ditto the Dark Brotherhood - they're a necessary evil to wipe out the Emperor and possibly be used as wetwork for my Dragonborn's stuff.

Once you join every faction, youre pretty much a jack of all trades, and id lose my identity as whatever characterim playing. 2 guilds is enough for me and if i want to join other ones i just make a different character that at least has some skill in what thefaction specializes in. With that said, i cant see how a good character would start assassinating people for money lol

Thanks for the input, guys.

I thought about different characters, but I just don't have the time in my real life to do this... With all of the side quests and exploring that you need to do to level up, I could not put in the time to run two or three dramatically different lives.

In Fallout 3, etc., I only have ever played one character and continually and slowly built them up.

I'll have to think about this one...

R

My Mage would never join either. He doesn't even search urns or steal anything. My nord nightade wasn't so self richeous though.

The only way I can see a Battlemage joining either of those guilds is as a hired guard or something.

Thief guild start is rough, next two missions is better however evil (people go to jail because of you), and rest is not very evil, you might quit jobs to people you care about, I don't do the drunken huntsman as he is nice to me. Stealing things is kind of the purpose of the thief guild.

For the thief guild start you can start a fight with the shopkeeper and he will not comment on it later. For the bunkhouse, speech or an fight solves the problem, and the innkeeper gave in at once. No need to do any more pressure. You only get some comments from the innkeeper boyfriend later.

I had no problem killing Gerda the kind and at least the bandit and the Khajiit in the hut was involved in murder themselves so the start here was easy.
Not sure about the rest as I have not played it.

Rationalize TG and DB? Not on my current character. She lives in the shadows, she lives for the kill, she has no qualms about bullying people, clearing their homes of valuables, implicating another for a crime they have not committed hahahahaha Plus, the TG questline gets better the further along you play. So, I would suggest at least doing it once.

If you are playing a "lawful good" character, I doubt that there is any rationalizing about joining either TG or DB! I mean HELLO LAWFUL!! They would never join either guild! lol

Lawful evil characters wouldn't have qualms about joining the Dark Brotherhood

Well yea, but he's playing a Lawful Neutral character.

A list of Ten Commandments for a lawful neutral religion may look like this:

1. You shall not lie.
2. You shall not kill the innocent.
3. You shall not murder.
4. You shall help the needy if such action advances law and order.
5. You shall honor legitimate authority.
6. You shall follow the law.
7. You shall not betray others.
8. You shall not aid criminals.
9. You shall honor all oaths.
10. You shall promote unlimited order in society

I'm doing them at the same time as well, though not to become a spy of sorts... and my thief is a thief, she has no qualms about it. her magic only assists her in her goals. definately a shades of gray neutral but not good character.

I've been doing all of the "extra work" that the thieve's guild will give me and trying to combine it with little missions I'm doing for the Dark Brotherhood. They work really well together and having both sets of armor makes it really easy to pick and choose your benefits from the enchants.

mmmm... muffle boots... mmm... more carry weight... mmm... enhanced backstab and bows... gwa ha ha

I'd actually planned the opposite of your path, though, I think, as I only use magic when I have to and prefer to use my bow.

I was going to finish the DB chain first, just before I go with Karliah for the Thieves' Guild.

The reason for this is that the radiant quests for Thieves is a real pain in the neck as you have to do 5 "extra work" jobs in each of the main towns before you can do the special quest for each hold to rebuild them... whereas it'll be just the one quickish assignment at a time to rebuild the Dark Brotherhood. Well, and a hefty chunk of cash.

Yay for being an Imperial Thief and not having any allignment issues, eh? DB will teach you to do what must be done regardless of your personal feelings on it, and lessons from the Thieves' Guild will definately teach your character the finest points of negotiating in a tight situation and making money for your organization.

good luck and let us know how it worked for you. I'd be curious to know.

I purposely failed. If you drop the ring or get arrested you can still talk to Brynjolf and continue with the rest of the unashamedly awesome Thieves Guild Questline. All that without setting up a nice merchant. Besides, he'll try to get you to do it during the main quest anyway, so you might as well use that as a opportunity to check out some of the Thieves Guild members.

I think Lawful characters would fit better in the Dark Brotherhood than the Thieves Guild though. Aside from the Nightingales, there's no real 'order' to the Thieves and the Nightingales themselves only swear their oaths because they want more shinies. The Brotherhood has a defined code. Some adhere to it more than others, but it's there and it's an important part of their identity.



That looks more Lawful Good than Lawful Neutral. My characters don't fall into the D&D allignments, but that's most definitely not 'Neutral'.

Money is the main reason.

Thieves are born, yo.

No really, it's a good enough rationale, but considering the confines within the TG story and the characters involved, I'd say you're at least a sort of person with potential. This is Brynholf's awareness at least. He's vouching for you at first. Others see you as his protege in a way.

Currently I at a level 58 and have just decided to destroy the Brotherhood. This quest kills all all the leaders of the Brotherhood which fits my choice. I really don't want to join the Thieves Guild either and have not found an option to destroy the Thieves Guild as I find no purpose in their existence for Skyrim. I sure don't need the gold as I have over 500,000 gold now and own four houses. Does anyone know if their is a way that I can go after the Thieves Guild members and destroy the organization, rather than join them?

Dagal

There's no way to really destroy the Thieves Guild in Skyrim. Their purpose... well, that's a tricky one, especially if you bring the Nightingales into the equation. They are economically valuable when flourishing, not just to you, but to every major hold. Although they deal in illegal activities, they do provide a structure through which other illegal activities can be controlled. The Nightingales are supposed to protect the luck and shadows of the world, as well as guard the portal to The Evergloam.

You are missing out. TG is the best questline in Skyrim IMO. Plus its very profitable to be a thief in Skyrim (that may sound shallow, but i enjoy being a thief in TES and getting mass amounts of gold).

No thanks.... just not my sort of thing. In fact.... I don't really give a rat's patoot how "great" a questline is. If it doesn't fit me, it could be SHAKESPEARE and I wouldn't bother with it.

Good, that leaves all the awesome equipment and characters for me and none for people who have a habit of always butting in about how much they want to kill the TG and DB.

4. You shall help the needy if such action advances law and order.

The Children of Honorhall House? (the Orphanage)

I decided that my character was falling under daedric influences and became drawn to the darker side of things.