Looks great! The only thing I really don't like much is that when your weapon isn't firing you can't see it in first person mode. I don't know if this is to do with that difference between first and third person animations you were talking about, but I would like to see my gun in first person. It kinda looks odd when all of a sudden it jerks up when you fire it from the hip.

@Zealotlee
well, I made sure to make the reload animation compatible with vanilla animations, but the grip animations are setup using my custom animations as basis, so the new vert grip animations won't work with a different idle or aiming stances, both first person and 3rd person.

Will the FAMAS look crappy without that grip animation?

It would look like it always has with vanilla grip animations.. something like this:
http://fallout3nexus.com/downloads/images/8888-5-1251591792.jpg

http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=9396, you must be doing something incorrectly.

I'll be wasting more time if I use KFUpdater... reason for this is KFUpdater does not create the important weapon parts nodes for animations...

I'd rather copy paste NiTransformInterpolator of 5 bip bones that I modified from a fresh exported kf to a vanilla kf, than re-create 60+ gun parts nodes on a KFupdater made .kf with incorrect priorities.

Like I said, it works with pose mods, not so good when working with actual usable FONV game animations.

Clearly you have no understanding of how to use the program -> as priorities are configurable independently per node all it takes for me to update an exported anim is to double click one single .bat file thats it and everything is done ready to be used by either game takes all of 1 second..... how is that harder !?!... copy paste... now thats a chore.

also you clearly did not look at that link as NOT A SINGLE ONE OF THOSE ANIMATIONS ARE OF THE POSE VARIETY !!! there are multiple animations for new weapon types Throwing Spears, Throwing Knives, Bows -> multiple 100% new (Not based on anything from the base games) creatures, and several secondary attacks like Pistol Whips and Rifle Butts. I am lost as to how to get POSE Animations from all of that...

I don't understand why we're even arguing about this. What's it to you how I make my mods?

Like I said, weapon parts nodes, 60-70+ of them, I've no interest in recreating in a kfupdater made .kf file. I'd rather just copy paste 5-6 bone nodes than recreate each of those.

Melee animations don't have gun parts animations in them

Throwing weapons don't have gun parts in them

Pose mods don't have gun parts in them

If you expect me, to remake every little moving gun part, every little blinking gun light, every trigger, every hammer, you're insane. I'm not gonna do it.

Each firing animation I make have different gun parts in them, for cross compatibility

Each idle animation or aim animation have the same gun parts that animates to reset the gun parts to their starting position.

I can't and don't want to make a skeleton rig and place all the gun meshes in it just so I can export a kf file with ALL the gun parts necessary.

I do not nor did I ever care that you are doing things the hard way all I said is that you should not make a tutorial for this as people tend to read the most recent tutorials and think incorrectly most of the time that its the most up to date and easiest method available.

I understand why your going the Copy/Paste Route considering your lack of ability to do things the correct way but a tutorial instructing others to do things the incorrect way will help no one -> and more over only waste's everyone time especially mine when I get yet another student who reads one of these baseless tutorials and comes to class needing to be un-taught this garbage just to get them started down the correct path, you want to do things the hard way that is fine but leading people down that rabbit hole with you is just destructive to the community as a whole.

Why do you keep on assuming that I'm using the copy paste method because it's the only way I know how? You really think I didn't try using KFUpdater when I started working on my handgun animations? I'm not the only one who's got problems with KFUpdater when working with FONV gun animations. Invalidfate from F3Underground also complained how KFUpdater didn't have the gun nodes when exporting firing animations. When I released the first version of my mod, someone asked me how I worked around the missing nodes problem with KFUpdater. I told him, I didn't use KFUpdater, I did it the hard way...It just does not create the gun parts nodes, how much more do I have to explain to you?

Like I said, KFUpdater didn't work well for me, for my purposes (which is gun animations). If someone was gonna ask me, "Hey, how did you make your firing animations or reload animations for your mod?" do I recommend to them KFUpdater, knowing full well they'd get into problems with missing gun nodes parts when exporting using that?

Anyway, the way I work with animations is faster than what you're suggesting. When I work with gun animations, I leave the useable vanilla animations intact, and animate the body parts that I want to change (usually back posture and arm position). When I work on the animation, I only have the spine bones, neck and head bones, and arm bones loaded. I work with those, export them, then copy paste the data of those specific bones to a working vanilla animation. Animating it takes about an hour, then copy pasting, usually around 10-12 bones into a vanilla .kf file takes about 5 minutes.

What you're suggesting is importing everything into 3dsmax, then working with that. The Niftools plugin for 3dsmax for FONV is buggy, if you don't know that yet. When you attempt to import everything, you get missing nodes all over, mostly gun parts nodes and some body part nodes. These things need to be recreated in order to have a working .kf file. What will happen is I waste my time re animating parts of the animation that are already 'working well' in the vanilla .kf. Once I spend a whole day working on the whole body and recreating all of the gun nodes animations, I can export it as .kf and use kfupdater to 'instantly' make it workabe in game "saving me some time" (?) Not to mention, I will need to create a different, unique 'rig' for every single animation, because each gun animation have different gun node setups in them so each rig will have different sets of guns attached to them, in addition, having more than 2 guns attached to a skeleton rig makes for a really messy looking rig to work with.

The problem with you is you assume too much. You'd realize this if you actually made a weapon animation overhaul for FONV.

I don't even want to respond to your 'lack of ability' comment... I'll let my mods speak for themselves.

ADD:
It's really pathetic to see a well respected modder like you go around people's threads telling them "You svck, I rule!". Really pathetic.

First off, I think your confusing KFUpdater with the NifTools Exporter, though I could be wrong here and your confusion just exacerbates my confusion with what your saying.

But if not and you really are that confused.

Ug, another guy who thinks a program is somehow magic -> Its not suppose to add missing nodes -> if you did not include them in the Max Scene and set them up correctly for export they did not get exported there for they do not exist and that was your fault ! not the KFUpdater..... that excuse actually borders on the inane -> I didn't know it wasn't a magic program !?! WTF why does it not just do all the work for me.



Again I think your confusing NiFtools Exporter and KFUpdater.

but if not.

That is your failing not the programs.... clearly, a full understanding of what the program can and can not do is required here -> you can just read the ReadMe files as it explains everything in easy to understand english that most grasp first read.



Ok, faster for you, fair enough.



No its not, clearly yet another failure on your part to understand how to do things correctly to begin with -> the ONLY problem with the NifTools exporter and popping out animations is it still does not correctly read the Bip01/Bip01 NonAccum data but that can be easily bypassed -> the other issue is that it was never updated to export most secondary Controllers which can be an issue depending on what your doing, Material and Texture Controllers are basically whats missing.



Heh !?!, you have to import each part seperately this is not HalfLife all of the nodes do not exist in one file they are all seperate, also if you want the bone nodes for weapons (Or Anything) to survive import you have to tic import skeleton this will preserve all nodes and not optimize them <- this was done on purpose and also its covered in the NifTools web pages tutorials -> read them maybe.



Actually if you had even a clue as how to use the programs available you would realize that its not all that complicated and that Bile your spewing about every anim needing 60-70 weapons nodes all added to each sequence is rubbish as most anims only service at the most 1-3 weapons (even with you adding a weapon) so ONLY their nodes need be present and not all of them need direct controlling for every sequence, this is not that difficult I teach exactly this to first year students and even at their tender age of 10+ most grasp the concepts rather quickly -> even my son at the age of 6 can work in max and create working compound exports -> not hard.

I am failing to see:
1) how even if you did re-hash every single character animation how that makes any difference to what I am saying (which has nothing to do with the quality of your work or in this case Beth/Obsid's work with your copy/paste thrown in) but has to do with the method employed.
or
2) how somehow your work is by proxy of it including mechanical multi part weapons (not exactly a difficult object to animate) is somehow more advanced then animating creatures (many of which have multi part weapon animations vastly more complicated to any of the basic modern weapons your doing) or new weapons or some random special attack, so much so that I fail to realize just how difficult it is for you to animate something that I animate every single day and instruct others to animate every single day modern weapons are not hard to animate they are mechanical and by nature one of the easiest animated objects to do -> sort of like a door it only moves so many ways, none of which are difficult to grasp.

Using that as an excuse does not fly, but this is you -> you can do as you wish I would only ask that you not make a tutorial for this as that would only cause me issue as there is always someone who knows better then the teacher because they read it online and some guy did it this way or whatever BS excuse they formulate in their heads and it takes them forever to just let it go.

and ofcourse
3) I have created over 3 thousand animations from scratch for FO3/FONV many of which are vastly more complicated then a simple mechanical multiple part object, maybe if you actually tried to create something from nothing instead of coasting off the work of others you would understand why doing things the right way the first time is important -> especially when creating a tutorial on the method employed -> and especially again when you want to overhaul something which entails many many animations.

I don't care how right you are, why is it so necessary to be a dike to him.

At least he let's people use his resources without getting all "unwarranted self important" all over us.

You talk about the community, I doubt you give a damn about this community. At all.

You still don't get it, well you kinda got it, but you don't. Nah, you just want to brag (or projecting your insecurities) over a silly little thread on bullpup animations, that's it.

You know I only modify parts of the animation and use working animations already done by obsidian. You keep insisting of the kfupdater process, when you know that I only modify parts of the animation. You tell me the proper way is to use your technique and do everything from scratch. Now why would I do everything from scratch when the shooting animation's lowerbody, fingers, gunparts all work perfectly fine already. Using your technique and doing everything from scratch is an even bigger waste of time.

This isn't the first time I'm doing animations for this engine. I redid my whole Oblivion animation from scratch. Completely changed every animation in it, except some idle animations. I used KFUpdater then because when I made new locomotion or melee animations, I had to change everything, from tip of the fingers to the tip of the toe.

That's what I was used to when I started animating shooting for FONV. It didn't work out so well, I decided not to use KFUpdater instead. Niftools plugins don't import .kf interpolator data that don't have transform data. I can copy the interpolator data and create a 2 frame transform data out of it for translation and rotation, but that's even more work. The game can read the translation and rotation from the interpolator data, but niftools can't import them to max. ALOT of FONV vanilla animations have nodes that have interpolator data but no transform data. I decided, since I'm not changing EVERYTHING from scratch, I'll ditch the normal technique of doing animation, which will take me a helluva lot more time to do, and just change the bones that I need to change.

We're talking about faster, working with 5-10 bones and reusing perfectly working bones is faster than redoing everything from 'scratch'.

EDIT:
This is really getting pointless, I've already uploaded the bullpup animations so this thread is really of no use to anyone. Mods should lock this thread already.