But that isn't their argument. They are debating from the assumption that the DLC was made right along side the game.

Anyway, I am with the guy who is hoping for an expansion. I was never TOTALLY happy with the Fallout DLCs. I was a LITTLE happy, but not totally. With Fallout 3 I had expected an expansion, and instead we got the little DLCs that are playable in one night.

I myself am not made of money, but I still would rather have a 40 dollar Shivering Isles than a 10 dollar Operation Anchorage. Shivering Isles to this day is one of my all time favorite RPG gaming experiences and my number 1 favorite expansion pack of any game. THAT is the kind of extended content I am hoping for with Skyrim. Not little itty bitty DLCs here and there which when coupled together cost at least as much as an expansion pack anyway. And I loved how Morrowind had TWO expansion packs. I doubt we will ever be that fortunate again, but I would like to see an expansion pack and THEN maybe some DLCs.

I can't confirm nor deny that, but I can tell you this, I'll sell my immortal soul to the devil, if it wasn't done and could have been shipped with the game.

What game was it messed up and had the DLC files shipped (on main title release) but not unlocked? was it Bioshock? I honestly can't remember.

/edit
*that messed up*

I agree, but only when it comes to Operation Anchorage. Point Lookout was a pretty damn good amount of content for $10.

Yes, that is what's known as a "false premise."

I've always disliked this train of thought. (Or lack thereof)

The reason being, there's no specific quota as to what makes a game. When Legos are made, they're all made at the same time, but you don't buy all of them at once. You don't get the Castle and the Tower Fort and the Bandit's Cave and the Horse and Carriage all at once, because Lego decides that the Castle is enough for one set. There's nothing saying they can't charge later for content created during the same time or even some downtime.

And really, you don't have to purchase it. Send your message if you must, just don't come to me asking to play with my Lego sets though.

This anology works even better when you add in the CK, "You've got the pieces, make your own set!".

Point Lookout was amazing for a DLC, I agree, but I still beat it in one sitting. Shivering Isles took me a few days. THAT is the meaty kind of content that I like.

Don't get me wrong, I don't HATE the DLCs. I just don't consider them to be enough. I would like to see at least one amazing expansion pack as well as DLCs. The Sims 3 has expansion packs, smaller stuff packs AND DLCs and does very well financially.

This is exactly why the gaming industry loves the new generation of gamers floating about. I don't mean the Developers, I mean the greasy, sleazy money men. They found ways to get consumers to pay twice for something, and they, the consumers eat it up and ask for more. it's saddening and sickening but considered the norm, these days.

/edit
i'll be building those castles, it'll just be with yellow and red blocks, not gray.

Exactly. Plus, I like Legos, what can I say?

I'm definitely hoping for an expansion too (come on Summerset Isle, overthrowing the Thalmor and killing a bunch of lesser daedra...).

Whats the difference between this and an expansion pack? They found a way for consumers to pay twice for something, but not only that, they'll defend it to the death!

Its modding community is also rotten to the core with a cancer darker than what afflicts Embargo's corporate bogeymen.

OH GOD yes, that would rock. I really want to kick Thalmor booty. And for a DLC, I would love a chance to take down Maven Black-Briar and her foul family. If neither of those materialize officially, I hope someone mods them in!

Twice? If Shivering Isles was like Oblivion, I wouldn't have bought it. Heaven forbid I buy a game and then buy an add-on because I like both the game and the add-on.

I don't think getting an expansion pack for Skyrim would cause the TES modding community to become like the Sims modding community. I really don't. But you are right, there are some spooky elements in the Sims modding community. That being said, my initial point remains. The Sims games do very well with expansion packs as well as DLCs,

Oh, I agree. I just couldn't pass up an opportunity to mock Embargo. The Sims community's problem is commercialization of mods, not the actual game's production cycle.

"Shivering Isles is the first and only major expansion for Oblivion. It takes place in Sheogorath's plane of Oblivion. Sheogorath seeks a mortal as his champion. Many mysteries await your investigations in this twisted, split reality that the Prince of Madness calls the Shivering Isles."

expansion being the key word.

googled quick and excerpt taken from
http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Shivering:Shivering_Isles

Yes, the ability for modders to SELL their work or ask for so called "donations" in exchange for "donation sets". That has plagued The Sims modding community since part 1. I am so glad that this sort of thing is forbidden with Bethesda games.

For all their evils, Bethesda is not Bioware. They have not deliberately withheld content that was CLEARLY made to fit into the game, nor have they released launch day DLC like there was with Dragon Age.

http://planetelderscrolls.ign.com/articles/news/8457/First-Skyrim-DLC-mudcrab-armor

I'm not seeing your point though. Your complaint is that you don't want to be "nickel and dimed" by DLCs, but how are you if you don't purchase it?

Do you know what DLC means?

"Made to fit into the game" does not mean "intended to be part of the game." Sebastian was developed alongside DAII, but he was, from the beginning, intended to be sold as DLC. The difference may be semantic, but it's important (to me).

That all being said, I still love Bioware! Bethesda and Bioware, the two Bs will always be my faves, I think. I just hate that they both hopped into bed with Evil Empires, like EA Games and Microsoft.

I applaud them for that but I can't help seeing things in-game that are/were cut.

windmills?
sawmills?
grain grinders?

TYVM for that link arthmoor, I needed the lol.


Yes, Content for console users that is flushed down the pipe, that today's generation of PC users accept whole-heatedly as replacement for expansions.

-and if it sounds blunt, that is because it is the truth.

I bet they did it to tick you personally off. It's not like that game developers have another purpose then ticking people like you off...

Yeah and how old are you to know what the previous generation games were like none of which had the amount of content TESV has so your argument is stunningly filled with ignorance.

Old enough to have two sons and a daughter, who have children of their own, but that is irrelevant to the thread or the discussion.