Point was: A second company developed the second game. You guys are of the inclination that the ToR killed off the KotoR series, when a third KotoR may never have been planned, and you certainly have no idea if BioWare was planning to do ToR in the first place.

And now we have another situation of two different companies working on one franchise. Except now the second company is making the MMO, and yet you still have this notion that the original company is going to kill off their single player game because a different company is making the MMO.

Two different companies made two different single player games for the same franchise. You have zero idea if a third one was going to be made and you have zero idea if the MMO was being planned all along. Despite having zero idea, and being filled with "but this is what I wanted" and "wouldn't it have been cool," you still believe that the MMO killed the single player series, even though you have zero idea.

Two different companies are making two different types of games for the same franchise. And yet you still believe that the MMO, being made by a separate company, will kill the single player series, even though it is made by the original company.

Good job guys, your logic is flawless.

Except the Bioware today is not the Bioware of the past, they've already sold out to EA. They could have made Kotor III, not for profit shocking. But for the fans. Just throwing it out there.

Fear mongering? I don't think so, just people saying their opinions about this game.

It may well have been planned. I'd have prefered that over a MMO. I was not trying to say the mmo killed kotor 3 but it killed the possible future of kotor 3. I just don't want to see this game have a bad knock off on TES.

I doubt it will kill the single player experience.

But this mmo puts a bad taste in my mouth that I dont like and I am venting my distaste.

All I see is a lot of "I don't know what I'm talking about."

You know what?

Nintendo could have made another Super Mario RPG.
Why wasn't there a Breath of Fire V?
Why no Power Stone 3?
Why hasn't there been an Odin Sphere 2?
Why haven't we seen a Mischief Makers 2?
Where's Shadow of the Colossus 2?

Instead all those turned into mmos right?

Some people are fear mongering, I didn't mean to imply you were, you fall into the other category IMO.

Ok fine, BioWare sold out to EA(whatever that means), why didn't not-for-profit BioWare not make KOTOR II themselves? This was before they became evil minion entity to EA, they had plenty of time to do it. I'll tell you what I think. They were ready to move on, specifically, they were moving onto Mass Effect. They wanted to do their own IP. It wasn't because, oh hey... we should let someone else make an MMO out of it, or anything else. Also, you want to know why they let Obsidian make it? Because even then, BioWare, like all good companies, was interested in making money on it. YES, BioWare was just as interested in making money at that time as they are now. Nothing has changed. It doesn't mean there aren't creative people at those companies poring their creativity and greatest concepts and hard work into these games, it just means that somewhere someone has to be convinced it'll pay off. It is the same thing for ALL games, even for MMOs. There are tons of people working at these companies developing these games for us that are doing it because thats what they love and because they are getting paid to do it.

I'm sorry, but where's your proof that KotoR was "turned into" an MMORPG?

I'd really like to see the cited sources, perhaps production meetings, design docs, etc that specifically say "hey guys we're gonna scrap the single player experience for good so we can cash in on an MMORPG."

If you have any of those, can I take a look through them?

It's my opinion. As i've said many many many many times. Without going into it too much did you play DA2? ME2? ME3? Did you see what EA/Bioware did to those games?
Quite.

People are generally concerned about TES and don't want to see it head this direction. It would be nice to see something unique appear however so far, and I stress so far, my opinion may change come the trailer. This just looks like a typical MMO.

Yeah its called ToR. Any future of a possible Kotor 3 ever was destroyed by ToR.

I wouldn't be surprised if they had a ME MMO in the pipeline.

So your saying the KOTOR and TOR are two completely different games and have no relations with each other what so ever. One of them is not even based off star wars. Or set many thousand of years before the original star wars. nope not at all.

Yep, played all three. And? Oh wait... I'm supposed to jump on the "hate EA/BioWare" bandwagon right here aren't I? While I'm at it, I should probably jump onto the hypocritical bandwagon for Skyrim, stating such things as "even though there's things I don't like about the game, like the removal of Attributes, I still like it!" Is that right? Is this conversation going the way it's supposed to?


Interesting, I didn't know I was talking to a BioWare/EA employee and thus knew exactly what the planned projects for forever were. Interesting.


Fairly certain I said the following: please prove to me that because there is an MMORPG that a new single player KotoR will never be made. Maybe I typed it out wrong though, sometimes that happens.

Because y'know, there hasn't been a single single-player Final Fantasy since the release of their first MMORPG, Final Fantasy XI.

I highly doubt they would do that,as a matter of fact I am pretty sure they are proud of this...despite the two thousand dislikes on TESO trailer...

Well your just assuming random things now. And since you are just going to try and put words in other people mouths and don't actually know their opinion this is the part of the thread I stop replying, there is no sense going in pointless circles especially when your not making yourself clear to me. I'm finding it difficult to understand your opinion.

I don't have proof because I am not trying to make that point that it will never be made.

My point that I am trying to make is that KOTOR was butchered the day they took the IP it was based off of and made a mmo out of it.

They wasted time making an MMO when they knew that most of the fans only wanted a sequel.

Types out "I stop replying."

Replies anyway.

You said: "Did you see what EA/BioWare did to DA2, ME2 and ME3?"

That's an implicating statement, implying that all three were bad games and probably shouldn't be liked.

Am I supposed to agree with you because you say "did you see what they did?"

I saw what they did. I still liked the games.


Really? Can I see those poll results please? Was a strict census taken to insure that each person only voted once or was it an online poll that allowed people with multiple accounts to vote once for each account? Maybe it was done with a Magic 8-Ball, where they gave said toy ultimate power whether it agreed with the fan base or not.

Oh! oh! *Points at words* This is what my mouth wanted to say also.


Well replying to Evod, while i'm here. It's my opinion. As I said like a bzillion times, you don't have to agree with it

Clever.

Right, and the point I'm trying to make, is that it wasn't an option between making KOTOR III and making SWTOR. If they had wanted to make a KOTOR III they would have done it, and if they still wanted to, they would still do it. If Bethesda wants to make TES VI, they most certainly will do it, this MMO will change nothing.

lol, Oh you got me I am making all that I am saying up since I clearly cant or am too lazy to offer any evidence

*shakes the magic 8-ball*

Magic 8-ball: You win.

>Gets into a debate
>Makes a statement
>Is asked to prove statement
>Uses sarcasm to cover up lack of evidence of said statement

You realize that when you are in debates and discussions, you might want to have a bit of evidence to back up things you say. Just a protip for you.

I mean, I could take a poll for you if you like, asking if people should have evidence to back up claims they make or not. It would be a great way to show you what evidence is.

By the way, and although this is from Wikipedia, it does have cited sources... unlike you.



I wonder if that could be a third KotoR.... hmmm.

Okay answer this. What series just released a new iteration of their single player games 6 months prior to an announcement of that series having an MMO? What series has a separate studio working on an MMO while at the same time the original studio released two massive single player games that got GOTY?

What's that? Yeah it's not the same damned thing. The single player part of the franchise that we all are familiar with is not under any threat. TES is fine.

Both those "seperate" companies are divisions of Zenimax. If the mmo tanks, Bethesda is likely not even going to be around to make another TES. I doubt Zenimax has anywhere near the deep pockets to weather the losses that EA reportedly is.

Well the company which owns bethesda is cashing in on the great name Bethesda made. Still it doesnt ruin things necessarily. The development teams are separate.

Im worried that if the MMO is failing Bethesda will be ordered to drop what they do in order to try to save it. After all millions of development dollars are at stake.

Apparently Zen is betting the farm on this. I hope they have really, really deep pockets

MMO wont tank, at best it breaks even. ZeniMax and Bethesda aren't some startup companies that need to prove to their investors they can keep making games. It will all be ok people. Stop worrying so much.

I mean, by that argument you should be hopeful they keep developing, because if they quit now as so many desire, the whole project is a total loss. No money made, not even breaking even.

Right, I forgot. SquarEnix never made another Final Fantasy after the critical flop that was Final Fantasy Spirits Within and Final Fantasy XIV...

Oh... no wait, wait... they did.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.338654-Poll-Would-you-have-preferred-KoTOR3-to-TOR

and

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/186/index/5043616/2

I probably could find more if you want because you'll no doubt refute my evidence