Is pervasive sixism holding the professional fighting game c

Post » Mon May 14, 2012 2:26 am

According to Ars Technica it is.

Professional fighting games are on the verge of breaking into the big time as a spectator sport, with http://www.joystiq.com/2011/08/04/over-2-million-watched-evo-2011-tourney-online/ tuning in to live streams of last August's EVO fighting game championship and millions more watching streamed fighting matches on http://www.twitch.tv/ every month. But a recent controversy over the overtly sixist treatment of a female competitor has some wondering if the fighting game community is really ready for prime time.

Anyone who has seen a fighting game tournament knows the community is well known for a casual, trash-talk, and bravado-filled atmosphere, where players actively try to psyche each other out for an advantage. But that's probably not enough to explain the way competitor Aris Bakhtanians treated teammate Miranda "SuperYan" Pakozdi during the http://crossassault.ign.com/, a Capcom-sponsored, reality show-style competition pitting two teams against each other in Street Fighter x Tekken matches for a $25,000 prize.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SLDgPbjp0M from the first day of the tournament shows Bakhtanians, leader of the Tekken team, making sixual comments towards Pakozdi that range from crude to potentially abusive. Spurred on by commenters interacting via a live chatroom, Bakhtanians proceeds to guess at Pakozdi's bra size, suggest she take part in a mud wrestling match, expresses a desire to spy on her in the women's bathroom, suggests she wear a skirt he would buy for her, and threatens to smell her if she makes a mistake.

Pakozdi, for her part, is seen in the video laughing nervously at the comments, though she does say at one point "this is creepy." She later commented https://twitter.com/#!/Super__Yan that Bakhtanians' actions were "not funny at all" and that he had "made my life incredibly hard and hasn't helped me [deal with hecklers] at all. He made it way worse." Pakozdi also suggests via Twitter that when she confronted Bakhtanians about his behavior, it was "pretty obvious he just doesn't give a [censored].' (Pakozdi has publicly rejected interview requests)

Bakhtanians defended his behavior in an impromptu discussion with TwitchTV community manager Jared Rea on the fifth day of the tournament (the discussion starts around 1:45:00 in http://www.twitch.tv/iplaywinner/b/309876812). "Those are jokes and if you were really a member of the fighting game community, you would know that," he says of his behavior. "This is a community that's, you know, 15 or 20 years old, and the sixual harassment is part of a culture, and if you remove that from the fighting game community, it's not the fighting game community—it'sStarCraft," he continued.

Bakhtanians was more circumspect in a prepared statement provided to Ars Technica after his behavior started drawing more attention around the Internet. "I understand that I said some controversial statements on the Cross Assault show, and a lot of people are deeply offended with what was said," he said in the statement. "I unfortunately used extreme examples in the heat of the moment and feel that my statements don't actually communicate how I feel. This is similar to what people say when they get into an argument with their girlfriend, and they say things that they deeply regret. I sincerely apologize if I have offended anyone."

Censoring the community?

Pakozdi responds to a comment made by Bakhtanians during the first day of the Cross Assault tournament, as seen on a live stream of the event
TwitchTV

But Bakhtanians also continued to argue against what he sees as efforts to try to sanitize the fighting game community by submitting players to what amounts to censorship. "What I was trying to communicate is that mild hostility has always been a defining characteristic of the fighting game scene," he said. "Back when arcades were more prevalent, people didn't like newcomers, and players needed to fight and pay their dues to get respect. The debate I was in was with a person who supported professional leagues, who have intent to censor the community to make it more accessible."

According to me, I think that you have to be somewhat lenient, but having rules in place would help.
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Josh Sabatini
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 2:37 am

Is it just me or is that incredibly difficult to read?
Would you mind changing the font colour, please?
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Tracy Byworth
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 9:25 am

It's trash talk. It's SUPPOSED to offend people. Was it extreme trash talking? Yeah, but that's the point.
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Alba Casas
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 1:12 am

Is it just me or is that incredibly difficult to read?
Would you mind changing the font colour, please?

I edited it, try again, I was trying to post it properly quoted, it's fixed now.
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Emily Shackleton
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 4:23 am

This is why gamers need to agree on a spokesman to comunicate with the rest of the world, because we can't leave maniac six offenders to talk to women on their own without making us all look bad.
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Mariana
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 4:45 am

It's trash talk. It's SUPPOSED to offend people. Was it extreme trash talking? Yeah, but that's the point.

So is trash talk acceptable?
Sledging occurs in cricket but contraversial
Racist remarks can get a football player banned for a time
Generally it isn't acceptable in professional sports
If fighting games want to be seen as professional then the gamers will have to behave in a professional way
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Vicky Keeler
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 2:19 am

So is trash talk acceptable?
Sledging occurs in cricket but contraversial
Racist remarks can get a football player banned for a time
Generally it isn't acceptable in professional sports
If fighting games want to be seen as professional then the gamers will have to behave in a professional way
You can't compare actual athleticism with neckbeards standing on a stage button mashing or whatever it is they do at video game tournaments. Anyway, I don't condone trash talk. I'm more of the 'concentrate on your own prowess' person. I'm just saying it amazes me the moment a woman is involved or offended, the white knights come crawling out the woodworks.
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Isaac Saetern
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 10:47 pm

"I unfortunately used extreme examples in the heat of the moment and feel that my statements don't actually communicate how I feel. This is similar to what people say when they get into an argument with their girlfriend, and they say things that they deeply regret. I sincerely apologize if I have offended anyone."

He talks like that to his girlfriends?

"Those are jokes and if you were really a member of the fighting game community, you would know that. This is a community that's, you know, 15 or 20 years old, and the sixual harassment is part of a culture, and if you remove that from the fighting game community, it's not the fighting game community—it's StarCraft"...

What a [censored] [censored].

I intensely dislike punks like this guy.

One can be competitive/antagonistic without being disrespectful.
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Isabel Ruiz
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 9:25 pm

He talks like that to his girlfriends?



What a [censored] [censored].

I intensely dislike punks like this guy.

One can be competitive/antagonistic without being disrespectful.
Wait wat. sixual harrassment is part of a culture? Great generation of gamers we're raising. :rolleyes:
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Claire Jackson
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 9:21 am

It's annoying enough when normal male gamers react like they're seeing a once-in-a-lifetime event when they learn you're a female and playing a video game--female gamers are obviously very common--however, it is genuinely rare to see female players in fighting games. They do exist, myself included, but they are vastly outnumbered, and I'm not entirely sure why that is. I'm not sure if the behavior mentioned in the article is the norm, but I wouldn't be surprised.

You say "trash talk," I say "BS." It's at EVO and it's a fighting game tournament. For those who don't know, that's more high-brow than playing Call of Duty on XBL. Protocol is to be really polite and respectful to your opponents. Sure, trash talk happens all the time, but it's kept at a friendly and playful level. The type of behavior mentioned in the article is totally inappropriate.
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Eileen Collinson
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 10:58 pm

Gamers still aren't ready to be taken seriously. At an event this big which hopes to get bigger and bigger you need to check your temper. A little bit of trash talk is okay, as long as it isn't too serious. People need to realize this, the more people the more opinions. Meaning you should be cautious to set people off at any comment. It's a feedback loop.

Gamers want praise and more attention > get spectators > spectators expect them to behave a certain way > Gamers accuse people of censoring them > Audience doesn't give a crap, and expects better > Gamer wants more praise and attention.
ect.

If he doesn't want to be attending the biggest events he can go feel free to play in smaller tournaments. Then again no one will think he's the best. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIrhVo1WA78
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Emma
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 12:33 am

Welcome to why I don't play fighting games against others, and generally don't like nor do well in PvP environments. Aside from the unecessary trash talk, which is more likely to piss me off than anything, I find it unnatural of me to playing against other people.
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Krystal Wilson
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 7:08 am

You can trash talk effectively without saying sixist / racist / or homophobic things.
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Danel
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 10:38 pm

This is why gamers need to agree on a spokesman to comunicate with the rest of the world, because we can't leave maniac six offenders to talk to women on their own without making us all look bad.

It'll happen no matter where you go unfortunately and 1 bad incident will essentially encompass everything else in the community. It's just like good cops doing their job, but 1 bad cop being caught makes people think the whole department is corrupt.
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Neliel Kudoh
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 10:42 pm

He talks like that to his girlfriends?
He *has* girlfriends ? :blink: :P

*Shrug* I hear of more and more examples of people of authority - politicians and such - behaving even worse. So, utter lack of surprise. As above, so below.

In the end, it's all about treating other people, whoever they are, with respect. I view politeness as a hallmark of an actual advlt - I'm just crazy like that. Those kind of guys ? Jeez. Need to overcompensate much ? How utterly common, and therefore tiresome.

As to the initial question : yes, probably. That is, if you want gaming to be viewed as anything else than the childish pastime of overgrown teens.
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Heather Kush
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 2:07 am

It's trash talk. It's SUPPOSED to offend people. Was it extreme trash talking? Yeah, but that's the point.
Trash talk is from one competitor to another; this guy was just standing around, reading comments, and saying suggestive things to her.
Wait wat. sixual harrassment is part of a culture? Great generation of gamers we're raising. :rolleyes:
He's older than that. From the looks of him, he's at least in his twenties. Makes it all even more pitiful.
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Laura Ellaby
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 9:14 pm

I don't play that sort of game, but that's not what I would call "trash talk". Even in trash talk, there are lines you can cross.

If he said that sort of thing to women in a bar, he'd be getting a lot of free drinks... but they wouldn't be going down his throat. He'd also end up with a very sore cheek, at the least. If he said that sort of thing pretty much anywhere else, he'd be at risk of much worse.
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jesse villaneda
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 2:45 am

This is why gamers need to agree on a spokesman to comunicate with the rest of the world, because we can't leave maniac six offenders to talk to women on their own without making us all look bad.

where do i apply?
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R.I.p MOmmy
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 5:01 am

... wait..."Professional fighting game community"..."spectator sport".."trash talk"... BWA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!
What's next? My Little Pony races?
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jessica sonny
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 7:20 pm

Trash talking and sixism aside, I find it a really pathetic commentary on modern culture that people are seriously referring to video games as "spectator sports". It makes me feel like our culture is truly circling the drain.
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Casey
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 10:58 pm

Trash talking and sixism aside, I find it a really pathetic commentary on modern culture that people are seriously referring to video games as "spectator sports". It makes me feel like our culture is truly circling the drain.
Eh, people beating each other up is a (well, several) long standing spectator sport :shrug:. So is watching horses or dogs run around in a circle. Then there's the people who'll spend a day watching a couple of peeps hitting a ball back and forth.

Long story short, humans have always found entertainment in stupid things :P.
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Kirsty Collins
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 6:25 am

I care about this about as much as I care about all the preteen morons spouting curse words and racial slurs every other word whenever they play an online game. Like them, he's only succeeding in making himself look stupid.
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ZzZz
 
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Post » Sun May 13, 2012 10:20 pm

Long story short, humans have always found entertainment in stupid things :tongue:.

Haha, I can't argue with that, can I? :)
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naome duncan
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 3:36 am

"...the sixual harassment is part of the culture, and if you remove that from the fighting game community, it's not the fighting game community..."

What the actual [censored]. No. You change "fighting game" to any other type of community or culture and see how ridiculous that is. If a community is so strongly founded upon sixual harassment that without it it ceases to be and function as that same community, then get rid of the community altogether - or else just school the idiots that think that is a totally acceptable way to act.
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Jeremy Kenney
 
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Post » Mon May 14, 2012 3:31 am

The trash talk is one thing. Most people are used to that if they play any competitive online game, but sixist remarks are a legal issue and can be a federal offense.
if you remove that from the fighting game community, it's not the fighting game community—it'sStarCraft,"
That is crap. You can trash talk without resorting to sixist remarks. Honestly, when I read that quote, I wanted to punch the guy.
This stuff is no laughing matter, and taking sixism out will not make it Starcraft.

SO closed minded...
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Alkira rose Nankivell
 
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