Anyone find it laughable that every NPC can wear Power Armor from the start except the PC ?
Why is this necessary, to prevent you from wearing Power Armor at low levels? Why is that an issue, most power armor you find out there is in terrible condition anyway and you wont have the caps to get it in decent condition at low levels.
Some may consider it a reward for doing the long and tedious BoS quest-line? Its not really a notable reward since most (if not all) random wastewanders can wear Power armor.

The issue is not bothering to PROGRAM NPC's to have to meet requirements. Maybe a future patch will make them all drop it like they do faction armor[except of course Veronica].

Ima need screenshots of any random wastelander wearing power armour.

I'm pretty sure they can not.

Ignore me :whistling:

Well this was the case in FO3 and I doubt its different here. Try reverse pickpocketing.

In Fallout 3 there is a well known place where raiders are using looted APA2. The training is to prevent early use of Power Armor, yes (except in Fallout 3, where you got it from Operation Anchorage, that was easy to do at low levels), but it also makes common sense. It is a complicated peace of machinery, and as such requires training to use properly.

It's mainly done to piss off the same faction of fans who get chafed at not being able to max every skill and SPECIAL stat.

Except its not, its a powered suit of armor.

Also Fallout 3 implementation was ridiculous from a gameplay point of view because when you could actually WEAR the damn thing you had available the second tier armor (Enclave Power Armor) and so making the T-4x suits completely useless, It eliminated Tier 1 Power Armor since Tier 2 was available at entry level ... not to mention we could find the T-51b (after a rather long string of quests for the keys) just to then stuff it in a locker and wait until you could USE the darn thing, making the optimal quest reward to potential be pointless.

And of course, O:A were it seems they cannot even stick to their gameplay decisions by giving the perk for free.

And mind you that it was not as good as it used to be, certainly not the game ender that the Advanced Power Armor was, its no accident you can only get it is in Narravo and the MkII is also only available on the Oil Rig.

its aggravating yes, but you gotta admit, your saying this about an engine that cant even handle LADDERS

FO3 has it because you can get it pretty much right off the bat (its not worth it because there is no Damage Threshold). FO New Vegas has it because you don't need to do the BoS quest to get PA. Once you know where dead BoS are you can get the PA. Getting the Advanced PA is harder to get (if there is an easy way to get it I don't know it so don't spoil it for me). The Devs could have kept it because they got tired of hearing people saying FO2 is way to easy because you can get Advanced PA right off the bat. Its very hard to do, some say easy (I guess they can put up with running into massive gangs, floaters and wanamingos every step of the way to the PA location.) So its not ridiculous, if it saves having the complaints that its game breaking. What I would like is for there to the a third way to wear PA. NCR has PA wearing troops so it would be good if there was a way to get them to teach me. (If there is I don't know about it.)

As for NPC wearing PA even without training maybe that can be something patched later after they fix the other bugs people seem to be having.

Except they (Bethesda) gone to the trouble of marking it as power Armor that calls a function on the exe that prevents you from wearing it if you lack the perk, if you want to remove the perk requirement its easy ... go in the GECK and just uncheck the "is Power Armor" box from all of the Power Armors and nothing will break if you do so.

Heck there is even a dialog with Sarah Lyons in the GNR Plaza after the battle were she ACKNOWLEDGES that the Lone Wanderer is wearing Power Armor (making references to Reddin in the process) and she is only in the Plaza as long you DONT visit the Citadel.

The Power Armour training was Bethesda's solution to their dumb power armour being everywhere. They should have sticked with it being unlootable on death like all armour was on FO2. Think about it, you have a suit of armour that's been shot up and blown to bits and possibly damaged beyond use.

Agreed but think of the many complaints from people new to Fallout wanting to be able to loot it. What FO3 needed was another way to learn. Thats what OA was for. It also needs Damage Thershold to make PA worth having.

Then people new to Fallout 3 could see the number 3 and stop complaining ... and look, now you have people complaining EXACTLY about that.
BushMissionAcomplished.jpg

Or just let the players wear the damn thing, after all the game did not decided that I was too lame to use the Victory Rifle because I have not meet FATHER! yet and so lacked the "you are now cool" perk.

I not making it unlootable (which would make people new to Fallout rage like Styles said) then maybe you could make it, ehm, unrepairable and condition of 0 when you successfully kill the wearer? Or when you loot the body, the power armor is there, but when you click it, you get a pop-up saying something like "You can't loot this armor of the body, it is locked to its wearer" or something. I'd imagine it'd take quite a while getting the guy out of that tincan. Or it could have a defense mechanism that gives everyone who touches it a lil' zap once the wearer is dead? Hahaha.

There is also another flaw in that plan. Beth and New Vegas have BoS walking around with out helmets. So think of the rage "I shot the guys head off, the PA is fine yet I can't loot it :swear:" I am for making it so the average wasteland bumb can't just fix it. FO3 bugs me that anyone can fix such advanced stuff. FO New Vegas makes it very expensive to have someone fix it and not everyone can do it. FO New Vegas has DT so it takes alot ot make PA junk .

There's an easy solution to this. QUIT MAKING POWER ARMOUR POP UP SO EARLY IN THE GAME.

PA does not pop up early in New Vegas. If you know where it is then I guess it does pop up early and if there was no training you could go get it. Still the locations they are in will most likely kill a low level player but if you decide that you are going to run out and get that PA right of the bat then you only have yourself to blame for making the game to easy. Training is there to stop that from happening. I just wish there was a third way to learn. I don't like going to the BoS to learn. The second way takes even longer but the armour is better.

Generally the only reason unexperienced NPCs in New Vegas would wear power armor is reverse pickpocketing. Arcade and Veronica are able too for reasons that are obvious if you do their questline, NCR has Power Armored soldiers so it's probably part of Boone's elite training, and Raul has literally had centuries to find a person who can teach it to him. The only possible questionable one is Cass, but the point remains that 'every NPC can wear power armor' only if you force them to, and it's a much simpler solution than going through every single NPC and deciding who would functionally be able to use it and who wouldn't.

Not really, the salvaged power armor isn't "power armor" anymore. It doesn't require training, doesn't offer a strength bonus and has a lowered DT value. Its basically a heavier duty metal armor.
The simple truth is they never found it to be worth while to enforce power armor training on NPC's.

Requiring 3 dynamite sticks to kill a coyote is ridiculous, right Arzt?

I love how you need PA training to use PA.....except PA in the last two game is impractical (maybe not the Hellfire) at best.

its kind of annoying that any NPC can wear power armor but you cant until you get PA training.Your companions shouldnt be able to wear power armor until you get training and no other NPC should be able to except the BoS and the enclave remnants for obvious reasons.

^ that makes sense to me, makes it so it is assumed that you would be the one to teach them how to wear it

That would be a TERRIBLE idea. One of the thingas I like about Bethesda's games is that, for the most part, the avoid the dumb system most RPGs use where you magically can't loot armor from dead NPCs. If I see an NPC wearing a specific suit of character and I kill that NPC, THAN I WANT TO GET THAT ARMOR. and your logic fails when you consider that you can REPAIR BROKEN ARMOR WITH PARTS FROM OTHER ARMOR. If the power armor is full of holes, than it would just be damaged, which would mean that players could simply repair it with a different suit of power armor, there, it works again. What we need is a game where ANY armor is lootable, making MORE armor's unlootable would be HUGE step backwards. If a character has armor and I can kill that character, or that character can die for other means, THAN I EXPECT TO BE ABLE TO LOOT THAT ARMOR.

Sorry about that, but I just get so enraged whenever someone implies that the stupid decision to make some armors unlootable in Oblivion which carried over to Fallout 3 and even New Vegas is a GOOD thing.



It has absolutely nothing to do with it being number three, a terrible design decision is a bad design decision, even if it was in previous games. When Bethesda picked up Fallout, while I can't approve of all the decisions they made, I was glad that, for the most part, they decided to make every armor lootable from NPCs, and I would RESENT it if they decided to go back to how things were.

But really, the main reason power armor training was needed in Fallout 3 was that power armor was easy to get at low levels, if you did the main quest immediately, you'd get it quite soon in the game, and letting the player wear such a powerful armor early on would be rather bad for game balance... or it would if power armor was actually as powerful as it should have been... but that's a subject for another discussion. So Bethesda was faced with two choices, either check the power armor on the dead Brotherhood NPCs as unlootable, or make it so you can loot it, but need a special perk to actually wear it, and while a regretable decision, what they went with was MUCH better than the alternative. The problem here is that New Vegas avoids this problem, you don't get power armor early on, there are only a few places in the game with conveniently dead Brotherhood NPCs, and they're not always easy to go out of your way to find, and killing Brotherhood people isn't exactly easy, especially since unlike in Fallout 3, you don't see Brotherhood patrols all over the wasteland, chances are if you want to kill them, you have to do it in their bunker, where there are a lot of power-armor wearing, heavily armored people, who would surely attack you if you hit one of their friends. As such, the game really didn't NEED power armor training, and I'd say the perk is mostly a leftover from Fallout 3.

NPCs not needing power armor training is probably because the perk was created for reasons of game balance, not realism. But regardless, I just think of it this way, the only NPCs in the game who could be wearing power armor are your companions, and NPCs who are given it by default, unless you use something like reverse pickpocketing, and logic should tell you that this doesn't realisically represent anything logical in the universe. I mean, how do you "reverse pickpocket" a suit of armor? You can't just slip it into someone's pocket, and in any case, if you did that, people would wonder what you're doing routing around in their pockets, not use whatever item you "reverse pickpocketed". For NPCs who have it by default, we can probably assume those NPCs already have power armor training, especally since in New Vegas, the only NPCs who really seem to have power armor are in the Brotherhood, one might assume that since the NCR salvaged power armor has been stripped of most of the systems that seperate power armor from normal armor, or these have stopped functioning, judging from its lack of the appropriate bonuses for power armor. And in any case, if it doesn't require power armor training to be used by the player, it should logically follow that any NPC can wear it too. So we're left with companions, and I think I've heard that aside from Arcade and Veronica, the other ones already can't wear power armor, though I don't know this from personal experience as the only time I tried to give power armor to a companion who can actually wear armor was a suit of Brotherhood armor, so it may just have been the dumb mechanic that makes NPCs drop faction armor you try to give them as though it would burn their hands if they touched it simply because they're not members of the appropriate faction, and even if it isn't like that, if the player already HAS power armor training, one might justify companions wearing it witgh the same logic as MegaDS applies. The main problem is what happens when you don't have it yourself...

But I wouldn't say power armor training is necessarily an illogical concept, although I'd say it is unnecessary in a game where you're not going to be finding power armor in the second stage of the main quest. But the way it works should be closer to how some power armor enhancing mods make it, which is to say, you don't need power armor training to wear power armor, but wearing it without the proper training will give the player certain penalties that are not present if you have training. This seems to make a lot more sense to me, as power armor isn't going to magically come off as soon as you try to put it on just because you haven't been trained in using it, but one might assume that someone with no such training would not be able to move in power armor properly, and would therefore be rather clumsy in it. If the bonuses are strong enough, than it would still do its job by making power armor much less powerful until you can get the perk, rather than making it impossible to use. It would also bring the power armor training requirement more in line with the skill and strength requirements for weapons as well, since not being strong or skilled enough to handle a weapon doesn't mean you can't hold it at all in New Vegas, it just means you'll be less accurate with it, or if it's a melee weapon, hit slower with it, so why should not being able to properly handle power armor be different?

^ I like that idea too

because power armor training is learning how to properly "move" right? it makes sense that without training you would be slower and stuff... i think a penalty of 2 to agility and maybe some to strength would be ideal