Okay first of all I am new here, so let me say Hi, and I am glad to join in.

Now to the topic at hand, I just watched the trailer and it is amazing (though CGI) but I got a couple of concerns/requests.


First of all the request, Will there be a Third Person View in Dishonored ?!, kinda like Deus Ex Human Revolution where you could see Jensen when doing take downs or going to cover, I personally like TPV more than FPV, but when there is stealth game I can't just ignore it cause it FPC, and TBH Dishonored promises alot when it comes to stealth, I really wish there is a TPV system or at least option to.

((Not to mention the character with the mask looks really badass, it would be a waste not being able to see him at all during the game))


2nd thing the concern, Is the protagonist going to be a Silent Kind ?!, During the whole trailer he never talked or anything, I hope it is not like every FPS where the main character never speak or share what he thinks, he is only following other people, or doing whatever other people tell him to do without a thought or an opinion, This is also one of the greatest things about Dues Ex Human Revolution Jensen had an opinion all along, he talked, he had feelings, he was a real character, Silent Characters are really a turn off for me.



I hope if there is a Com.Dev that he would answer those questions/concerns, if not I think I will have to wait till E3 to know more about it and see some gameplay, but this game got high potential, I hope the points I mentioned get addressed.


But what about you guys/gals ?!, what do you think ?!.

I personally prefer first person, I think Arkane did both Dark Messiah and Arx Fatalis in first person. I personally hopw that I can see my feet in this game, I could in Dark Messiah at least.

And all we've seen is a trailer where he's killing people, there ain't really any time for talking.
I suppose he will talk from time to time, I hope he will.

well I don't mind certain FPS like Resistance, Killzone, Call of Cthulhu Dark Corners of the Earth, but when it comes to Stealth I don't know, I feel Stealth is kinda better with TPV ?!, but that's maybe cause I always played Splinter Cell, Tenchu, Hitman, and Syphon Filter, so maybe I am more into TPV.

As for the character, the very beginning could have had some talking, a simple "Who are you ?!" or "Why are you here ?!" would have helped, I wonder if Arkane will share more about the game before E3.

I prefer a silent protagonist. That way I can characterized him through actions and choices rather than listening to a script tell me who I'm supposed to be. With a voiced protagonist, the voice actor keeps stepping on my character's lines.

My preference for First- or Third-person view depends on the game, but generally I prefer FPV. That's how I played DX:HR (except the takedowns that couldn't be turned off and the cover system). But then, the first Deus Ex is my favorite game, so playing in third person just feels like watching a movie rather than playing in the DX world.

Different opinions I guess ?!, I can never relate with a silent character, I mean someone tells him "are you okay ?!" and nothing !!!, It breaks my immersion to the game, as for DE the choices made you define the character, .......etc

i prefer first person, even for stealth. more immersive.

Also I hate how melee combat was turned into 1 button QTE's for DX3.

To be honest I wouldn't mind the first person view if it was done in a similar fashion to that of Mirror's Edge. Because I, along with a lot of other people it seems, are sick of the boring static first person view you get in most games where you can't even look down at your own feet.

I prefer first-person, but I don't see why we can't have both. I support a 3rd person option.

I hate silent protagonists. I want interesting protagonist that voice opnions and emotions.

Same here.

To make 3rd person successful, they'd need to make a ton of design changes. Some FPSes used to showhorn 3rd person views in to cater to that crowd, and the results were always terrible. It's not just a matter of putting a camera mode that sits outside the character model.

This game was designed for 1st person by a 1st person-centric developer, the stealth was tuned for 1st person, and is aimed at a 1st person audience. It should stay that way. There are TONS of 3rd person games out there already in all kinds of genres. But we rarely get a 1st person game that isn't just an FPS.

It all depends on the game, take Gordon Freeman for example I'm glad he's a silent protagonist.
But if say, Sam Fisher had been a silent protagonist, it would have been bad.
It all depends on the character really, and as I've said since we follow a specific story, I bet that the Protagonist will talk.

well Deus Ex Human Revolution did it with no problems, and it was great, and actually combined what is great about FPV & TPV.

As already said, an option wouldn't hurt at all.

And Human Revolution was designed from the ground up with a 3rd person cover system. Entire systems and levels were built around that feature. It's not something that was or should be slapped into something that is already in deep development.

well we didn't see Dishonored gameplay at all till now right ?!, so maybe TPV is there, or maybe it can be added as an option, unless the game itself doesn't allow it (level design as you said), but since it is a stealth game there is a high change that it can enable TPV.

Maybe, though I suspect that some of the stuff you see in the trailer, might be gameplay footage, or that the gameplay will be similar.

I don't see Third-Person as a requirement for stealth. If anything, I think it detracts from the experience. Being able to see what's going on behind my character's back doesn't feel right in a scenario where I am being challenged to maintain a high degree of situational awareness. It makes things feel too artificial, too easy.

I agree, third person can often be used in order to look around corners and such, without having to stick your head out.

well indeed, I think everything done in the CGI trailer can be done in the game.

@http://www.gamesas.com/user/795342-seriousface/: As for TPV stealth, you can't say that Splinter Cell, Tenchu, Metal Gear Solid, Hitman, .......etc aren't challenging can you ?!, or distracting ?!, On Realistic difficulty in SC all you take is 3 bullets and you are dead, and instead of looking around, there is an old feature that hardcoe fans like "peeking" since you stick your head out, exposing yourself, instead of the God view we got in TPS games.

Also in those games I mentioned I never saw what happens behind my back, I see what happens in front of my view, also situational awareness is what stealth is all about after all, also TPV is preferred for stealth but yes not a requirement.

The difficulty in the games you mention is contrived to compensate for the fact that you can see several feet in all directions. That's where the previously mentioned level design comes in. A game designed for the First-Person perspective would be broken by the unrealistic field of view provided in Third-Person games.

I sincerely hope that Dishonored is solely First-Person. Stylistically, I feel Third-Person would make the game feel less professional, more arcadey. Generic, even. It would dispel a lot of the awe and disgust that it looks like the environments are meant to evoke. I see this as a game that's trying very hard to put you in the skin of an assassin in a dystopian world. It only makes sense that we should see with his eyes.

Splinter Cell and Metal Gear Solid both approach stealth like pre-created puzzles, not game systems that work broadly across different contexts. Human Revolution was a closer example of how third-person stealth might have worked in a game like this, but you'd still have to design loads of chest-high objects that you can snap to and fill your levels with them. Suddenly, you're compromising your design just to cater to an additional camera position. Also, that was designed to work exclusively in third person. You can usually squeak by in first-person if you want, but it's clearly not optimized for that.

Thief 3 tried to have it both ways with the stealth, and it ended up being compromised in both first and third person. Better to pick one and do it properly for this kind of game.

Well I know Dishonored wasn't build with TPV in mind (probably), yet the argument is kinda false, I mean Deus Ex Human Revolution didn't feel " less professional, more arcadey. Generic" Did it ?!, It also had Augmentation, and God view to see around the corner, yet it was an amazing stealth game, received warmly by critics and players alike, in Splinter Cell Conviction forum everyone praise it so high, it was simply amazing.

Also I don't think TPV or FPV is what puts you in the skin of a character, it is the character itself, or at least that is it to me, like in my OP, a silent character really kills a game for me, Medal of Honor 2010 would have been 10X better in terms of story if the character actually talked, the character need to respond, have a personality, react, so that one can feel like him, again my opinion, if Dishonored deliver that or not, remains to be seen.

((Also a good example of how you are in a character skin in FPS would be BioShock Infinite, there is a relationship between him and Elizabeth that make both character shines))




http://www.gamesas.com/user/697521-resonancecascade/: I will agree with you, yet we didn't see the indoor level design, what stealth system will Dishonor use ?!, Light & Shadow ?!, Cover Based ?!, Social ?!, Disguise ?!, when talking about indoor you are only left with 3 options either L&S or Cover or Disguise, and Disguise I think is out of the question ?!, so 2 remains, I will agree with you till I see the level design, if it is cover based, then I believe a TPV is very much possible.

It does indeed depend on the game. I like Alpha Protocol a lot, and it had a loquacious protagonist. And I've mentioned that Deus Ex is my favorite game. But Deus Ex also provides an example of what I mean. After hours of play during which I always was looking for all the books and datacubes I could find, I get to hear JC tell a bartender "I'm not big into books." ... okay then.

But I know I'm on the losing end of the trend of prolix protagonists. Companies will continue to employ voice actors to inhabit the character instead of me.

I always thought TPV takes away from the stealth experience by giving you a point of view that I would call cheating. I don't mind TPV in general, it has its uses in RPGs or games like Batman.
The switch between the 2 perspectives in DX3 was especially jarring for me and the canned auto-kill one-button QTEs were horrible imo. But it was still a good game. In DX3 it was even more obvious
to me that FPV is useless since Jensen gets all kinds of augmentations that make the additional cheat-view for the player obsolete. The Radar, see-through walls, tags.....to name a few.
Stealth is only tense when I have the feeling of constant danger, that exposing my body too much when peeking around a corner could be fatal, that I need to use other tools to scout out, that I have
to get creative at evesdropping.....third person? no problem, just adjust the camera so I can magically look around corners and into rooms, over obstacles.....nah.
I hope there will be a good implementation of first person, body awareness and many different movement options. Not only sprint/crouch.
Although I already almost given up on getting a lean in any new game, not enough buttons on those controllers.

well as I already said, there is challenge in TPV Stealth games, unless you don't consider SC, Hitman & MGS challenging, it is just a different kinda of challenge.

As for DE:HR it's all optional, I never used "see-through walls, tags", but I used invisibility TBH, and I didn't find it that powerful, especially since it consumes energy and I didn't have enough supplies all the time, over all DE:HR stealth system was solid IMO.

I respect your opinion, but with your logic every power we saw from Dishonored is going to dilute the experience and make the stealth easier, yet we didn't play the game to really say, and we don't know how the gameplay feel or how the enemies respond to us, but I got a feeling it will be a solid as DE:HR

well, enemy and trap design usually has a certain playstyle in mind. In DX3 it was built around the 3rd person view. You can stealth dx3 without using invisibility and that is a big plus for their level, patrol routes and alert system design.
it was very well made, don't get me wrong, I was here rather commenting on my vision for a "purist" stealth game. I should have pointed that out, sorry. We all know that Dishonored will only include stealth as an option and seems
to be designed with the typical demi-god powerphantasy philosophies in mind. But I trust in Arkane to balance it out (either on higher difficulties or through intelligent design) so I will not steam-roll the levels.
I like those kinds of fictions as well but having a "stealth or die" or maybe a "shoot max 2 guys and run/have a good plan" game is much more tense and engaging imo. First person always contributed to that since it feels like
a kind of restriction when compared to the third person panorama-vision. You can have much more "ooooo that was close" experiences when your vision is "limited" and you have to take leaps of faith into hostile territory.