I see nothing wrong with this. Hitler actually replaced the one you want with http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/06/Reichsadler_der_Deutsches_Reich_%281933%E2%80%931945%29.svg one, it is not related. The only people that will complain are the ignorant ones who automatically think of Nazi's when Germany is mentioned.

You know if people actually did a little more research on all this they would know the idiot Nazis stole the Swastika from a dig they were doing. It was actually some form of anglo saxon cross. This is what annoys me these days. People seem to not be able to look past our history with Hitler, so all whites are racist and evil. There have been so many other races in history that have enslaved people and did horrible things, example: The Egyptians of Africa enslaved thousands to build the pyramids. Yet no one treats them like the beast on a daily basis for centuries. But I guess the world needs us whites to be the boogie man...LOL No offense to any other race, but we get tired of not living it down. I have many other races and gays in our family and I have no problem with them.

Its just a symbol, like the lion is for England. Nothing Nazi about it.

Was it now? It's a Buddhist symbol. (Or something Indian, anyway.)

Indian religions generally, really. That swastika is different though, it looks more 'upright', compared to the Nazi one.

The arms go the other way as well, there is a picture somewhere earlier in the thread
I'm not sure why you quoted me, but that has all been covered already.

I don't think its worth the hassle personally. Its nice to know where you come from and to not fear the ignorance of others but the process of explaining what it means to others will become such a chore. Can't you find out what state of Germany your father's family is from and use some of its heraldry as a tattoo? For example Saxony, Bavaria, Brandenburg or Bremen. They each have a symbol similar to that heraldic eagle that won't be associated with National Socialism but will still have relevance to your family's history.

It was used by lots of cultures. Even native American iirc.

That's actually not the real reason. It existed and in some cases still exists today as an ancient germanic symbol, not only in germany, in the scandinavian states, too.

It was actually a decoration symbol for people of germanic tribes. The Nazi Party wanted to "revive" some of those old traditions, like the swastika or the SS-Symbol.

(the swastika symbol is/was used by a lot of cultures)

Nazism was an unsavoury philosophy and movement, but this kind of caricaturing is just wrong. The Nazis weren't about hate, they were about superiority. Where did you get this information? Some Hollywood action movie? WTH.


Thank you.

I'm not offended by it so it's fine by me

In Germany use of symbols and some other things used by the Nazis has been banned. Because of that neo-Nazis often use symbols associated with the 1st or 2nd Reich so some people might assume you're a neo-Nazi if you had a tattoo like that. Its up to you if you're more worried by people assuming you're a Nazi or annoyed by neo-Nazi misappropriation of your cultural heritage.

The Jainist swastika is the same as the Nazi one, just not tilted. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/46/Jain_Prateek_Chihna.jpg Same goes for the Hindu one (this one is used to evoke shakti according to wikipedia) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HinduSwastika.svg


Just feel like adding some examples to add some meat on the bone for future topic visitors . Here's a Greek helmet decorated with swastikas for instance. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/19/GreekHelmetSwastika_marked.jpg Etruscan decoration http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Etruscan_pendant_with_swastika_symbols_Bolsena_Italy_700_BCE_to_650_BCE.jpg and here's also a depiction on what a Samnite's shield might look like (not sure if they ever were decorated like that but I find it plausible) http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads8/002_Samnites.jpg

And on the OP, the first thing I think of when I see it is something like a symbol for the Bundeswehr, which is not bad at all if it is so (Edit: Was the modern German coat of arms http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_eagle so it makes sense if I've seen it on Bundeswehr equipment). But to be fair I would personally be careful when it comes to symbols related to Germany and/or that which might be linked to Nazism. As said before in the topic, there are many ignorant idiots around and you might end up meeting some hostile ones. The chances may be slim and it depends a lot on where you come from, but there are both political groups (like leftist anti-Fascist groups and the likes) and very subjective and ignorant people who might not be up for a little talking to straighten any misconceptions out.

Also neo-Nazis have tried to appropriate a lot of other symbols too.
Nordic runes, Celtic Cross, Cross of St George, Union Jack, Confederate flag that I can think of off the top of my head
I'm certainly not giving up wearing the Celtic Cross just because of a few idiots

Personally I'd see apartheid as a symbol of superiority and the holocaust as a symbol of hate. In it's early conception it wasn't explicitly hateful but it certainly became based on hate of other races and political movements.

Xalxitz is right though, as that makes more sense than an obscure hindu symbol.

We aren't talking about apartheid and the holocaust. We're talking about the swastika and other Nazi-related paraphernalia and symbols. There's a difference.

I was initially going to breeze passed this, but I have to correct the tangles.

Apartheid is a philosophy, as is Nazism. The Holocaust is an action plan/event/what-have-you. Two different things.

Apartheid also resulted in the death of many people, during events; yet somehow you don't equate apartheid with hate.

Nazism wasn't about hate and neither was apartheid.

The swastika represented the party, I was saying that it became a symbol of hate as opposed to a symbol of love. I may have worded it poorly.

Okay, that makes more sense, but it's still incorrect. "Hate" according to whom? According to the allies? According to the axis of "evil"? Refer again to Xalxitz's post. It wasn't about hate, for the Germans; it was about cultural pride, and it served as a prop for their sense of superiority.

I apologise for coming down really heavily on you, but it's not cool to caricaturise someone, some event or some person just because you disagree with them. Not in serious discussions, anyway. It leads to all sorts of fallacies and inaccuracies.

I'm not talking about the Germans or German culture, I'm talking about the Nazi party and their ideals or rather, Hitler himself. And although this is just my personal opinion, even though it might have been about cultural pride I'm sure it was used as apart of Goebells propogana machine rather than genuine cultural interest.

I'm not saying he was "evil" or that hate is evil I'm just saying that he made the swastika a symbol of hate by associating it with both the holocaust and the S.S./Gestapo.
The holocaust is almost inseperable to the Nazi Party, even though it's ideals may not explicitly support it or condone it, it is still apart of the history of the party, and I doubt that even Hitler could murder hundreds of people without hate as a fuel.

I should probably also say that I am referring to the Nazi party as a whole, Im not saying every individual subscribed to these views and supported the "hate" but it was apart of the party.

History may be written by the victors, but there are some events and people that deserved most of their press.

That makes more sense. There are still some things I could disagree with, but let's leave it at this so we don't get the OP's thread locked.

Id say it is a bad symbol, not because of its relation to Nazism but because it is rather hideous. If I were you, I would go for an eagle that looks more like the one in JagarTharns first link here, that one looks sweet. Still, even though it is not a Nazi symbol, lots of people will probably still think you have Nazi sympathies if you walk around with a tattoo like that. I would definitely take that into consideration before getting it.

Hehe, hero. This thread went about everywhere. I agree it gets annoying when people can't look beyond the last 70 years or so and then only selectively.

I support these posts:


Conclusion: that one's perfectly fine to anyone with half a brain, although you may think about getting one that incorporates the coat of arms where you're ancestors were specifically from. There are still people who feel pride over coming from a certain Land. Some are really nice. Others are not. Or perhaps your ancestors were from other German territories, what do I know... Anyway, if you think it looks good, why not.

why is everyone talking about the swatiska when the image they linked to is a black eagle holding a shield ?

They are both (apparently) associated with the nazi party. Although I have never seen this paticular eagle in that context.

this is the 1st time ive ever seen the black eagle tho i wasn't exactly looking for it when i took history in highschool it may of been present i jut never noticed