Fixing Lockpicking is banol.

Just remove the pause when you're lockpicking and bam - suddenly all these perks are worth it.

@ lvl 34 I have over 200 lockpicks, just from corpses alone. Why does almost every corpse in this game, good or bad have lockpicks...They have NO weight, its a little silly. Sometimes I just wanna use the console to open a door because its a waste of time to pick the locks.

I agree... PC modders can change these kinds of things if they want... but Bethesda should be focused on stability/bug fixes and added content... not rewriting game mechanics.

Improvements/Changes like this are more appropriate for subsequent releases rather than patches

How so? Everything in my immediate vicinity tends to be dead by the time I get to picking the locks in a dungeon or I'm stealthed and undetected. Taking the pause out of it really doesn't do all that much.

http://www.gamesas.com/topic/1289898-recommend-the-worst-character-build/. My point is simply that a perk is only useful if it's used. Sure, you don't need any Lockpick perks to pick a Master lock. You also don't need any combat perks to beat any enemy in the game. That doesn't make the perks useless. If I never use two-handed weapons or heavy armor does that mean these skill trees are useless? I don't find combat challenging unless I ramp up the difficulty and impose handicaps on myself but I don't complain that the combat perks make the game too easy. Perks are there to help you RP and build your character. None of them are essential to beating the game.

I never pick locks when there are enemies around so I'm not sure how this would help. Maybe I'm missing something.

I've hated the whole lockpick mini-game since Morrowind; haven't they ever heard of a hammer?

Or crowbar.

Both the Oblivion and Skyrim games have features that are accurate but too easy. In Oblivion, you are picking the individual pins and trying to lock each one into place. That's what they got right there. What they didn't do right is that you can't lock the pins up in any order you want. There is really one order to follow and it is different with every lock. The part they got right in Skyrim is turning the lock with a tensioner. That's all that they got right with that one.

They need a system that takes what they did right in each case and combine it. Here's how it should work.
You use directional keys to move the pick (used to lift up on individual tumblers) in and out. This is displayed just like in Oblivion.

The other side has a front on view of the lock with the tensioner in it. This is where a console would be a little better. The degree of tention is determined by how far you move the thumb stick to the side. On pc, this is done by moving the mouse horizonally.

How they tie together

You have to apply the correct amount of tension and then pick the correct pin. How do you know if you have the correct pin? The correct pin will move up and stay up. How do you know if you have the correct tension? If the pin you are trying for has too much tension, it won't move. If there is not enough tension, it won't stay up after being pushed up. So if you apply too much tension at the start, you will see that one or more pins won't move. One or more might move up and then fall while one pin will go up and stay. This means that one of the pins that didn't move was suppose to be pushed up before the one you did push up. So you have to back off the tension to get the ones that didn't move. Of course backing off the tension means that the one that is up will fall and you will have to come back to it when it is its turn.

It can get tricky when you get the first 3 correct in a 6 pin lock but then get the 5th one next by mistake. You'll know you are in this situation because you will have 4 pins up and locked, one pin won't move and the other will go up but fall back down. You will then have to back the tension off, which will cause the 5th one to fall, so you can get the 4th one. Back the tension off too far though and you risk causing the 3rd, 2nd and even 1st to fall depending on how far you back the tension off.

When I say 1st, 2nd, 3rd, I don't mean their placement within the lock but rather the order in which they need to be lifted which in most cases will not correspond to their placement order. Each lock is different, so the 1st pin that needs lifting in a lock might be the 3rd pin in from the opening or it might be the farthest pin in.

Difficulty comes in two forms. One is the number of pins which can range from 3 or 8. Small lock boxes and the like would have something like 3 to 5 pin locks, houses typically have 6 but some deadbolts can have 7 or even 8. The second is the sensitivity of the tension required. The difference in required tension between pins can be rather big and noticeable or it can be very fine where just a slight movement of the thumbstick or mouse can mean 2 pins falling instead of one in the case of backing off tension.

Lock picks don't break. Of course lock picks shouldn't be a dime a dozen either. You get a lock pick set under certain circumstances (joining the DB or TG). Of course, if a door is locked, someone somewhere should have a key. So if you wanted to steel something or kill someone in their home, the option should be there to pick their pocket when they are accessible and steal the key.

Or you could implement something so you can "role play" you're good at something, without actually requiring any actual skill from the player. As it should be in a "role playing" game. God knowns I can't cast lightning spells in real life, why should lock picking become harder for the player as well?

Having to do it yourself is more roleplay than having your character do it automatically based on some number in game.

You mean like everything else in the game? I mean how does clicking the mouse button relate to how effective I swing my sword. Come on man. The mini game is implemented to make it more of a challenge so you don't get bored of picking locks. It has nothing to do with actually relating skill to roleplaying and you know it.

You were the one that brought "roleplay" into this. As if to say that having the person do it instead of the character doing it for you automatically makes for less roleplay when really it would make for more roleplay in a roleplay game. So now you are trying to cop out of what you said earlier?

This makes more sense to me than anything else.

I mean, why can't a low level person sit there for an hour until they pick a lock? If someone wants to use 87 lockpicks to open a chest rather than put some points into lockpicking, so what?

87?

I picked a master lock with 12 picks and around 20 skill

It doesn't take that many to narrow it down.... and I've gotten lucky and found the area in 2-3 picks, and picked in 5 or less... this is with no perks of course.

and if you can enchant..... pfft. hell, my assassin gets +40% lockpicking just from random loot I've found (and the thieves guild gloves)... not that I ever bother to equip it unless it's a master lock.

Obviously, I exagerated.

But you get my point, which is, if someone wants to use up lockpicks rather than upgrade the skill, whats the big deal?

I would prefer better loot in higher lock-level chests, though - annoying to find a master lock, pick it, and get 17 gold and a common soul gem or something similar.

haha yah I've found a couple like that... MFW I openend it

Lockpicking skill is useless. IMO at least make them like Fallout where you require a certain level to unlock a certain lock difficulty.

let's just admit the entire lock-picking system is "broken" in this game. no open/lock spells, no need for perks or skill investment, no roleplaying value, no improvement upon past games, etc. it all adds up to an aspect of the game that is inferior and needless. and, they screwed it up big time. disappointing.

As it is now locks are a minor inconvenience that are ever so slightly more minor if you happen to have practiced your lockpicking. If they insist on going on like this they might as well take out locks entirely.

to be frank,

it doesn't bother me in the slightest.

Even my thiefy characters just means I don't have to dump perks into it.... so they can be more combat competent.

Broken? Why? Because with some patience, you can do it?

I doubt there can be ANY mini-game designed for lock-picking that players could not do if they spend some time and have enough lockpicks.

Really, I think the only way to "fix" what people think is broken would be to - as suggested by others - make it so that higher level locks can only be opened with a certain skill or perk level, no matter how often you try. However, I personally wouldn't like that. I see nothing wrong with a person spending the time and breaking a bunch of lockpicks in an attempt to open a chest which is "above their level".

And in a game where any character can learn spells, having an open lock spell would render lockpicking even more meaningless than it is now, IMO.

however, it does bother many others, myself included, for the reasons i stated. a roleplaying game with thieves who don't have to worry about their lockpick skill proves that it has been become useless. what it means is that your "thief" has been rendered less thief-like.

lockpicking does not need to be a "mini-game." that should be secondary to the skill needed within the game. not, real-time practice. i could care less about breaking lockpicks. a thief should need a minimum level of skill to even attempt certain locks. a mage should need a certain level of skill to use their open spell on certain locks. and, unless the container can be smashed a character with no lockpicking skill is out of luck.

at a minimum, they should have just kept it the same as past games. as it is currently, it should not have been implemented, at all.

I think you're overreacting....

I understand it's not to your wishes....

But as many people who are disenchanted with the new system there are that many more who either like it or don't care.

Would I enjoy it more if it were as you described? perhaps.... but I hardly think it's worthy of serious attention for Bethesda in Skyrim.... Modders can "fix" it however they like for one, and two this type of modification is better suited for a sequel... the next installment... rather than a patch

But how does a thief increase their skill? Surely by trying more challenging locks, no?

I can see opening harder locks a different spell - higher level for higher locks - but for lockpicking, even a thief should be trying to pick higher level locks. Would you really enjoy a thief who walks up to a lock, sees it's master, and says "oh, I'm just an apprentice, time to go"? I would find that annoying, personally.

Three thumbs-up to that comment!

Lockpicking went backwards in Oblivion, but it was more fun while it added to frustration. Poor interface crippled the unique setup. Then it went backwards again, in Skyrim. Taking the method from Morrowind, but nothing else from the game, related to lockpicking. Sad...

Treasure scale, per difficulty of the chest, is the one thing they never implemented, and should have. Who locks 10-gold and a Pot in a master-locked chest? Then again, who places uber-items in unlocked or easy-locked chests? Funny that they took the time to place and identify chests as, "This is master", "This is easy", but left the contents random, with no relevance to the difficulty.