I dont say this to start platform wars, but I think its because the Beth devs are limited by designing for the Xbox, whereas modders have a lot more power to play with when creating mods for the PC...

i'm an xbox player but i think that as well. as much as i love skyrim, i still think of how much better it would be if it didnt have the restrictions of consoles

Honestly, I don't think most people really have any idea just how hard it is to create good quality content for a game. It's not just about using a construction kit to place character A here, and Character B there, it's about creating a story that will have the widest possible appeal for the target market (i.e us), and then creating the content that will best bring said story to life. Even once the "physical" content and story is created, you still need to script it and create any new programming if its called for.

Overall it's not a easy task just to create something like Dawnguard, let alone test it enough to be able to release it and have it at-least playable by the majority of consumers. The modders actually have a far easier job to be perfectly honest, not to mention a LOT less pressure to be "perfect" and not screw up than those getting paid. I wonder just how many mod's their are for skyrim and what % of them are actually even remotely worth touching.... something to think about.

Not sure I get your point. Poor, poor Bethesda for having more resources and far more manpower working on an official DLC that's at best medium quality and will likely be dwarfed when some of the larger/high quality mods are finished and released. And feel free to check out the Nexus to see how many mods are out there. Yeah, a lot of them are garbage made for/by teenage fans of hentai, but the really high quality stuff makes what you find in vanilla Skyrim seem laughable.

Beta testing on one platform does not solve the problems for other platforms, in lame terms PC and PS3 owners are most likely going to see a beta test of dawnguard before its officially released.

No, but Nehrim could be sold as a retail-$60-copy for no problem at all. The project size is massive. There is a new (and vast) main questline, side quests, gigantic map (about 1.5~2 times bigger than Cyrodiil) with dozens of settlements, caves, dungeons, etc; An entirely new story and world. It is beyond a normal modification. it is a total conversion that could be easily sold as an entirely new game (if you get what I mean).

New Vegas Bounties I & II
Nehrim (Oblivion)
Beyond Boulder Dome (New Vegas, though admittedly the story is as poorly written as Skyrim)
Cube Experimental (FO3)
Mothership Zeta Crew (FO3, again story-quality needs work around the time that you ally Russia lolwtf)


I also know several smaller mods that are expert-quality (often times better quality than those listed above), but smaller in size. (the above are an excess of 5 hours, these would be 2-4 hours)

To me there isnt a MASSIVE amount of bugs; the only one I really mind is how serana as a companion reduces vampire lord drain health damage. Apart from that - no complaints,

What does the number of bugs it has have to do with how hard it was to make?

Little to none bugs in Dawnguard for me. Love the DLC.

I'm just glad Fallout has different writers than ES. I love the games for a while, but they always fall flat in the end. Where as Fallout always manages to svck me back in. Skyrim was good for say, 400 or so hours for me before I couldn't look at it anymore. Dawnguard helped, but as soon as I got the Vingalmo glitch I dropped it again. I don't see either series having much left to go on.

Anyway, on topic, from what I understand from the Beta testers was that none of the glitches were fixed. They reported them, but Bethesda didn't do squat about them. I promise you that if they do the Beta thing again far less people will actually report the bugs, since it doesn't seem doing so does any good.

It doesn't.

Fallout New Vegas does. Fallout 3 had Bethesda writing it, although to be fair, they basically just copied the basic premises of Fallout 1 and 2.
Since it's unlikely Obsidian, who made New Vegas, will be making FO4, you'll likely be seeing Bethesda writing for FO4.

Agreed. I played through it twice (once on DG and once on VL) no bugs at all. Not even a lock up in about ~40 hrs play-time. I think the beta-testers did a great job.

I'm the last person to say Skyrim's particularly well-written, but I think from a story standpoint TES has a lot of hinted potential in its lore someone can probably use.

As for Dawnguard, I haven't really experienced any bugs nor have I been really talking to people that have, but I thought DG was a meh effort for a DLC in general. Ignoring the mod community altogether, it sort of reminds me of CoD's overpriced DLCs rather than anything substantial.

It's glass armour, elven light armour and ebony armour retextured. Just like the retextured steel quiver for the dragon bone arrows and the retextured katana for Harkon's sword.

The reason there are bugs is that there was no patch for the bugs in the beta. There might never be one.

Haha, you shot his argument down good.

The Xbox customer were the beta testers.

But there was no patch...

I know that there were dozens of this threads about this topic but still I am interested in what do you think when Bethesda releases dawnguard finally will they be so polite to fix couple ok several things that people on this and other forums have found to spoil the dawnguard experience like vamps attacks(to improve them not remove) then why they have put frost giants in forgotten vale if they not respawn I want to be able to kill those cute five eyed abominations , marriable serena(like it or not many would welcome this feature i don't count among those who are thrilled about worrying if my sixy wife wil wake up in the middle of the night and feel thirsty and we have ran out of blood drinks ahmm you can figure out that going to the neighbour would take too long ) then improving fort dawnguard(perhaps adding a possibility to take with you 2 or 3 dawnguard agents and thus make something which is already possible throw mods available to all) and last but not the least fixing all the bugs....it can't be that hard to put these things via a patch and what looks like most resonable decison you could make when you have mad mob demanding blood and refusing to pay is to improve dlc at least and make it more worth all the trouble...but since we are talking about Bethesda.....

See, I'm just the opposite.

TES series keeps drawing me back to it time and again, and I'm never bored or find myself losing interest in it. I just divide my time between TES and Halo.

But despite who it is/is not made by, I just cannot get into the Fallout games. The whole "post-apocalyptic" theme just doesn't work for me.

If you don't like post-apo themes your answer isn't really relevant.
He was speaking about good writers, and TES needs them badly. Writing has always been a major drawback in this games until some skilled writers worked on New Vegas, even if you don't like the universe they wrote one of the best DLC i've ever played - Old World Blues -

And you know what, It doesnt cost as much as 20€, in fact it costs half Dawnguard price, and i haven't even laughed one time in this last one !

I've yet to play New Vegas, or even finish Fallout 3 (haven't even spoken to the doctor in Rivet City), but the character development in the scenes at the very start involving Liam Neeson is above and beyond nearly instance of writing in Skyrim (with the High Hrothgar scenes and Alduin's final scene being two standouts). That's not to say I didn't enjoy Skyrim, but Fallout 3 definitely knew how to put its best foot forward.

I remember playing the beginning of Fallout 3 and the writing was really good.

And everyone keeps comparing Skyrim's writing to New Vegas, and I thought Bethesda didn't write New Vegas, Obsidian did? Or am I wrong?

Yeah Obsidian did, and their writing was fantastic.

Although one could argue they were liberated by the fact that FONV was non-canon...