Yes isnt it?

And i think it kinda proves my concerns about the PC Version of Crysis 2 and the Cryengine 3. It wont be a whole "new" Crysis game and the Cryengine 3 isnt a whole new engine. It looks more than a spin off .. kinda like warhead in a urban setting.
So the focus for cryengine 3 was prior to extend the cryengine 2 with multiplatform capabillities ( according to the interview ) and not to create another "over the top " Pc engine that will blow your mind away like Cryengine 2 did in 2007. I dont blame Crytek for that... the kind of visuals they try to bring to consoles has been declared impossible before. But its that kind of fear that Crytek will never use the Pc capabillities to its full potential again that makes me nervous. And i dont speak of 3 more lightning effects implemented or higher FPS or better textures when i say use Pc capabillities.
I mean to use future technologies like tessalation and raytraycing (maxed out) which maybe even the next console generation will not be able to handle.
With Crytek as one of the last companies going to do no more Pc exclusives.. the grfx quality of pc gaming will stagnate until new console generations will appear.
A sad sad future.

So the focus for cryengine 3 was prior to extend the cryengine 2 with multiplatform capabillities ( according to the interview ) and not to create another "over the top " Pc engine that will blow your mind away like Cryengine 2 did in 2007.

That's the reason they don't want to make another new updated engine with better graphics. It would be 2007 all over again, where we STILL can't max the game.

This engine is simply an optimized version of CE2, so really, it's CE2 in disguise with better optimization and some new great features.

I don't expect them to go further and make a wholly new engine which we can't max out, even if it's future-proofed, it wouldn't be good business on their side, unless they were working with some serious development company.



Besides, we ask for better graphics, yet we have awesome graphics already.

To be honest, one of the reasons crysis was a (somewhat) of a flop having 'only' sold in the region of 2-3m copies by this point was that a lot of players couldn't play it. Sure, they could play it on low, but tell that to the average PC gamer, who at the time could max mw1. It was unfortunate timing for the game to release with modern warfare 1 and more unfortunate that the (then) current hardware just couldn't handle it to the degree that a lot of players wanted. The game still looked better than every other game on medium, but you know how the media is, it'd be no better on console if they had scalable graphics.

It'll be better for crytek to be a bit more conservative and make a game that takes advantage of new tech whilst not going OTT anyway. Did they need to lean on the consoles for support financially? of course not, but since they aren't pushing the graphics they can afford to spend time optimizing and making the story better (crysis had a great backbone for a story, but overall the execution was quite poor). So not only will they get to sell on the console, but they'll gain MORE pc sales than before. I guarentee that despite as much as they are marketing the xbox, the pc version of crysis 2 will outsell the consoles, since the mid range cards costing ￡150 will max it out at 40-60fps without a hitch. In terms of game continuation they may as well have not called it crysis, but ah well, who cares! The game will still be fun.

However to say that making pc games isn't financially viable is ludicrous and is the signs of a butthurt CEO. Your game didn't sell well because it didn't have the soul! It was technically amazing and should never be faulted for at the time (and still now) it is the bastion of what can really be done. But the story was lacking and the overall experience was only average. I love crysis for what it was, but it's still nowhere near the likes of mw1. You can't expect earth shattering sales when you've only truly buffed up one aspect of a game. Look at counterstrike, that game has probably outsold crysis 5 times over by now and it looks like crap by comparison!

Regardless, if crytek nail the CE3 and the actual GAME part of the GAME they'll see great PC sales. But i wouldn't worry about crytek having to push boundaries any more, many other companies seem more than interested in pushing them, just look at metro 2033, the upcoming bf3 and the vast amount of companies starting to use dx11. DX10 was a PC gap era, the lack of sales of vista and the cosoles nerfed pc development for those 3 years, now dx11 and windows 7 have seen huge uptake and the jaded console audience are seeing the light. PC gaming is gaining quite a bit of momentum and with services like steam really showing just how big the platform REALLY is (we're looking at a minimum of 100m pc gamers with at least twice the power of a console, 30m people are on steam alone!), it just goes to show that the reason why some games don't sell on PC isn't because of the playerbase (it is THE biggest gaming platform), it's because of the game.

However to say that making pc games isn't financially viable is ludicrous and is the signs of a butthurt CEO. Your game didn't sell well because it didn't have the soul! It was technically amazing and should never be faulted for at the time (and still now) it is the bastion of what can really be done. But the story was lacking and the overall experience was only average. I love crysis for what it was, but it's still nowhere near the likes of mw1. You can't expect earth shattering sales when you've only truly buffed up one aspect of a game. Look at counterstrike, that game has probably outsold crysis 5 times over by now and it looks like crap by comparison!

Do you know what it costs to make a game like Crysis 2? If it would be PC only it wouldn't be possible to develop the game. Have you checked recent PC-sales (lets say for the last 2 years)? Even very populair games like COD:MW only sold about a million copies on the PC. They would have to sell at least 10-12 million copies to make it financially possible to develop this game for PC only.

Though we should never forget, that Crytek made Crysis 1 for Pc's so the first wave deserves a better experience in the second. Pc gamers were the first, to forget about us is like saying Crysis had lost its edge.

Even very populair games like COD:MW only sold about a million copies on the PC. During a May 2009 conference call, Activision announced that the game has sold 13 million copies.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Call_of_Duty_4:_Modern_Warfare#Sales

That's the reason they don't want to make another new updated engine with better graphics. It would be 2007 all over again, where we STILL can't max the game.

This engine is simply an optimized version of CE2, so really, it's CE2 in disguise with better optimization and some new great features.

I don't expect them to go further and make a wholly new engine which we can't max out, even if it's future-proofed, it wouldn't be good business on their side, unless they were working with some serious development company.

Besides, we ask for better graphics, yet we have awesome graphics already.
Personally agree completely I've always thought that if i could get Crysis' graphic level but at a better performance level then i'd be one little happy camper.

i don't like campers

COD4 didn't sell 13 million copies on the PC... That was the total for all platforms at that time.

Call of Duty 4 is a target of piracy, which has resulted in multiple copies of the game being illegally distributed online. Robert Bowling, Community Manager at Infinity Ward stated, "We pulled some disturbing numbers this past week about the amount of PC players currently playing Multiplayer.... What wasn't fantastic was the percentage of those numbers who were playing on stolen copies of the game on stolen/cracked CD keys of pirated copies."
You know as well as I do, Crytek is not expecting to sell much PC copies of the game compared to the consoleversions.

i don't like campers

COD4 didn't sell 13 million copies on the PC... That was the total for all platforms at that time.

Call of Duty 4 is a target of piracy, which has resulted in multiple copies of the game being illegally distributed online. Robert Bowling, Community Manager at Infinity Ward stated, "We pulled some disturbing numbers this past week about the amount of PC players currently playing Multiplayer.... What wasn't fantastic was the percentage of those numbers who were playing on stolen copies of the game on stolen/cracked CD keys of pirated copies."
You know as well as I do, Crytek is not expecting to sell much PC copies of the game compared to the consoleversions.

I stated and debated on this site over that same issue, but as you" I mean @Tonyt2. It's still something dis-concerning to think about. And Btw console games can be pirated too. Not explaining that part any further..

I agree that consoleversions can be pirated too, but this problem is much less than on PC. Since Crysis2 will also be much more online focussed this problem won't be that big (where as a cracked version will immediately will lead to banning of your Xbox360 for example).
But my initial reaction was @the comfy chair who stated that is was nonsense to say that a PC game-only would be financially not viable. He is very wrong about that. It just isn't viable.

I agree that consoleversions can be pirated too, but this problem is much less than on PC. Since Crysis2 will also be much more online focussed this problem won't be that big (where as a cracked version will immediately will lead to banning of your Xbox360 for example).
But my initial reaction was @the comfy chair who stated that is was nonsense to say that a PC game-only would be financially not viable. He is very wrong about that. It just isn't viable.

I won't break another fellow gamers words, but this might explain why I'm concerned about this little topic.
Read: http://www.gamesas.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=4053

First thanks for all you guys posting your opinions in a serious and non insulting way!
Former discussions about the new engine and the game itself were never as rational and serious than right now!

So for Crysis 1:

I think that this game gave hardcoe Pc gamers and overclockers the opportunity to have something to compete with. Its like this is the game theyre waiting for!
Crysis 1 could have been advertised with: Bring it on!
It clearly was the last of its kind for this target audience.
So dont blame (me) and these people for being a bit offended by Crysis 2 and Cryengine 3. But: The Pc itself and the overclocking community are the ones who will push the the evolution of grfx in videogames. Because hardware techreasearch and its progress is always a PC FIRST thing. Without games like Crysis 1 only the benchmarks will show what is really possible, as Crytek left the pioneer-state to become a true capitalistic games company.

By the way if Crysis 1 and warhead/wars sold so bad... how could Crytek bring up another game? They must have been insolvent according to what ive heard about the C1 sales.

For Modern Warfare:
I know why Pc gamers are not really into that series.
Its too linear and too enacted. Shooters like these mayve work for console gamers.. but Pc gamers are just more demanding when it comes to shooters.
Dont get me wrong the story and scenery are interesting and good.
But the gameplay is old as hell. There is almost no creativity put into it. The same things over and over again. Its like a modern version of shooting gallery.

By the way if Crysis 1 and warhead/wars sold so bad... how could Crytek bring up another game? They must have been insolvent according to what ive heard about the C1 sales.

Because this is not the way it works. There are several forms of contracts between publishers and gamedevelopers.
Most of the time the publisher pays (a big part) of the development of a game (fixed fee) and the gamedeveloper will have to develop within that budget (or take the financial risk). Besides the fixed amount the developer will get a certain amount for every copy of the game sold.
Ofcourse this means that if the developer can't create the game within the budget or the gamesale is very weak they can lose a lot of money.

About MW: PC gamers are into the game, even now there are a lot of servers for COD4 which are crowded with pc gamers. However, a lot of them are illegal versions. A lot of servers are cracked so it is not a problem to find one if you want to play online with your illegal version. That will stay a problem with pc gamers.

@Tonyt2

Sry i ment the Single player of Modern Warfare.
Youre speakin about the Multiplayer part.
Im not that much of an multiplayer gamer..

I agree, that the SP is not that interesting. However, MP is for PC gamers interesting.

First thanks for all you guys posting your opinions in a serious and non insulting way!
Former discussions about the new engine and the game itself were never as rational and serious than right now!

So for Crysis 1:

I think that this game gave hardcoe Pc gamers and overclockers the opportunity to have something to compete with. Its like this is the game theyre waiting for!
Crysis 1 could have been advertised with: Bring it on!
It clearly was the last of its kind for this target audience.
So dont blame (me) and these people for being a bit offended by Crysis 2 and Cryengine 3. But: The Pc itself and the overclocking community are the ones who will push the the evolution of grfx in videogames. Because hardware techreasearch and its progress is always a PC FIRST thing. Without games like Crysis 1 only the benchmarks will show what is really possible, as Crytek left the pioneer-state to become a true capitalistic games company.

By the way if Crysis 1 and warhead/wars sold so bad... how could Crytek bring up another game? They must have been insolvent according to what ive heard about the C1 sales.

For Modern Warfare:
I know why Pc gamers are not really into that series.
Its too linear and too enacted. Shooters like these mayve work for console gamers.. but Pc gamers are just more demanding when it comes to shooters.
Dont get me wrong the story and scenery are interesting and good.
But the gameplay is old as hell. There is almost no creativity put into it. The same things over and over again. Its like a modern version of shooting gallery.

Crytek sales of Crysis and Crysis Warhead were good. They werent great or amazing, but they were good.

Crytek made well over $90,000,000 off of their Crysis sales. Not to mention they have made several more millions with contracts and licensing deals. That is plenty of money and they had plenty of an audience to develop a successful and proper sequel - they simply chose not to.

Crytek made well over $90,000,000 off of their Crysis sales. Not to mention they have made several more millions with contracts and licensing deals. That is plenty of money and they had plenty of an audience to develop a successful and proper sequel - they simply chose not to.
You must be kidding. Where did you get that information? Or do you just make a guess?

Crysis had sales of over one million: 1,000,000 X 60 = $60,000,000

Crysis Warhead had sales of over one million: 1,000,000 X 30 = $30,000,000

Least possible income since 2007: $90,000,000

Considering these are the lowest possible sales Crytek could have had with these two titles and that the Crytek has several licenses with other companies, this number could be higher due to licensing with them and they are even partnered with the military.

Im sure EA took quite a sum of those $90,000,000 made, but I wont factor that in since the public does not know how many %.

Crysis had sales of over one million: 1,000,000 X 60 = $60,000,000

Crysis Warhead had sales of over one million: 1,000,000 X 30 = $30,000,000

Least possible income since 2007: $90,000,000

Considering these are the lowest possible sales Crytek could have had with these two titles and that the Crytek has several licenses with other companies, this number could be higher due to licensing with them and they are even partnered with the military.

Im sure EA took quite a sum of those $90,000,000 made, but I wont factor that in since the public does not know how many %.

This is very accurate, @Talon95

Of course we'll just negate the ~700 employees wages for 5 years... let alone the other costs of running a development studio for over half a decade.

If we're just going to sit here and play armchair millionaire then this thread serves no purpose but if you guys wish to continue discussing whether you think Crysis 2 will/won't be a console 'port' then that's a much more interesting conversation

Something interesting to throw into the mix: http://www.kitguru.net/components/graphic-cards/faith/crysis-2-being-re-designed-for-gtx580-expect-delays/

If we're just going to sit here and play armchair millionaire then this thread serves no purpose but if you guys wish to continue discussing whether you think Crysis 2 will/won't be a console 'port' then that's a much more interesting conversation

/

I still wonder about that too.

Of course we'll just negate the ~700 employees wages for 5 years... let alone the other costs of running a development studio for over half a decade.

If we're just going to sit here and play armchair millionaire then this thread serves no purpose but if you guys wish to continue discussing whether you think Crysis 2 will/won't be a console 'port' then that's a much more interesting conversation

Something interesting to throw into the mix: http://www.kitguru.net/components/graphic-cards/faith/crysis-2-being-re-designed-for-gtx580-expect-delays/

Okay, then I will factor in employee costs too:

~600 employees making ~$80,000/yr for three years = $48,000,000 or 48 million dollars.

Then lets say EA skims off a 25% profit from their games: EA then pockets = $22 mil

48 mil + 22 mil = $70mil

Crytek then has a surplus of $20mil, subtract it from electric bills and whatnot is still a sizeable income, as im not including licenses with NCSoft's Aion that im sure is bringing in quite a bit of money each month.

So Crytek's extra income since 2007 = ~20mil.


Who says the PC isnt profitable?

its stupid to think redesigned for a 580 -.-
since crytek and nvidia are partners theyd get the info on new products long before consumers.its just a faster 480 why would crytek go omfg more performance lets add more graphics so everyone will still lag.crytek prob has a couple 480s on the rigs testing crysis2 anyways,so they could be saying only 4 480s will be able to max this game

PC games obviously aren't profitable, which is why steam shut down, blizzard went bankrupt, crytek collapsed after making crysis and that's why there aren't any PC exclusives.

I'm off to play civilization V

P.S. If modern warfare 2 was released at a reasonable price and didn't svck more balls than a ten pence hoker overall i'm sure it'd have actually sold more copies on PC. PC gamers are just generally far more pickier, and being more technically proficient they can pirate. Whereas a large number console gamers probably only have the technically ability to put a disc in the correct way.

However you look at it though, a PC game that had a terrible reception from the PC player base still sold over 1 million copies. The PC playerbase is huge (you're looking at 100m+ pc gamers), but far more diverse, the generic twitch shooter NRA playerbase is far more limited so when you look at the sales of those games you'll definitely get less PC players. Whereas games like battlefield bad company 2 which require a bit more thought and teamwork sell just as well on PC.

~600 employees making ~$80,000/yr for three years = $48,000,000 or 48 million dollars. 600 x 80,000 = 48,000,000 x 3 years = 144,000,000.

Irrespective of a slight 100 million dollar calculator blunder; this sort of discussion isn't productive. As i asked in the last post, please cut it there.

Simple answer on the topic question: no, because all 3 platforms are developped simultaniously, that is the big advantage of the CryEngine3. Every change is immediately visible on all 3 platforms. So non of the platforms is a port of the others.